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Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1068206
02/07/11 09:08 PM
02/07/11 09:08 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,871
kentucky
ssdreamsicles Offline
Glider Slave
ssdreamsicles  Offline
Glider Slave

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,871
kentucky
I have beed feeding my guys the blended diet for 5 months now. So far i can not say iv seen any neg impact on my gliders. I am not good about keeping up with weights but i have not noticed any weight loss by looking. My gliders are all still active. Most of my glider fur looks good. I do have a few with cracked fur by my house is very dry right now and im going to get a humidifier. I have 2 that came to me on a [censored] diet and they have improved greatly on the blended. As far as joeys, i only have 2 breeding pair. I have always had great joey weights. I have never lost a joey to diet. In my yrs of breeding i have only lost 3 joeys and they were fron 2 diff moms and I can say 100% were not diet related.

Now i do feed my guys more then 2 tsp each night. Each glider gets 1 tbsp each and breeding cages gets more. I have hardly any blended left if any each morn. I do about once a week give yogurt and i give mealies a few times a week. Yoggies and pine nuts a few times a week as well.

I will be getting weights on all my gliders and keeping track just to make sure. But right now i have to say the diet is not a prob for us. I will be watching them and this thred to see if there is any changes.

Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: CandyOtte] #1068209
02/07/11 09:11 PM
02/07/11 09:11 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,224
North Fort Worth - TX
jacknsally Offline
Glider Addict
jacknsally  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,224
North Fort Worth - TX
Originally Posted By: OtteMom


Have any of you run the heat and/or air conditioning in your homes more that in past years? I know my electric bills say that I have here. This may be one of MANY differences in the environment our gliders live in. The air in my home is much drier when either the heat or AC have to run overtime to keep the temperature comfortable for humans and gliders.






If the issue was environmental or weather/temperature- they wouldn't see improvement when switched back or to another diet.


ancy
~Always on my mind & in my heart Jack, Sally & Serenity~


Mobmilli's Boutique
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1068210
02/07/11 09:12 PM
02/07/11 09:12 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,871
kentucky
ssdreamsicles Offline
Glider Slave
ssdreamsicles  Offline
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kentucky
I want to add to my post that my gliders are vet check and i take fecal samples in every few months.

Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1068532
02/08/11 02:14 PM
02/08/11 02:14 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,997
Upstate, SC
SariYappa Offline
Serious Glideritis
SariYappa  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,997
Upstate, SC
I am posting so that my facts can help everyone keep an open mind...

I switched to the blended diet a few months ago... I'm not a very organized person, so to have exact weight amounts, and exact dates is not my style wink

I have had cracked fur, less than fluffy tails, and a lot of weight loss.

Now lets look at this closer...

I gave my suggies what I call "junk food" for a few weeks when switching between BML & The Blended diet. "junk food" means I gave fresh/frozen fruits & veggies, some yogurt, mealies and sometimes eggs, but with no "staple" diet. (I ran out of BML, and didn't have the new ingredients I needed yet, including the vitamins, bee pollen, and Wombaroo powder)

I noticed a change in fur and fluffiness, Destiny & Sugar gained a lot of weight in a small amount of time. Sugar has always been "fluffy", but Destiny was always a little girl...

Once I started on the Blended diet all my babies lost weight, and this was a good thing in our house smile
Their coats are still cracked, and their tails are not as fluffy.

Facts:

*We have had snow storms, and abnormally cold weather, high heating bills and lots of running heat here in the south this winter.
*I did not have the correct vitamins for the blended diet until this last batch, they've only eaten from it two days now
*We have no changes in sleep and wake patterns. I still wake them up during the day when they want to sleep, and they still wake up to play at night wink
*Sometimes I slack on making the diet in time, and give a few nights of "junk food" (as explained above) before I get to make the new batch...
*Nibbles started picking his hair out on his eyebrows for the past couple of months. I understand this to normally be a stress thing... this is new. It seems to be stopping, and the hair is finally growing back in now. (yay!)
*I am still on the blended diet... I started with the version w/o egg, then I made the version w/o yogurt, and now I'm back on the version w/o egg. (So, I guess we now know how long I've been on the diet, the first batch was a double batch, then 2 single batches, up to a week in between, and I have 3 gliders... if you want to do the math)

What I've learned working in a customer service call center:

When you have a place to complain, then you generally hear from the unhappy customers. Although this is your life, day in and day out, you realize this is a very small percentage of the actual customer base (otherwise, there would be no customer base) wink. Things are actually doing well, you just don't get to hear the good and the happy.
Let's look at statistics. If there have been 5 people with the same outcome, on the same diet, then this is a very small percentage of the amount of people that actually use the blended diet. It's good to have an avenue for people to give facts, negative & positive. This thread will give those people the chance to share their experiences. If we get a lot more people with the same issues, using the same diet, and having the facts, then maybe we'll know if there is something to change here...

