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Chicken Bones
#100322
05/04/06 07:07 PM
05/04/06 07:07 PM
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I just took my babies for thier yearly check up, and happened to metion that my little girl had had seizures, but not for awhile. He told me what i already knew, CALCIUM, CALCIUM CALCIUM. Guess what he told me works the very best? Chicken bones. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> And it does make sense. In the wild they eat them for the calcium, so why not. I cooked up a couple drummies, put them in the cage, (meat and all)and everynight they eat more bones. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" /> Just wanted to share my new information. If anyone tries this, get back with me and let me know how it goes. Also, the lack of calcium will cause seizures
Last edited by hollyjean; 05/04/06 07:09 PM.
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Re: Chicken Bones
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#100323
05/04/06 07:40 PM
05/04/06 07:40 PM
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Although I haven't read anything about feeding gliders bones as a calcium source it does sound like it might work.
My concern is with feeding cooked bones. These are notorious for breaking into sharp pieces (the very reason we don't feed cooked chicken bones to dogs/cats). these shards can cut the mouth or damage internally. The only bones that I've ever been told that are safe are raw ones (chicken bones this is).
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Re: Chicken Bones
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#100325
05/04/06 07:46 PM
05/04/06 07:46 PM
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I wonder if the breast bone would be better. It's a different thickness and texture than a leg/thigh bone plus less greasy. Let's see what other people think about this but for now I'll be on the safe side and wait.
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Re: Chicken Bones
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#100326
05/04/06 07:49 PM
05/04/06 07:49 PM
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The breast bone has a ridge of cartilage.. the rubbery flexable part ~ is this what your asking about?
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Re: Chicken Bones
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#100327
05/04/06 07:50 PM
05/04/06 07:50 PM
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Sorry, i guess i could be more clear. Cook the chicken only until the meat is no longer pink. The bones will cook only a little. You do not want to give them uncooked chicken. Hope this is more clear. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
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Re: Chicken Bones
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#100329
05/04/06 08:56 PM
05/04/06 08:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,234 Tarpon Springs, FL
mattysmom
Glider Guardian
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Posts: 1,234
Tarpon Springs, FL
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Would chicken bones be the only ones we could offer? Beef and pork meats are not optimal but what about rib or steak bones? They don't seem to splinter and they do pack calcium too.
Moira & Matty & my zoo
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100330
05/04/06 09:21 PM
05/04/06 09:21 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,749 80 acres of paradise in KS
Dancing
Glideritis Anonymous
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80 acres of paradise in KS
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hummm. I think if it were me, I wouldn't offer the chicken bones, cooked or not. To much risk involved for me.
Pinky mice are a wonderful source of protien and calcium. Fuzzy mice (5-7 days old) are an even better source of calcium as the bones have developed more.
Yes, I know, it's grusome but is a food source that is more natural to them. Also, they can be frozen then thawed before feeding if you are squimish about feeding live prey.
620-704-9109 Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.
I could have missed the pain But I'd of had to miss the dance
The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100331
05/04/06 09:47 PM
05/04/06 09:47 PM
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Bones have to be thoroughly chewed to access the calcium in them, anyways. Given how picky gliders are, I'll hedge my bets that a calcium supplement is a far better and more measurable way of making sure they get this nutrient.
Not to mention the whole splintery-chicken-bone bit as mentioned before- I never give them to animals.
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100332
05/04/06 10:22 PM
05/04/06 10:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,800 St. Johns, Florida
Srlb
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Posts: 16,800
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If you are needing more calcium in your gliders diet may I ask what diet you are feeding them? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" />
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Re: Chicken Bones
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#100333
05/04/06 10:26 PM
05/04/06 10:26 PM
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If you're sticking to one of the accepted diets, you wouldn't be needing additional calcium. </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> Chicken bones. And it does make sense. In the wild they eat them for the calcium, so why not. I cooked up a couple drummies, put them in the cage, (meat and all)and everynight they eat more bones. <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> It's great that your gliders enjoy the bones, however, I just thought I'd point out that wild gliders don't get their dietary calcium from bones, but from botanical sources like Acacia gum. In fact, when it comes to consuming vertebrates they are largely opportunistic, but don't particularly specialize in consuming great portions of vertebrates... the scientific sources indicate that when preying on other animals, the gliders feed mainly on invertebrates... so in effect, wild gliders consume very little bone in comparison in the large scheme of things. Acacia gum is quite high in calcium, and it's one of their main calcium sources (if not their primary source) in the wild, not bones. Also, it has been said that Australian soil itself tends to be calcium-rich, which suggests that the flora (and the fauna that feed on the flora, e.g. insects, etc) also may be rather calcium-rich, and that includes eucalyptus, acacia, and banksia. ...So again, bones play a very little role in the diet of wild gliders. Actually, I have found that if I feed my gliders rat pups that have a hardened and fully calcified skeleton, the gliders will often discard the bones and eat around them. Mikey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" />
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100334
05/05/06 02:34 PM
05/05/06 02:34 PM
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Teresa. I take everything you have to say to heart, always, and now i am a bit concerned with what my vet is telling me. I too questioned the bones when he told me, and he said it would be alright. Now i am hesitent to offer it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" /> As always, i am going with what you tell me and not do it. Thanks for the eye opening. (can't give live babies)so i will just trust the calcium i give them with the staple is enough.
