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Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1128952
06/12/11 05:54 PM
06/12/11 05:54 PM

P
ParaPrincess904
Unregistered
ParaPrincess904
Unregistered
P



Hmmm, when I took my pair in, one was perfectly healthy, the other trembling and bobbing her head, and barely eating. She received a shot of D3 and some subq fluids in the office and I was sent home with orders to subq every 12 hours and oral calcium and an antibiotic every 12 as well. As of 10am when I left for work, my Giz was doing well in her hospital cage. She ate well last night so hopefully when I get out in a few hours we will continue to do well...

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: BCChins] #1129098
06/12/11 11:22 PM
06/12/11 11:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 31
North Little Rock, AR
Rocky_D Offline
In Pouch
Rocky_D  Offline
In Pouch

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 31
North Little Rock, AR
Originally Posted By: BCChins
I think you should try to push oral fluids and get them to eat as often as you can. You should wake them up every 2 hours and get them to take something. Offer Pedialyte with a touch of fruit juice in it to make them want to drink a lot. Flushing their systems is what helps the most. I am not a vet but have gone though this too. I also kept anyone who had symptoms in smaller cages to keep them from using too much energy in hopes they would use the energy to heal faster.


This is great info for us, unfortunatly our vets have not been much help. Rocky spends most of his time in his pouch and is eating a small amount. He also seems scared of most every noise or movement. We pushed the pedialyte with apple juice just minutes ago and he drank alot. We placed the rest in a drinking cup for him. Thank you for posting this info, we will push more now that we have some idea how to treat him.


Bob n Glenda


:grey: Rocky D

:rbridge: Taz
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1129383
06/13/11 01:32 PM
06/13/11 01:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
fox0r Offline
Glider Guardian
fox0r  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
Cici is still doing okay. I really hate having to stick her, though. frown Poor kid.


-Jen

Sugar Mountain - Sugar gliders in Idaho!
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: ] #1130426
06/15/11 10:52 AM
06/15/11 10:52 AM

G
Gliderlover87
Unregistered
Gliderlover87
Unregistered
G



I have a survivor. My little girl (from PP unfortunately)did not seem to be thriving. She stopped growing and started looking like maybe her diet was not adequate for her (which i later learned it wasn't). And then the tremors started. Once she started actually showing symptoms her health deteriorated Very Very quickly. I didn't know what to do, since she is my first glider, so I just pushed fluids, fed her very soft concentrated foods, and kept her warm, the same as I would with other types of animals. I took her to the vet on the second day she was sick and he thought she had HLP, so he gave her calcium (dropps). I gave her drops every day, and she went to stay with my boyfriend and his glider. I did this in case she was lonely and that was one of the things that was making her sick. I am so glad I did this, because the end result was that she was put into another cage.

This was about 1.5 months ago. Peanut went from 27grams at her sickest to almost 60 as of yesterday. She has NO weakness in her hind end anymore, and she is back to her old antics, with no shaking. So physically and neurologically I would give her a 100%

I am so sorry that some of you guys have lost your babies to this. :-(

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: ] #1131275
06/16/11 10:58 PM
06/16/11 10:58 PM

C
Crystalg820
Unregistered
Crystalg820
Unregistered
C



Have any of the replacement cages caused problems??? I got the replacement cage from PP last Wednesday CoCo amd Delilah have been in that cage since that time and Delilah is still very wobbly and her coordination is awful. I am on my second round of meds with her at this point, and although she is definetly feeling better (she is doing her best to run around and glide...initially all she wanted to do was sleep and wouldn't eat, now she is) I am wondering about the symptoms she is continuing to have, she is very "jerky" with her movements?? Just want to make sure that she is ok< any advice is very appreciated!

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1131284
06/16/11 11:11 PM
06/16/11 11:11 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,214
Washington D.C. Metro Area
DCMuffin Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
DCMuffin  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,214
Washington D.C. Metro Area
I will be honest with you about how I feel about this. There is no way I'd put my monkeys back in a pvc cage right now. While I respect (PPP) Perfect Pocket Pets for turning around and sending out replacement cages, I have a really hard time, given the fact that they still don't know what's causing the problems, thinking about using another cage of the same material. How do we know it's not affected, as well?

So...me personally? I'd have them in something totally different.

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: DCMuffin] #1131297
06/16/11 11:27 PM
06/16/11 11:27 PM

C
Crystalg820
Unregistered
Crystalg820
Unregistered
C



I will be stopping at a petsmart or somewhere tomorrow, I need to find something big enough for them that is not going to make them sick or put them in danger. Any suggestions on where I can get a cage (at a store, so I can move them asap) that is ok for them. These are my first babies and I am still learning the ins and outs

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1131310
06/16/11 11:48 PM
06/16/11 11:48 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,214
Washington D.C. Metro Area
DCMuffin Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
DCMuffin  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,214
Washington D.C. Metro Area
Are your gliders chewers? If not...you can get them a pop up dog kennel from Walmart...that would work until you find a good and suitable cage for them. If they chew, it won't work. Just make sure the bar spacing is no more than 1/2" and that it's either powder coated or epoxy.