Until then, I don't see a reason to be paranoid. I also think that people should look closely at their own habbits, and choices when they switched diets. Did you have a similar experience as I? Because I believe that all my issues are either self inflicted, or weather related.

I do not intend on changing diets at this time. That's my choice. And I reserve the right to change my mind in the future wink


*Whatever I said, I said it with a Smile*

wave Sari

:grey:Sugar:grey:Nibbles:grey:Destiny

Rapid Runner *Sold Out!

Suggie Smart Mart *Home of The Hippie Pouch & Suggie Chandelier
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1068665
02/08/11 07:49 PM
02/08/11 07:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,566
Wisconsin
Feather Offline
Administrator
Feather  Offline
Administrator

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,566
Wisconsin
I would like to add that when little Jadzia has joeys in pouch or is nursing joeys I give her and Worf enough food for three gliders and if they clean it up I increase the amount.

Also, out house is 68 degrees and lower at night, not my doing. If I had my way it would be a lot warmer in here. BRRRR


Kimberley
Feathers-Sweetie, Mister Peanut & Big Mack
Fur-Guinan, Mr. Spock, T'Mir, Cho, Toothless, Maverick & Maharet :bb: T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon :wfb: TY, TJ, Light Fury, Madison & T'Pring :rtmo:
Forever in my heart, Gizmo, Tucker, Khayman and the rest of my babies over the :rbridge:

Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069049
02/09/11 03:50 PM
02/09/11 03:50 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,837
Florida
BindiAndScrubbie Offline
Glider Slave
BindiAndScrubbie  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,837
Florida
I'd like to say something. I can understand why Candy would feel a bit upset over this as no one would ever want to feel any sort of guilt over the potential possibility of causing harm to other's gliders. With that said...I will say that it is obvious that Candy has put a lot of time and effort into her diet. I for one, appreciate that as I am one of the owners that actually rely on others for diets. I am the first to admit that I do not have the time or patience or even knowledge to create my own diet. I may tweak a diet and observe it's effects but in general, I look to other diets as a staple. So for that, I thank Candy for her time and effort even though I use another diet. People like Candy give us choices and I do believe she is looking out for the good. With that said, let's assume that for breeding females, this diet isn't sufficiant in necessary nutrients. (that seems to be the possible case) HPW has a tweaked version for breeders. So perhaps this is a good opportunity to all collaborate and help Candy figure out what needs to be tweaked, perhaps protein, perhaps something else.
In my own opinion, as far as weather playing a role...I can see the cracked fur as being a result of that but not the thinning tails, loss of joeys, cannibalization, etc. Those all seem to have a more common denominator of more importance and I think we can all agree that weather wouldn't cause this. (at least I'm *pretty* sure)

So really, to figure this out we all know that 50 heads are better than 1.
I think this is a good opportunity to come together and try to fix this. Learning from this is a good thing since no one has the money or resources to perform a true diet study. This could be the best we can do. For now.

I am a non-breeder, but I can still observe and put myself in others' shoes.


