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Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: jacknsally] #1010367
09/28/10 10:39 AM
09/28/10 10:39 AM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Originally Posted By: jacknsally
what's the story & the details with the other pair producing 3 joeys with this disorder? I saw your post about why Kitty & Smidgin did but why would the other set produce 3 joeys after having just 1 with this?

You have 2 rejected joeys at the same time, who then later produce multiple joeys with a disorder. Could it be related to rejected joeys breeding? There have been other hand raised joeys that have bred with no issues but you just doubled the possibility of an issue if there could be one with rejected joeys breeding & then the inbreeding just escalated the situation.

So how/why was the other pair allowed to produce 3 joeys with this issue?


The first pair was not mine. The only pair I've ever had produce joeys with the wiggle syndrome is Smidgin and Kitty. The first pair belonged to a breeder a while back. She was sold that pair for breeding. When she got the first joey like that she was told by the breeder that it was a mold issue. So she tried breeding them again(in a completely different location) and when they produced the wiggle baby again she separated them and concluded it was inbreeding and not mold. I believe she then re-paired the female with a different male and they went on to produce normal joeys.

Here's the old thread when Beth first posted about that pairing's joeys 4 and a half years ago: http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/86607/1

To answer your other question, Kitty was not rejected, only Smidgin was. Kitty had to be pulled because her mom got a mating wound and I was worried Kitty would chew on it. I tried letting her mom nurse her while I supervised, but she ended up getting mastitis because she wasn't nursing enough(since joeys would normal be nursing pretty much all day). So I had to pull her completely and handraise her along with Smidgin. Smidgin, on the other hand, we aren't completely sure of the reasons for him being rejected. His mom had been in a quad that didn't work out. She was also a first-time mother. So between her being separated from her mate AND being a first-time mom, I have no way of knowing if there was something wrong with Smidgin or if she simply couldn't handle it all and had to push Smidgin away to give her other baby a better chance. Smidgin's sister was fine and Smidgin himself has grown up to be a normal-sized, healthy glider.

That being said, I'm not sure if Smidgin being rejected played a part in this or not.


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1010371
09/28/10 10:59 AM
09/28/10 10:59 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,839
roseville, mi
H
hwh4ev Offline
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hwh4ev  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,839
roseville, mi
there seems to be some statements made that this subject was not brought up correctly.
sometime partial information is all you have and should be made public such as this very subject.
alot of us were not aware of this wiggly syndrome and can now make better decisions and ask questions that we didnt know to ask especially for the breeders.

i for one applaud alden for starting this subject. thank you.

regards,
nancy in fl/detroit


regards,
nancy in roseville (formerly in detroit)
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1010393
09/28/10 12:39 PM
09/28/10 12:39 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,402
Michigan
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gliderma Offline
Serious Glideritis
gliderma  Offline
Serious Glideritis
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,402
Michigan
I would have to agree with Nancy. I have never heard of this condition and am glad to know about it now. I have had a few rejected joey's but never anything like this! I am glad to know about it & would hope that people would go public with anything that could be detrimental. We are all here for the good of the gliders, right?


Lynn Martel
616-272-4374
989-400-5686
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1010407
09/28/10 01:16 PM
09/28/10 01:16 PM

M
Megs
Unregistered
Megs
Unregistered
M



Everybody SHOULD be here for the good of the gliders.

Stepping into the glider world is something I question my state of mind on.

It seems every post with detrimental information turns into a drama thread, and sometimes it seems that people merely want to prove how much better of an owner they are.

I'm glad that the rock throwing is done and this has turned into the conversation it was meant for.

I, too, commend Alden for posting this. Let it be a reminder, NOTHING MORE, of how very important it is to KNOW your gliders lineage and SAFELY pair your gliders if you intend to breed.

Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ] #1010455
09/28/10 03:18 PM
09/28/10 03:18 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,789
St. Johns, Florida
Srlb Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
Srlb  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,789
St. Johns, Florida
Nicole you are over your PM limit and I am trying to reach you. If you could contact me I would much appreciate it. I have already sent a message to Beth and have spoken to Adri.