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: DCMuffin] #1131318
06/16/11 11:57 PM
06/16/11 11:57 PM

C
Crystalg820
Unregistered
Crystalg820
Unregistered
C



They do like to chew....thank you so much, I will be cage shopping tomorrow smile

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1131558
06/17/11 01:34 PM
06/17/11 01:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
fox0r Offline
Glider Guardian
fox0r  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
Also, if you get a cage that is a bit on the small side from Petco (or where ever) it'd be okay for a few days until a bigger cage got to your home. Just as long as they aren't in a smaller cage for any extended period of time (I wouldn't leave them in longer than shipping time, IMO) they should be fine. I had to shove my quad in a dinky cage for a week until my new cage got here.

So if you can't find something big enough at a local store, don't stress too much! But definitely get another cage to put them in ASAP, even if it is, like I said, smaller. It'll be okay for a little while.

What meds do they have your girl on?

My Cici is still very uncoordinated, especially in her hind end, and is jerky with her movements too. I have my doubts that she'll ever get back to 100%, but I'm very happy that she's hanging in there and doing okay, everything considered.


-Jen

Sugar Mountain - Sugar gliders in Idaho!
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: fox0r] #1131626
06/17/11 03:53 PM
06/17/11 03:53 PM

C
Crystalg820
Unregistered
Crystalg820
Unregistered
C



She is on CAEDTA, 2 times a day. i question whether or not she will back to 100% too. Hopefully they are both ok soon

Last edited by Gizmogirl; 06/18/11 02:29 AM. Reason: Edited Text - Gizmogirl
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1131707
06/17/11 07:23 PM
06/17/11 07:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
fox0r Offline
Glider Guardian
fox0r  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
Hrm, what is that? I haven't heard of it, but I'm not familiar with a lot.


-Jen

Sugar Mountain - Sugar gliders in Idaho!
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: DCMuffin] #1132034
06/18/11 11:26 AM
06/18/11 11:26 AM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,093
Port Aransas, TX
Pockets Offline
Glider Slave
Pockets  Offline
Glider Slave

Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,093
Port Aransas, TX
So sorry to hear of this & certainly hope the cause is found & corrected asap!
My very best to those glider's as well as their caretakers all animals suffering from this nightmare!

Wished for others to have a peek into this info even though it is a few years old - quite informative - Happy Birdy

A few quotes .....

A word to the wise ---
if you have a powder coated painted cage and it is not stainless Steel -- then get it tested. It does not
make any difference if you have a China made cage,
European made cage or any made cage… if it is
painted then get it tested. Your bird’s life is at
stake

A bird is NOT a human. A bird's system cannot
tolerate ANY lead. So - standards within the avian
community are set by the consumer as - ZERO toxins
in cage paint.
(I would think this is very sound advice for our gliders also)

Importers, distributors, and retailers advertise ALL
of their bird cages to be "Toxicin Free". The
manufactures of bird cages, parrot cages, monkey
cages and other pet cages advertise that their
baked on powder coated paint is non-toxic paint.

-----------------

I recieved link from an OZ friend to SunCoasts newsletter
http://www.sugar-gliders.com/glidervet-111.htm
this morning in regards to their cages & wished
to also make others aware to the above information -

( I purchased my pvc coated 'reptile' cages
(was no glider cages back then)
in the 1990's & was lucky & have had no issues - very lucky,
same with my cockatoo cages although replaced one due to
the powder coating finish eroding.

Last edited by DCMuffin; 06/18/11 08:38 PM. Reason: Edited text

:grey: We will be known forever by the tracks we leave :grey:
http://www.marsupialsociety.org.au/
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1132080
06/18/11 02:16 PM
06/18/11 02:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
fox0r Offline
Glider Guardian
fox0r  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
What you cited above are about painted/powder coated cages, not PVC cages. As far as I'm aware no cages or gliders have tested positive for any toxins, and without proof the problem is the cages there is no legal recourse. The various companies have been recalling and replacing, which is good! Well, some of the companies, anyway.


-Jen

Sugar Mountain - Sugar gliders in Idaho!
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: fox0r] #1132087
06/18/11 02:45 PM
06/18/11 02:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,093
Port Aransas, TX
Pockets Offline
Glider Slave
Pockets  Offline
Glider Slave

Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 2,093
Port Aransas, TX

Understand, but many animals have had serious health issues including death due to powder-coated cages as well.

Am just advising others to be careful selecting their glider's captive habitats & please be aware of the powder coated cages as well, they are not always quite as safe as people think - research as much as possible.