Davie

:rtmo:SpoiledRottenSuggies.com

Think of all the beauty still left around you and be happy - Anne Frank
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069092
02/09/11 04:34 PM
02/09/11 04:34 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,420
Twin Cities, MN
cinnamonstix Offline
Glider Addict
cinnamonstix  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,420
Twin Cities, MN
I was on Blended with my gliders for 10 months approx. Rafiki grew from a joey into a sturdy bulky male. Rajah is petite but definitely adaquately sized. My leu Nemo lost weight and looked very thin, I started feeding extra every day cause I was scared and weighing him several times daily. It seemed to sustain him and prevent further weight loss. My gliders are pigs and WILL over eat if given extra nom noms. No one else had drastic weight loss, just minor among gliders. Fur has more of an orange tint to it that it did not have before on some of my greys. Howie has alway been colored a little "off" but not others. It gets really bad in pics. Rei has never overgroomed and I caught him overgroomed once on this diet. Nothing really ever struck me as too odd, besides Nemo's weight loss. My only breeding pair just had their first joey OOP recently and all of them are doing great. I was feeding extra blended diet to them nightly and offering yoggies as treats while I visited them. I have weighed the joey several times daily since he came OOP and he has been gaining wonderfully. We did however switch back to HPW within the last week due to the amount of issues others have experienced and my main concern with Nemo's weight change. We fed HPW for a long time, so it was not a hard choice to make the switch back, I would be devastated if anything happened to my gliders or my first joey. Some of my issues like the overgrooming may or may not have been from diet. I do not feed anything that would cause orange fur in excess. They get carrots in their veggie mix, but nothing else I can think of that would cause discoloration. Overgrooming is hard to pinpoint, but it was a very temp thing. Thinking about it, I guess my gliders may have been sleeping more, not positive, but possible. I have 13 gliders, of those 13...11 are non breeders and 2 are breeders. All were fed Blended diet original version and breeding pair was given extra treats and Blended. I switched originally because I liked that it was less fat, etc. so when I noticed minor weight loss I was happy. When nemo seemed small, it concerned me greatly. Nemo does not have good lineage and I wonder if that could play a part in his disposition with the diet and why he showed more serious weight loss. As far as my gliders with no lineage, I do not have proof of any inbreeding, but with Nemo I am aware of his coefficent and poor genetics. I do not know what could be effected internally (hopefully nothing) but he does have an ear deformity as many of you are already aware. As for everyone else, he was result of an unknown poor pairing which was discovered and corrected when Nemo came OOP. He came to me and was neutered to ensure he would remain in a pet only loving home. Gliders are now back on HPW with half honey and half organic applesauce (to prevent too fulffy of gliders, mine are large on HPW). The breeding pair gets original HPW with double Wombaroo as they are breeding/nursing. We have not been back on long enough to determine changes, but everyone was happy to make the switch back. No complaints.

Last edited by cinnamonstix; 02/09/11 04:41 PM.

~GWEN~
Crazy Hubby Dru
Tortoise: Vork
Cats: Scooby, Swiper, Zero, Dinah & Sykes
Suggies: Meeko, Willow & Nemo; Rei, Rafiki & Rajah; Opal, Lily & Link; Tael, Tatl & Navi; Kristoff Krabbs & Crabby Patty
:rbridge: Fern, Cjarsa, Syfka, Icarus, Ivy, Howie & Gracie

www.cinnamonstix-n-sugar.com
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069177
02/09/11 07:54 PM
02/09/11 07:54 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,294
NY
WintersSong Offline
Glider Slave
WintersSong  Offline
Glider Slave

Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,294
NY
Someone suggested to me that I should post the link to the TSS discussion on the blended diet. I think it's a good idea, as not everyone visits both forums. Those who feed the Blended diet might want to follow both threads, to see if any insight is offered there that isn't offered here.

(http://thesweetspot.forumotion.net/t1157-blended-diet-concerns).


~*Sara*~

"And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." ~Anais Nin
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: CandyOtte] #1069226
02/09/11 09:38 PM
02/09/11 09:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
ValkyrieMome Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
ValkyrieMome  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
Originally Posted By: OtteMom
Those of you who have concerns, what fruits and vegetables are you regularly using with the Blended diet?

Are you offering a wide variety of different fruits and vegetables?

Are you using any of the "relish" or "smoothie" recipes that rely heavily on Bok Choi and Papaya?

I make my own veggie relish. I make it the exact same way every single week. It contains:
32 oz green beans
16 oz of carrots
16 oz collard greens
16 oz broccoli
28 oz papaya
8 oz corn
8 oz peas
6 oz of orange juice concentrate (sometimes with calcium, sometimes without)
~2 cups of fresh sprouts.

To this I add one or two seasonal fruits/veggies each night. This week it was pears and sections of clementine.


Originally Posted By: OtteMom
What types of treats do you offer, and how much.

Gliders get 3-6 mealworms most nights. I feed yoggies very sparingly. That's about it.