Peggy
Critter Love
Critter Love® Diet Center

If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.

Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1010486
09/28/10 04:19 PM
09/28/10 04:19 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Peggy, you can email me at Guerita135@yahoo.com .


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: Guerita135] #1010491
09/28/10 04:35 PM
09/28/10 04:35 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,789
St. Johns, Florida
Srlb Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
Srlb  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,789
St. Johns, Florida
I did thumb


Peggy
Critter Love
Critter Love® Diet Center

If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.

Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1010818
09/29/10 12:29 PM
09/29/10 12:29 PM

S
SuggieAddict
Unregistered
SuggieAddict
Unregistered
S



I recently took on some foster kittens (rescued) with the wobble sydrome ( Cerebellar Hypoplasia ) looks like the same thing to me. They actually get alot better as they get older but it is still considered a handi cap/special needs.

Animals with this sydrome seem to be very happy, Almost kinda "slap happy" = )

But again, Not something we want to see popping up everywhere.

Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1010824
09/29/10 12:50 PM
09/29/10 12:50 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Nevermind. I'll just keep my research to myself.

Last edited by Guerita135; 09/30/10 02:15 PM.

~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1010826
09/29/10 12:52 PM
09/29/10 12:52 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Nevermind. I'll just keep my research to myself.

Last edited by Guerita135; 09/30/10 02:15 PM.

~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1010924
09/29/10 04:06 PM
09/29/10 04:06 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 548
North AL
zookeeper18 Offline
Glider Lover
zookeeper18  Offline
Glider Lover

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 548
North AL
I had no idea what was going on! I thought I was thorough in studying my lineages. It's a shame this was covered up. Thanks for opening this thread. Most of my joeys have pet homes. Only 2 owners are breeding. One of them informed me about this post. Going to inform the other of this thread. Also, going to contact others to make sure and reinterate that lineages are important if they decide to breed. Hopefully, I can get everyone to at least read this thread. You can't watch that video and act irresponsibly. Sane people at least!


Theresa
Committed wife! (As in needs to be committed!)
Mom to 3 skin kids, 3 dogs,a cat, and 5 sugar gliders! Adam :wfb: , Apple :wfb: , Pita :wfb: , Zita :wfb: and Bobo :grey:

Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: zookeeper18] #1011081
09/29/10 09:31 PM
09/29/10 09:31 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,789
St. Johns, Florida
Srlb Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
Srlb  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,789
St. Johns, Florida
Quote:
It's a shame this was covered up.


Once again...this has NEVER been *covered* up by ANYONE....


Peggy
Critter Love
Critter Love® Diet Center

If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.

Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: Guerita135] #1011087
09/29/10 09:38 PM
09/29/10 09:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,093
Port Aransas, TX
Pockets Offline
Glider Slave
Pockets  Offline
Glider Slave

Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,093
Port Aransas, TX

Last edited by Pockets; 09/29/10 09:39 PM.

:grey: We will be known forever by the tracks we leave :grey:
http://www.marsupialsociety.org.au/
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011088
09/29/10 09:39 PM
09/29/10 09:39 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 6,576
Kilgore, Texas
Cora Offline
Serious Glideritis
Cora  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 6,576
Kilgore, Texas
Guerita, you are over your PM limit and I would like to chat with you.


USDA Licensed Breeder
903-808-1142

http://www.freewebs.com/angelfish_37/index.htm
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011287
09/30/10 07:33 AM
09/30/10 07:33 AM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,254
Kansas
queenduck Offline
Serious Glideritis
queenduck  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,254
Kansas
Nicole, just checking... has your vet given you a diagnosis of cerebellar abiotrophy, have these new joeys seen a vet? How was this dx made?

I think it is dangerous to dx a glider yourself unles you are also a doctor of veterinary medicine. Others out here may see your term and choose to believe that is exactly what it is and then not do any further research.