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Re: Chicken Bones
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#100335
05/05/06 07:48 PM
05/05/06 07:48 PM
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Wow Mikey, you really use big words!!
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100336
05/05/06 08:26 PM
05/05/06 08:26 PM
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Hello! I don't know if I understood correctly, but baby mice are a source of calcium <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Seriously <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />
I've always been quite reticent in feeding live preys to gliders. Maybe I unconsciously thought it would make them more agressive or have them jump on everything that moves... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shakehead.gif" alt="" />
I know it's not true, however! So live preys are a source of calcium!?! (that was my question, actually....!)
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100337
05/05/06 09:29 PM
05/05/06 09:29 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,749 80 acres of paradise in KS
Dancing
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80 acres of paradise in KS
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hollyjean, Like Peggy asked, what diet are you feeding your gliders? What staple are you using and with which supliments. If you glider is already exibiting calcium deficencies, we don't want to maintain her current levels but safely ensure her intake levels are where they need to be. Also, some gliders just need more then others. I would usually not suggest to anyone to ignore what their vet recommends. I am not a vet. I have not seen your glider nor run tests on your glider nor have the technical and educational background to diagnose anything with gliders beyond my own personal experience and observations. Has your vet run blood work and done xrays to determine if there IS a calcium deficency? If your vet is concerned about this being the problem, then the proper tests need to be done and IF the glider is calcium deficent, then oral calcium can be given to bring her calcium levels up. Again, it does go back to proper diet and knowing what you are feeding your glider will help us help you.
620-704-9109 Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.
I could have missed the pain But I'd of had to miss the dance
The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100338
05/05/06 09:42 PM
05/05/06 09:42 PM
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AnnLise - yes live prey works as a good protein and calcium source (some breeders suppliment their pregnant mothers with them)... I don't do it personally so I cannot say whether or not it changes their aggressiveness... others individuals on this board will have a better idea about that. Some also freeze them (the pinkies, to kill them) first so that it's not living prey but still nutritious
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Re: Chicken Bones
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#100339
05/05/06 10:17 PM
05/05/06 10:17 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,899 Jacksonville, FL
Xfilefan
Serious Glideritis
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Serious Glideritis
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Posts: 8,899
Jacksonville, FL
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First..Dancing has given EXCELLENT advice, so I can't add much there...I also would not feed poultry bones because of the risk of splintering and possibly puncturing mouth, throat, stomach or intestine...I never fed them to my cats or dogs for that reason. Second..although mouse bones are not prone to splintering, so do not pose the danger bird bones do--and the reason for this is that bird bones are hollow, to allow for the lightness required for flight--and can be eaten, the meat itself is very high in phosphorus. Even fuzzies, which are higher in calcium than pinkies due to their more solid bones, are a phosphorus heavy food-tho the ratio is better in fuzzies than pinkies-there is still a calcium deficit (or more phosphorus than calcium), when you feed mice. That needs to be taken into consideration, unless all you are feeding is the bones. Please post the answers to Dancing's questions-it will help us to know how to direct you. Though we are not vets, many of us are experienced with calcium deficiency. I had one it took over 3 weeks to forcefeed back from the point of death with HLP (Hind Leg paralysis, or metabolic bone disease-i.e., severe calcium deficiency)-but we need your input to know what has been done, what is consumed in the diet, etc., to know what part of our experience to responsibly offer and best help your little one.
Jen/Colin Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed Sinbad, Gabby, Baby, and Alley
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100340
05/07/06 08:53 PM
05/07/06 08:53 PM
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Teresa I have them on Prisillas diet. Since i started with the Calcium OJ and extra yougurt, my little girl has not had any problems. I am now very concerned about what the vet says. He even told me that he had some Deer Antlars he could give me for them to chew on. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> Do you think i should look for another vet? There are not too many here in San Antonio, but there are others. Also, should they be eating very much chicken? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Thanks very much
Last edited by hollyjean; 05/07/06 08:56 PM.