Originally Posted By: OtteMom
How many of you switched to the Blended Diet because you were having difficulty getting your gliders to eat fruits and vegetables? What changes did you see in that behavior when you changed to the Blended Diet.

This is not why I changed. My gliders have eaten their veggies and fruit well for some time. I changed because I was concerned about calcium, and I like the Blended Diet. It makes sense to me, and it seems like a very practical, balanced diet.

Originally Posted By: OtteMom
Are those of you seeing a problem using the Calcium Carbonate or have you chosen to use Calcium Citrate?

I use the NOW Brand Calicium Carbonate.

I am not sure the diet needs any changes. If it is not the right diet for your gliders, by all means choose another diet.

Originally Posted By: OtteMom
Have you discussed the Blended Diet with your Vet and showed your vet the comparison chart for nutrients in the Blended Diet, BML and HPW? What were your vet's comments? Did your vet see any part of the diet that should be of concern? Please share the comments from your vet with me.

Yes. Like me, my vet thought it looked like an excellent diet - balanced and nutritious and well-planned.

It has been suggested that only breeding gliders are seeing problems. There have been several posts by people who do not breed, or who have more non-breeders than breeders. I have more non-breeders than breeders.My breeding gliders get an extra serving of the Blended diet each night - so the pair would get 6 teaspoons, rather than 4. Also, I tend to over-measure my teaspoons. So, all my gliders end up getting a bit more. Most nights they eat all the Blended, some nights not. I over-feed them veggie/fruits, also - so there is always some amount left in all cages. This is deliberate.

Another breeder whom I have spoken with is not on Glider Central and has also switched back to Modified HPW. She reported the same kinds of problems.

She also lives in Wisconsin. So - maybe it is just those of us up here? (Haleigh reported problems, I can't remember where she lives, sorry.) I keep both a space heater and a humidifier in my glider room. The temperature stays in the low 70s in winter.

Good luck with all of this. Obviously coming up with this diet was a huge labor of love, and this discussion is painful to Candy. I hope that we can all continue to discuss it objectively. There was nothing personal intended on my part. The lack of energy is concerning, and I need to find out what is causing it.


Alden
"Animals can communicate quite well. And they do. And generally speaking, they are ignored." Alice Walker


Mom to Valhalla; 6 cats; 1 macaw; 2 hedgehogs;
and very many great gliders!

(plus the 2 skin kids)
valkyriegliders.com

Kyrie, nothing will ever fill the hole you left in my heart.
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069242
02/09/11 10:14 PM
02/09/11 10:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 711
Portland, OR
S
sunjana1 Offline
Glider Guardian
sunjana1  Offline
Glider Guardian
S

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 711
Portland, OR
As kind of just a naive observer here and newbie to gliders and all the intricacies of diets I wanted to just bring up something else - measurements.

I have been feeding my boys the same version of the Blended that Meghan does, as they were her babies and it was important to me to continue that diet. As she stated previously she is offering a *tablespoon* (or more) per glider - so that is what I have been giving.

I did the math and in my ice cube trays, 1 tablespoon = 3/4 ice cube - so I give 1.5 ice cubes per night (I have 2 gliders). They eat it ALL, every night, to the point where I am considering offering them more (pending they do a little better with their veggies, which they are starting to).

2 teaspoons is, for me, 1/2 an ice cube. So I guess my comment is, I think it's important to know how the Blended is being measured out. Is a 1 tsp. measuring spoon used or some other type of spoon? Are ice cube trays used? The ounces (and therefore teaspoons) that can be held in a cube can depend on the tray used.

My question is, has anyone simply considered just feeding more of the Blended if their gliders are eating all of it? Again, I'm just the inexperienced outsider here, probably butting in where I don't belong, but it seems as though people are only concerned with the content of the diet, and may want to instead or at least ALSO consider the amount fed.


Jana
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Dee Dee - Rat Terrier, :rtmo: - Dave, :wfb: - Tim
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069251
02/09/11 10:24 PM
02/09/11 10:24 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,269
WI
Glide_Bye_Lily Offline
Glider Guardian
Glide_Bye_Lily  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,269
WI
The amt fed may be an answer to problems like not having enough milk and small joeys. But it does not explain coat condition such as thinning tails and discolored and greasiness. This to me seems like an aspect of some sort of nutrition they are not getting or not absorbing properly. I'm not a glider nutrition expert by any means, but from what I've read about diets where gliders are not getting what they need, coat condition seems to be the most common indicator of something lacking.