Just wondering where you got that information. If you did get that information from a vet can you please explain to us what they said exactly. How they came to that diagnosis. What testing was done. And what is the progression and the prognosis of the disease.

Thanks.


Alicia aka Queenduck, Bentley's Nana

We need role models who are going to break the mold ~ Carly Simon
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011351
09/30/10 12:23 PM
09/30/10 12:23 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,747
80 acres of paradise in KS
Dancing Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
Dancing  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,747
80 acres of paradise in KS
Quote:
However, I've been doing some research and I believe(99.9% sure) that what our gliders are showing is Cerebellar Abiotrophy, which has symptoms somewhat similar to Cerebellar Hypoplasia, but CA is a genetic neurological disease.


620-704-9109
Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.

I could have missed the pain
But I'd of had to miss the dance


The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011361
09/30/10 12:57 PM
09/30/10 12:57 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Nevermind. I'll just keep my research to myself.

Last edited by Guerita135; 09/30/10 02:15 PM.

~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: Guerita135] #1011370
09/30/10 01:18 PM
09/30/10 01:18 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,254
Kansas
queenduck Offline
Serious Glideritis
queenduck  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,254
Kansas
Quote:
it's safe to assume



No way. I've learned the hard way... it's never safe to assume.

All I am saying is if you haven't had it diagnosed by a vet, or have seen a vet, then maybe your links should not be listed as such, they are misleading. It is your assumption that your gliders indeed have CA, but then we all know in the past when we assume without the advice of a vet. we can often be wrong.

I understood that Dr. Tristan felt the first thing to rule out was toxoplasmosis, not that he was diagnosing them or even suspecting them of having toxoplasmosis. In medicine you learn to r/o first before going onto more expensive and invasive proceedures.

When you have flu like symptoms and a headache your doctor doesn't immediately test you for spinal menigitis (but you could have it) they test and treat you for the flu first... then move onto more expensive and invasive procedures.

Have you contacted Dr. Tristan per email and disscussed your recent findings with him? Possibly it is something he had not thought of and might find interesting. He doesn't often read here on GC unles dirrected to a particular post.

Quote:
Conclusion: it's genetic.



You do not have the knowledge or education to conclude that. I suspect it is also genetic OR due to improper breeding by the breeder (inbreeding) but I am also not properly educated, I can not make such a conclusion.



Alicia aka Queenduck, Bentley's Nana

We need role models who are going to break the mold ~ Carly Simon
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: Guerita135] #1011374
09/30/10 01:40 PM
09/30/10 01:40 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,789
St. Johns, Florida
Srlb Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
Srlb  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,789
St. Johns, Florida
Quote:
I had Peggy contact me saying that Dr. Tristan believes that the affected gliders have Toxoplasmosis. Which is impossible considering that the gliders involved don't show any signs of the otherhaving any health issues/symptoms that go along with toxoplasmosis. Also, marsupials have shown to be rather sensitive to Toxoplasmosis and it's usually fatal to them.


Nicole, I have tried to stay out of this...except to help but if you are going to state things, please state them correctly...

I sent Dr.Tristan the videos and the lineages on the gliders...

From the materials and research done that Dr. Tristan has access to (that we, you know the non vets) he stated he would recommend to have blood work done and sent to Cornell University to rule out Toxoplasmosis since marsupials are prone to it and he had read an article about a whole colony that had this and the symptoms were similar. He said he would suggest to test for that first to rule it out before going to the next step. And as I had already told you the colony of gliders are still alive.

You told me to ask him if it could be CA and he said it could be a number of things...but yes the possibility was there. You would have to get either a cat scan done or wait until the glider dies and have a Necropsy/Histopath done.

I offered the same deal to you, Adri and Beth...if you are willing to get the blood work done *I* would try to find a way to raise the money for the project so none of you had any out of pocket expense.

Because of what you read on the internet you had concluded that Dr.T was wrong and you were right...

After all, why need a vet when you have the internet....right?