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100341
05/07/06 09:35 PM
05/07/06 09:35 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,899 Jacksonville, FL
Xfilefan
Serious Glideritis
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Serious Glideritis
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,899
Jacksonville, FL
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Chicken is a high phosphorus food, the ratio is about 1:730, CA:PH. As recommended by the diet should be fine-but I wouldn't feed a lot extra. I am curious what criteria your vet used to determine she needed extra? On any of the GC diets, if they are eating them and they are prepared as directed, unless an infection or something is present that is pulling calcium from the body-the glider should not be calcium deficient. Definitive signs of deficiency include most commonly, but are not limited to: loss of use of back legs, or general uncoordination/weakness in the limbs, uncontrolled shaking, or an Xray showing a weakening or pitting of the bones.
Jen/Colin Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed Sinbad, Gabby, Baby, and Alley
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100342
05/07/06 10:04 PM
05/07/06 10:04 PM
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,830 USA
SugarBlossoms
Serious Glideritis
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Serious Glideritis
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Posts: 5,830
USA
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I haven't read this entire thread yet but am wondering why not the Acacia Gum, yogurt or just plain adding extra calcium to the diet? These are things I've always done and have healthy gliders. I'm sorry, but there is no way I would consider feeding chicken bones to my gliders (or any animal for that matter) after seeing what kind of damage they can do to internal organs. Cats have very strong guts and can still die from splintered chicken and pork bones. Gliders when eating chew and or suck the juice out of food and spit out the "hard stuff". HOW could they EAT bones??? They have such tiny throats that they can't even eat skins. I may be silly on this one, but I've never heard of wild chickens. I'm sure it's because I live in the USA and am spoiled by our farms and USDA. LOL But how would a glider go about finding, killing and eating a wild chicken in Australia or Indonesia? LOL???
Last edited by SugarBlossoms; 05/07/06 10:07 PM.
Keeper of Handprints on my Heart, You left your Footprints on my soul. My precious loves that left to quickly, Peanut, Katie Isabella, Kiwi, Bonnie and Monroe.
Spread your wings and glide free of pain, Until the day I see you again.
God speed my precious angels. I love you. Mama.
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100343
05/07/06 10:20 PM
05/07/06 10:20 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,899 Jacksonville, FL
Xfilefan
Serious Glideritis
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Serious Glideritis
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Posts: 8,899
Jacksonville, FL
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Sugarblossoms..not chickens necessarily, but they have been known to eat baby chicks of small birds in the wild (not sure if that would include their eggs)...think a sparrow or similar.
Jen/Colin Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed Sinbad, Gabby, Baby, and Alley
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100344
05/07/06 10:37 PM
05/07/06 10:37 PM
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,830 USA
SugarBlossoms
Serious Glideritis
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Serious Glideritis
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Posts: 5,830
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True but I'm assuming she means chicken bones from chicken we buy at the store?
Keeper of Handprints on my Heart, You left your Footprints on my soul. My precious loves that left to quickly, Peanut, Katie Isabella, Kiwi, Bonnie and Monroe.
Spread your wings and glide free of pain, Until the day I see you again.
God speed my precious angels. I love you. Mama.
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100345
05/07/06 10:53 PM
05/07/06 10:53 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,899 Jacksonville, FL
Xfilefan
Serious Glideritis
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Serious Glideritis
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,899
Jacksonville, FL
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</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr /> I may be silly on this one, but I've never heard of wild chickens. I'm sure it's because I live in the USA and am spoiled by our farms and USDA. LOL But how would a glider go about finding, killing and eating a wild chicken in Australia or Indonesia? LOL??? <hr /></blockquote><font class="post"> This is what I was replying to- vet is telling her to feed store bought chicken bones, I was just saying them eating bird bones is not unheard of, but cooked chicken and from a wild baby bird are entirely different things. Tho I can understand where he got the idea (they will also eat bones and all in a pinky mouse)...I don't think the directions she got made much sense.
Jen/Colin Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed Sinbad, Gabby, Baby, and Alley
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Re: Chicken Bones
[Re: ]
#100346
05/09/06 01:06 AM
05/09/06 01:06 AM
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,830 USA
SugarBlossoms
Serious Glideritis
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Serious Glideritis
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,830
USA
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I agree with you 100 Percent!
Keeper of Handprints on my Heart, You left your Footprints on my soul. My precious loves that left to quickly, Peanut, Katie Isabella, Kiwi, Bonnie and Monroe.
Spread your wings and glide free of pain, Until the day I see you again.
God speed my precious angels. I love you. Mama.
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