Allie
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069269
02/09/11 10:56 PM
02/09/11 10:56 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,997
Upstate, SC
SariYappa Offline
Serious Glideritis
SariYappa  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,997
Upstate, SC
Just to comment on the way we are going here about amounts...
I was discussing this with somebody yesterday, that it seems the people that are not having problems with breeding, and the diet, seem to be adding or even doubling the doses of the blended diet offered?
and...
Yes, coat has a lot to do with many things, and sometimes things lacking... but wouldn't all, or most gliders on the diet have a problem with the coat? (if this were an issue).
From what I'm reading, there are only a select few, and mostly breeders.


*Whatever I said, I said it with a Smile*

wave Sari

:grey:Sugar:grey:Nibbles:grey:Destiny

Rapid Runner *Sold Out!

Suggie Smart Mart *Home of The Hippie Pouch & Suggie Chandelier
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069273
02/09/11 11:00 PM
02/09/11 11:00 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,269
WI
Glide_Bye_Lily Offline
Glider Guardian
Glide_Bye_Lily  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,269
WI
Yes, mostly breeders so far, around the north. But our gliders here that look the worst coat-wise are not currently breeding. They haven't had a joey since last May/June. Which is around the time we first switched to Blended.

ETA: I'm not talking about just 'cracked' coats either. It's dry here and at this time of year a little cracking is normal.

Last edited by Glide_Bye_Lily; 02/09/11 11:01 PM.

Allie
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: ValkyrieMome] #1069683
02/10/11 01:03 PM
02/10/11 01:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
ValkyrieMome Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
ValkyrieMome  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
Originally Posted By: ValkyrieMome
I noticed an extreme decrease in activity and poor coat conditions. My gliders' started looking scrawny to me. But it is the decreased activity that caused me to switch back. I have 20 gliders, 4 of whom are currently breeding, but last month had 4 breeding pairs.


Originally Posted By: ValkyrieMome
Again, the most concerning sign for me was the lack of activity.


Alden
"Animals can communicate quite well. And they do. And generally speaking, they are ignored." Alice Walker


Mom to Valhalla; 6 cats; 1 macaw; 2 hedgehogs;
and very many great gliders!

(plus the 2 skin kids)
valkyriegliders.com

Kyrie, nothing will ever fill the hole you left in my heart.
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069686
02/10/11 01:07 PM
02/10/11 01:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,334
NC, USA
xoerikae Offline
Glider Slave
xoerikae  Offline
Glider Slave

Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,334
NC, USA
*shrug* i havent noticed anything other than my boys are still a bit underweight, sigh. but i also switched to hpw just because our new gliders outweighed the old ones, and they were all on hpw. less ingredients, every eats it all up... win/win. and maybe appa and momo [and yuki] will gain a little weight.

Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069695
02/10/11 01:28 PM
02/10/11 01:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 711
Portland, OR
S
sunjana1 Offline
Glider Guardian
sunjana1  Offline
Glider Guardian
S

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 711
Portland, OR
What about how the diet is stored? I read elsewhere that in large batches stored in deep containers certain nutrients may settle to the bottom before it is completely frozen in which case there might be an overall imbalance of nutrients? Just another question and potential factor I guess?


Jana
Twitter
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Dee Dee - Rat Terrier, :rtmo: - Dave, :wfb: - Tim
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069723
02/10/11 02:03 PM
02/10/11 02:03 PM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 5,138
Lutz Florida
CandyOtte Offline
Serious Glideritis
CandyOtte  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 5,138
Lutz Florida
sunjana, folks have observed uneven freezing of HPW which I feel may be do to it forming layers as it settles while freezing. I do not think anyone has said anything about the Blended diet not freezing all the way through consistently.


Candy Otte
& the Glider Kids
Sassy, Corky, Mehitabel & Missy
Wacco, Yacco, & Dot
Mindy, Kanobles, Elmo, & Chipper

http://www.gliderkids-diet.com

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Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069727
02/10/11 02:16 PM
02/10/11 02:16 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,219
Washington D.C. Metro Area
DCMuffin Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
DCMuffin  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,219
Washington D.C. Metro Area
I've never had trouble with the consistency of the Blended as it's frozen. HPW did separate...never the Blended.

Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069743
02/10/11 02:45 PM
02/10/11 02:45 PM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,276
usa
snowbabygliders Offline
Glider Guardian
snowbabygliders  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,276
usa
it depends on container size. I froze mine in a flat big 1inch deep container (never filled to brim at all), now if you do the same for HPW you'd likely have the same results. Anything blended no matter what you use ingredients-wise that we use for diets will have some of the nutrients "separate" its gravity for one and another would be on a chemistry thought process. It is a homogeneous mixture however technically it may look the same throughout, you can technically pick apart the ingredients in a lab setting so the smaller the depth of space for gravity to pull on and faster for it to feeze, the less likely to notice any separation to the visible eye tho I do however know unless you stopped molecular action which happens at "absolute zero" on a Kelvin Temperature scale, it does separate. You take the same size of squares and cut all the way to bottom your more likely to have an even distribution as much as possible... the larger the depth the more noticeable such as an ice cream pail. It will take longer to freeze and have more time for gravity to pull and cause to settle on different materials within the mixture. Which is why i used 1 inch containers at most as the depth tho i used half of that depth. Maybe something to think about for all on both diets.

Sorry for getting too techy there. it is impossible to blend a mixture and freeze it without using chemicals or having an absolute Kelvin Temperature, without it settling at some point and nutrients not being distributed throughout exactly evenly. Mass and weight all are factors including temperature (environment)



Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069754
02/10/11 03:17 PM
02/10/11 03:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 711
Portland, OR
S
sunjana1 Offline
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sunjana1  Offline
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Portland, OR
Kristy - this is exactly what I was thinking, but could not explain technically. Your explanation was fantastic. Thank you.


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Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069755
02/10/11 03:19 PM
02/10/11 03:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
ValkyrieMome Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
ValkyrieMome  Offline
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Denton, TX
When I make either the Blended or Modified HPW, I freeze them in icecube trays.

I have measured all my ice cube trays, so I know where the serving size is.

If it separates, they are still getting all the layers in each serving.


Alden
"Animals can communicate quite well. And they do. And generally speaking, they are ignored." Alice Walker


Mom to Valhalla; 6 cats; 1 macaw; 2 hedgehogs;
and very many great gliders!

(plus the 2 skin kids)
valkyriegliders.com

Kyrie, nothing will ever fill the hole you left in my heart.
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069831
02/10/11 06:07 PM
02/10/11 06:07 PM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,276
usa
snowbabygliders Offline
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usa
your welcome wink
and i put it even simpler than i could have lol but i didn't want to rattle brains too much or make anyone's squishy tee hee hee tounge Chemistry makes my brain squish enough as it is roflmao


Alden that's the way to go. everything is even then as much as it can be smile HPW is softer so it'd be harder as written but it can be done. otherwise you get a 1 inch deep large plastic container and evenly cut into serving sized squares. pull up and out with a fork or butter knife wink



Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069867
02/10/11 07:11 PM
02/10/11 07:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,269
WI
Glide_Bye_Lily Offline
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WI
Our's are pre-measured ice-cube trays.


Allie
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1069874
02/10/11 07:24 PM
02/10/11 07:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
fox0r Offline
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Meridian, ID
I've fed blended since November with no problems. My pair had a joey IP at the time.

All of my coats look good (MUCH better than when I first got them, but they weren't on any kind of a diet at all, and fed a lot of nasties), and tails look good (except for Samson, but his was always that way). None of them feel greasy, just nice and soft.

I measure out and freeze in ice cube trays. I try to stick as close to accurate measurements as possible.

I over feed a little on the fruits/veggies, so I tend to have a bit of the blended left over in the mornings. I feed frozen mixed veggies (which I know isn't the best, but my kids are VERY picky about their veggies, and wont eat the fresh stuff!), and also frozen fruits that I rotate through. Sometimes I'll buy a mixed package of fruit and pick out specific ones for dinner that night, or I'll buy individual packages.

I use the calcium carbonate.

I wonder if maybe baby food types have something to do with it too?