I relayed to you my frustration with how you came up with this conclusion and you did indeed tell me you were trying to contact the person stated above.

With CA you also have stiff legs...your gliders do not have that.

Quote:
Conclusion: it's genetic


Sorry you do not know this to be fact proven... that would be like someone diagnosing someone with CP and saying that is genetic...until you have documented proof on these gliders, you should not make statements such as this.

Last edited by DCMuffin; 09/30/10 02:13 PM. Reason: edited text

Peggy
Critter Love
Critter Love® Diet Center

If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.

Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011378
09/30/10 01:46 PM
09/30/10 01:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
ValkyrieMome Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous
ValkyrieMome  Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
Originally Posted By: Srlb
Quote:
It's a shame this was covered up.

Once again...this has NEVER been *covered* up by ANYONE....

When someone decides it is in the general public's best interests NOT to release information, I call that a "cover up."

I'm very glad this discussion is carrying on in the manner in which it is. It seems as if people are now discussing things logically - pros and cons, possibilities, and why those make sense or don't.

That conversation is important, as is vet study, and hopefully and eventual diagnosis.

Last edited by ValkyrieMome; 09/30/10 02:16 PM.

Alden
"Animals can communicate quite well. And they do. And generally speaking, they are ignored." Alice Walker


Mom to Valhalla; 6 cats; 1 macaw; 2 hedgehogs;
and very many great gliders!

(plus the 2 skin kids)
valkyriegliders.com

Kyrie, nothing will ever fill the hole you left in my heart.
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011382
09/30/10 01:50 PM
09/30/10 01:50 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,216
Washington D.C. Metro Area
DCMuffin Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
DCMuffin  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,216
Washington D.C. Metro Area
We've posted this before!

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Rule 4 violations:

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* Further offense's = actions will be determined by admin.
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Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011397
09/30/10 02:22 PM
09/30/10 02:22 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,747
80 acres of paradise in KS
Dancing Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
Dancing  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,747
80 acres of paradise in KS
I have what I call a small vested interest in this because I do have gliders from the Frodo line. Each and every glider I have or have had born from this line are healthy and not one single case of "wiggles".

I am seeing a lot of guessing (which is usually the starting point in an investigation) and some internet researching going on. I admit, I do this too because sometimes things are not as simple as they appear (such as being diagnosed with the flu when you have menigitis). Having other more complitated suggestions for your vet to look into is never bad but posting it as certainty "this is it" can lead to other complications and once again, panic within the glider community.

As someone watching all this unfold, the strongest evidence shown so far is each of these gliders with "wiggle" are from closely inbred pairings. Could there be an issue with the Frodo line? Maybe. Maybe not. I don't believe it is limited to JUST the Frodo line though and I believe it is a result of the close inbreeding. Those are MY conclusions. I brought this up with my vet Tuesday when I took the boys in to be neutered and he, based on what we "know" agrees, that this is most likely caused by inbreeding.

As Peggy and Alicia have said, no one but a vet can make the diagnosis on this and that will require blood work and testing. Even my vet can only speculate because he has not ran any tests on these gliders. Often times a conclusion is reached when the testing have ruled out all other posibilities. I have fibro myalgia. There is NO blood test for this. It is a diagnosis reached by my neurologist after all other possibilities have been ruled out (such as MS and Lupis).

Everyone can go back and forth speculating till the cows come home but without the vet testing, NOTHING can be ruled conclusive.

Anyone watch HOUSE? How often does that team think it is one illness only to be proven wrong? But they keep testing anyway. And this is what needs to be done with these gliders.


620-704-9109
Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.

I could have missed the pain
But I'd of had to miss the dance


The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: Dancing] #1011415
09/30/10 03:09 PM
09/30/10 03:09 PM

K
Karen523
Unregistered
Karen523
Unregistered
K



Originally Posted By: Dancing

the strongest evidence shown so far is each of these gliders with "wiggle" are from closely inbred pairings. Could there be an issue with the Frodo line? Maybe. Maybe not. I don't believe it is limited to JUST the Frodo line though and I believe it is a result of the close inbreeding. Those are MY conclusions.