I do the Gerber mixed cereal, and Beechnut baby foods (My Walmart doesn't stock the turkey and chicken Gerber, or if they do I can't find it). I also buy the Gerber fruit/yogurt drink, though lately I've had to use Beechnut because my store here had been out of the Gerber (someone forgot to order it. Ugh).


-Jen

Sugar Mountain - Sugar gliders in Idaho!
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: SariYappa] #1069990
02/10/11 11:26 PM
02/10/11 11:26 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 490
Champaign Co., Illinois
Berg Offline
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Berg  Offline
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Posts: 490
Champaign Co., Illinois
I think SariYappa made some good observations both about environment and about the relative percentage of people having problems. I'd like to throw out a couple of other things for consideration.

The Blended diet has ingredients in common with other diets, and no ingredients (to my knowledge) that are bad for gliders. From all the information Candy has provided the diet seems nutritionally sound.

A number of people are observing symptoms and assuming that these symptoms are due to the diet. However, it's possible there may be other things going on that may be related to diet, but not as a result of the diet. For example, on a visit to our vet the other day she suggested we might consider trying a UVB light near the cage at this time of year. UVB promotes the metabolism of calcium and vitamin D. During this long and cold winter, I'm guessing that many of our gliders are not seeing much in the way of indirect sunlight.

Weather does have an effect on the behavior of animals, even indirectly. Most of the symptoms from what I've read here have appeared in the last month or two during one of the coldest and snowiest winters in the eastern U.S. since the late 70s.

Switching diets and seeing changes in your gliders (one way or there other) does not in and of itself prove cause and effect. Just from what I have read in this thread there are a lot of variables in the different instances that are not controlled.

All gliders aren't the same (you only need two gliders to learn that)! There obviously have their likes and dislikes, different metabolisms, and activity levels. We should not assume any diet is one size fits all. Candy stated it herself "If it is not the right diet for your gliders, by all means choose another diet."


-Steve-

:grey: Foehn, CB, Rossby, Sprite, Flurry, and Pascal

gangel Virga 9-10-2012
gangel Cirrus 4-29-2013


The Glider Chronicles blog
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1070031
02/11/11 12:50 AM
02/11/11 12:50 AM

L
lovely1inred
Unregistered
lovely1inred
Unregistered
L



One thing that sticks out to me is the yogurt in Blended. From what I understand of what I've read about glider diets, the yogurt being added is a very US thing, and not an Aussie thing. I do know there are people with gliders that are completely lactose intolerant. So, I am wondering if maybe there is a sliding scale for gliders in that most won't react at all, some only a little, and some not tolerate the yogurt at all, and reaction being proportionate to the amount of yogurt consumed. That might also explain why certain variations are thought to be the culprit more than others???? I agree with you Berg, there are so many variables here, it is hard to tell what is one thing or the other contributing or not contributing. I wish diets were easier!

Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1070371
02/11/11 07:01 PM
02/11/11 07:01 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,420
Twin Cities, MN
cinnamonstix Offline
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Posts: 3,420
Twin Cities, MN
I fed standard version, it takes yogurt, my gliders are very orange and I am unhappy with how they look. It looks terrible in photos and makes me feel like a bad mom. As stated before I have 11 non breeders and 2 breeding gliders. My breeders look the best of all my gliders ATM, they also were getting LOTS of extra treats (mainly yoggies). My largest glider has gotten obese, he has never been this chunky before, not sure why, and my leu is down to 115g, he used to be semi fluffy. Can't wait to see an improvement being back on HPW. I offer yogurt to gliders occasionally with HPW. Just once in a while and it has never posed any issues over the past few years.


~GWEN~
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Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: Adri] #1070580
02/12/11 02:03 AM
02/12/11 02:03 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,871
kentucky
ssdreamsicles Offline
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,871
kentucky
I also put my blended in ice cube trays. I pre measured first so i know how much goes in.

One thing im not sure has been asked and sorry if it has is how do you measure your wambaroo powder. Do you do 3 loose tablespoons or do you do 3 packed tablespoons? I pack mine.

Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: ssdreamsicles] #1071104
02/12/11 11:02 PM
02/12/11 11:02 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 2,532
Kentucky
nancy1202 Offline
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nancy1202  Offline
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Joined: May 2008
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Kentucky
I switched from BML to Blended on 9-5-10. Some of my gliders are having issues, but others are thriving. I only have two breeding pair. One cannibalized last October and the second joey died two days later. The other mama had twins OOP 10-23-10. She only had enough milk for one joey, and I hand-fed the other. Some coats are looking crackly, and I recently bought a humidifier to see if it is due to dry winter heat. I have not yet noticed a difference. Out of 18 adult gliders, 7 have gained more than 10 grams, 4 have lost more than 10 grams and the rest are about at the same weights as before the diet switch. So, yeah, I guess I am having some issues.

My two breeding pair went to vet in October for checkups and fecals, which came back negative.

The reason I switched in the first place was because my gliders weren't eating their BML. If figured the diet wasn't doing any good if they weren't eating it, but realize now that may have been seasonal or a normal appetite fluctuation. Sometimes we humans eat more, sometimes less. All bowls were cleaned with the Blended. I figured that was a good thing. My breeding pairs got an extra helping of Blended, and more than 2T of veggies each night. 5 months later, bowls are STILL consistently cleaned every night. To be honest, that in itself is now causing me to be concerned. Are they getting the nutrients they need? Are they not satisfied with what I am feeding?

I have not noticed any changes in activity levels EXCEPT all gliders have been awake and playing about an hour earlier ever since the time change last fall. That may change as the days get longer and it gets dark later. None of my gliders used to wake up until 10PM.

I use Now brand calcium citrate to make the Blended. I feed a few mealies each morning, and very few other treats. Yogies are mostly for nail trimming every 2 or 3 weeks. I put euc branches/leaves in the cages and occasionally sugar cane... sure makes a mess, but they love it!

My breeding pairs and my smaller gliders are now on a different diet. I had not attributed these issues to diet prior to reading this thread. For that reason, I didn't even consider getting in touch with Candy. I have no idea how it can be determined how or if changes should be made to the diet. There are so many variables regarding which version is being used, what specific fruits/veggies are being fed, or even climate variations. The diet does use ingredients that have been used with other diets, but not in this particular combination.


~Nancy~
http://www.derbycitygliders.com

:grey: Jackson/Izzie, Lukas/Leilah, Mizuki/Elektra, Oliver/Ava, Ramon/Paloma, Charming/Snow
Rest of the menagerie: dogs, cats, corn snake, bearded dragon
Re: Blended Diet Concerns - Part One [Re: nancy1202] #1071182
02/13/11 01:39 AM
02/13/11 01:39 AM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 490
Champaign Co., Illinois
Berg Offline
Glider Lover
Berg  Offline
Glider Lover

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 490
Champaign Co., Illinois
Originally Posted By: nancy1202
I switched from BML to Blended on 9-5-10. Some of my gliders are having issues, but others are thriving. I only have two breeding pair. One cannibalized last October and the second joey died two days later. The other mama had twins OOP 10-23-10. She only had enough milk for one joey, and I hand-fed the other. Some coats are looking crackly, and I recently bought a humidifier to see if it is due to dry winter heat. I have not yet noticed a difference. Out of 18 adult gliders, 7 have gained more than 10 grams, 4 have lost more than 10 grams and the rest are about at the same weights as before the diet switch. So, yeah, I guess I am having some issues.

My two breeding pair went to vet in October for checkups and fecals, which came back negative.


I'm not minimizing what you have experienced, but I read about these types of breeding issues every week on GC. The fact that they occurred after you changed diets could be just coincidence. Perhaps weight gains and losses can be attributed to some of the gliders really liking this diet and others not liking it.


Quote:
My breeding pairs and my smaller gliders are now on a different diet. I had not attributed these issues to diet prior to reading this thread. For that reason, I didn't even consider getting in touch with Candy. I have no idea how it can be determined how or if changes should be made to the diet. There are so many variables regarding which version is being used, what specific fruits/veggies are being fed, or even climate variations. The diet does use ingredients that have been used with other diets, but not in this particular combination.


That's again assuming the diet is the issue and/or the only issue. At best, there is circumstantial evidence that's it is. The only way I would be convinced there there might be a general problem is if results were reproducible, i.e someone who had problems, switched to a diet other than the Blended and problems cleared, and then switched back to Blended to see if problems reappeared, with all other things the same.


-Steve-

:grey: Foehn, CB, Rossby, Sprite, Flurry, and Pascal

gangel Virga 9-10-2012
gangel Cirrus 4-29-2013


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