I whole heartedly agree with you Dancing! I believe that this same issue may possibly show up in other lines (other than Frodo) if the gliders are closely inbred.

Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011460
09/30/10 04:07 PM
09/30/10 04:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
ValkyrieMome Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous
ValkyrieMome  Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
Nicole did not diagnose. She said she "Believes" that she may have found an explanation. She also said she'd follow up with her vet.

She didn't say "Eureka I have found it!" I believe that she is doing what any of us would do: She's looking on the internet, matching symptoms with disorders she sees on the internet, and drawing conclusions for her own beliefs based on her findings. That's the same thing myself and others have done!

My mistake was in stating that my findings were absolute. Nicole did NOT do that - she is just putting out there her working hypothesis. I find the hypothesis and theories to be fascinating and I look forward to hearing her vet's findings. I do NOT think anyone *IS* diagnosing, and I do not believe anyone should be silenced in posting their theories. Nicole has a lot vested in this! I'm very interested to hear what she discovers.

After all - others have posted their working theories, or "conclusions" and not been criticized! I say - theories are welcome!

Just don't my mistake and state it as conclusive. blush

Last edited by ValkyrieMome; 09/30/10 04:09 PM. Reason: stuff

Alden
"Animals can communicate quite well. And they do. And generally speaking, they are ignored." Alice Walker


Mom to Valhalla; 6 cats; 1 macaw; 2 hedgehogs;
and very many great gliders!

(plus the 2 skin kids)
valkyriegliders.com

Kyrie, nothing will ever fill the hole you left in my heart.
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011465
09/30/10 04:19 PM
09/30/10 04:19 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 956
Homestead, FL
Adri Offline
Glider Guardian
Adri  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 956
Homestead, FL
Originally Posted By: ValkyrieMome
Originally Posted By: Srlb
Quote:
It's a shame this was covered up.

Once again...this has NEVER been *covered* up by ANYONE....

When someone decides it is in the general public's best interests NOT to release information, I call that a "cover up."


Can we please just drop this. links have been provided to evidence this was discussed on this very board as far back as 4.5 yrs ago. There has been no new discovery what so ever, wiggle babies have been produced again by inbreeding. As a matter of fact history has just repeated itself as it usually does. And this bickering back and forth does nothing to help our afflicted gliders nor our healthy ones.

Now moving on to what can possibly identify this syndrome that affects these gliders...As Peggy stated she contacted me to see if I would be willing to have Hook tested. My immediate answer was YES if he would not be harmed. It really baffled me to hear that Nicole and Beth both declined, because while I do not agree Toxoplasmosis culprit here I do understand research.

In a previous post I mentioned I was awaiting the response of genetics labs that I had contacted for the purpose of genetic mapping on gliders. I will tell you I did find a lab that would work with us and while the initial cost would not be cheap I do believe the community along with the breeders could raise the money necessary to get it done. Sadly it would do nothing for our wiggle babies or the possibility of identifying the gene that causes this. We simply do not have enough of them to establish the genetic makers necessary to accomplish this task. Morally and ethically I do not have what it takes to purposely engineer the babies that would be needed to do this.

The company that would be willing to work with us is Genetic Identification Services, and I spent several hours speaking to their their geneticist whom has over 37 years of experience in this type of genotyping and mapping experience. If anyone wants any further information on this do not hesitate to contact me.


Adri

Mother of 2
Adrian, Sofie
Slave to many glidin' gliders



www.sugarsensation.com

Within the heart of every stray lies the singular desire to be loved.
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011483
09/30/10 04:43 PM
09/30/10 04:43 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,710
Washington
T
tjlong Offline
Glider Slave
tjlong  Offline
Glider Slave
T

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,710
Washington
Quote:
I do not agree Toxoplasmosis culprit here I do understand research.


I got lost! When was toxo mentioned? I know it is a major culprit in glider health and every household that has gliders and cats should definitely have their cats tested for toxo!

Did I miss something? I agree, that it's probably not toxo though. Doesn't it wind up killing gliders not just affecting the neurological system? I should ask my vet!


Regards,
Tracy
(425) 789-7753
Acres of Sugar

:rtmo: Slave to Several Adorable Gliders :wfb:
~~~~~ :cream: :grey: :leu: :bb: ~~~~~
Sugar Glider Genetic Project




Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: tjlong] #1011485
09/30/10 04:48 PM
09/30/10 04:48 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 956
Homestead, FL
Adri Offline
Glider Guardian
Adri  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 956
Homestead, FL
Originally Posted By: tjlong
Quote:
I do not agree Toxoplasmosis culprit here I do understand research.


I got lost! When was toxo mentioned? I know it is a major culprit in glider health and every household that has gliders and cats should definitely have their cats tested for toxo!

Did I miss something? I agree, that it's probably not toxo though. Doesn't it wind up killing gliders not just affecting the neurological system? I should ask my vet!


Tracy, Dr. Tristan was presented with videos and the lineages of the affected gliders. Because it is known that marsupials are susceptible to Toxoplasmosis and Toxoplasmosis does affect the neurological system, he wanted to start with testing these gliders to rule it out and then be able to move on to other types of testing.


Adri

Mother of 2
Adrian, Sofie
Slave to many glidin' gliders



www.sugarsensation.com

Within the heart of every stray lies the singular desire to be loved.
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1011487
09/30/10 04:50 PM
09/30/10 04:50 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,710
Washington
T
tjlong Offline
Glider Slave
tjlong  Offline
Glider Slave
T

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,710
Washington
Thank you Adri! I totally missed that part!

I agree that it is something that should be ruled out. Toxoplasmosis is nasty stuff.


Regards,
Tracy
(425) 789-7753
Acres of Sugar

:rtmo: Slave to Several Adorable Gliders :wfb:
~~~~~ :cream: :grey: :leu: :bb: ~~~~~
Sugar Glider Genetic Project




Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: Adri] #1011506
09/30/10 06:11 PM
09/30/10 06:11 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Originally Posted By: Adri
It really baffled me to hear that Nicole and Beth both declined, because while I do not agree Toxoplasmosis culprit here I do understand research.


I told her "yes" when she asked if I'd be willing to provide blood samples. However, after further research and asking Peggy more about the tests that would be run, I changed my mind because the only tests that were going to be run would be for Toxoplasmosis. Only ONE glider would need to be tested to see if it was toxo and since you, Adri, were already giving her samples then I told her I wasn't going to have Shimmer put under to give her more samples since 1 was sufficient.

These gliders are "special needs" and putting ANY glider under is scary enough, but the added risk due to these gliders' conditions worries me even more. So, I told her that because of that I wasn't willing to have blood drawn on my babies for Toxo. Now, should I be approached again in the future and asked for blood samples for something I feel is worth the risk, then I'd gladly get the blood drawn and sent out asap.

I could be wrong, but I believe that Beth is in agreement with me on this and that's why she declined as well.

Originally Posted By: Adri
Sadly it would do nothing for our wiggle babies or the possibility of identifying the gene that causes this. We simply do not have enough of them to establish the genetic makers necessary to accomplish this task.


Actually, the test for CA was created for horses with just 20 test subjects. There are 8 wiggle babies and their 6 parents. That's 14 right there. It's a pretty good start.


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered [Re: Cora] #1011509
09/30/10 06:24 PM
09/30/10 06:24 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 6,576
Kilgore, Texas
Cora Offline
Serious Glideritis
Cora  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 6,576
Kilgore, Texas
Originally Posted By: Cora
Guerita, you are over your PM limit and I would like to chat with you.


Nevermind then!


USDA Licensed Breeder
903-808-1142

http://www.freewebs.com/angelfish_37/index.htm
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