:grey: We will be known forever by the tracks we leave :grey:
http://www.marsupialsociety.org.au/
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: pumpkin] #1134075
06/22/11 12:17 PM
06/22/11 12:17 PM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 202
arizona
K
kittybaran Offline
Glider Explorer
kittybaran  Offline
Glider Explorer
K

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 202
arizona
I had klubertanz wire and rools now sits in my back yard because they are toxic! I lost 9 gliders due to their cages and 4 are on chemo for cancer bebetween 2008 and 2010. When told of the problem they did not even apologize nor offer any sympathy. I can't sell the wire, or throw it away in case someone should find it and use it for some other animal. Klubertanz has cost me over 35 thousand dollars in vet bills.

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1134086
06/22/11 12:45 PM
06/22/11 12:45 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 255
Cincy
Thumper Offline
Glider Explorer
Thumper  Offline
Glider Explorer

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 255
Cincy
I got the same response from Klubertanz. Sending you a pm.


Bobbi

:wfb: :leu: :grey: :rtmo: Jade, Kea, JimBob, Topaz, Sunny, Bruce, Selena, Harlan, Airyelle, George, Gracie and Pugsley.
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1134091
06/22/11 01:00 PM
06/22/11 01:00 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,839
roseville, mi
H
hwh4ev Offline
Glider Addict
hwh4ev  Offline
Glider Addict
H

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,839
roseville, mi
has anybody talked to a lawyer abt. what is going on here.
35,000.00 lost in gliders and vet bills and everybody else
that have lost their gliders or still have sick ones.
seems to me a good lawyer could do something about this- as a class action suit.

on another note to all the still wobbly glider owners out there.
please ask your vet abt. getting a calcium edta shot-it takes out metal poisioning, b12 shots and fluid flushed and oral calcium edta to be taken at home for at least a week.

my trio of gliders had all the symptoms and after this one treatment by my vet and the oral for a week, they are fine and running up their toys and gliding again. being healty gliders.
my vet has seen alot of metal poisioning in birds from cages
and knew what to do immediately, it worked.

take care,
nancy in detroit


regards,
nancy in roseville (formerly in detroit)
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1134097
06/22/11 01:35 PM
06/22/11 01:35 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 255
Cincy
Thumper Offline
Glider Explorer
Thumper  Offline
Glider Explorer

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 255
Cincy
I do have a call into my attorney but I'm not so sure it's going to go anywhere on my end. I did expect more from Klubertanz since their customer service was always so great. It's very disappointing.

The treatment that worked for Nancy's gliders also seems to be working for mine. Mine did not get the oral calcium edta to take at home though. My vet felt too much of it can damage the kidneys. I do have one with yellow skin so he has some liver damage. The symptoms from the toxin in the wire seems to be passing. All my affected gliders are getting SAM-e & subq'd daily and the one with obvious liver damage is also getting milk thistle daily.


Bobbi

:wfb: :leu: :grey: :rtmo: Jade, Kea, JimBob, Topaz, Sunny, Bruce, Selena, Harlan, Airyelle, George, Gracie and Pugsley.
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1134125
06/22/11 03:09 PM
06/22/11 03:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
fox0r Offline
Glider Guardian
fox0r  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Meridian, ID
My Cici hasn't changed so much. She is still really unbalanced in the back end. She has been eating better, though, and seems to be as much of herself as she can be. She has some problems walking around but she seems to be able to climb fine. I'm not so sure she's going to improve anymore.

I've been having a lot of problems with my back lately and been laid up in bed for the most part. Once I heal enough where I can get around a bit easier I think I'll take her back in and see what the vet says. I'll ask about the calcium shot, too.


-Jen

Sugar Mountain - Sugar gliders in Idaho!
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1134127
06/22/11 03:14 PM
06/22/11 03:14 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,839
roseville, mi
H
hwh4ev Offline
Glider Addict
hwh4ev  Offline
Glider Addict
H

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,839
roseville, mi
jen that is a calcium edta injection just not calcium.
wanted you to know there is a big difference.

hope your baby gets better.

regards,
nancy in detroit


regards,
nancy in roseville (formerly in detroit)
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1134394
06/22/11 11:07 PM
06/22/11 11:07 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,830
USA
SugarBlossoms Offline
Serious Glideritis
SugarBlossoms  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,830
USA
Just here to say I am praying for all affected glider kids and their families to get well FAST!! Bobbi, am praying for your babies and Nancy too. ((((HUGS))))


Keeper of Handprints on my Heart, You left your Footprints on my soul.
My precious loves that left to quickly, Peanut, Katie
Isabella, Kiwi, Bonnie and Monroe.

Spread your wings and glide free of pain,
Until the day I see you again.

God speed my precious angels. I love you. Mama.
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1134410
06/22/11 11:27 PM
06/22/11 11:27 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 255
Cincy
Thumper Offline
Glider Explorer
Thumper  Offline
Glider Explorer

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 255
Cincy
Aww thank you Bridget! Dekota is still hanging in there with me. He even gained 2 grams this week! Don't get too excited though...I'm hand feeding his staple. We are all thinking of you here too. You get yourself better. If you're up at midnight on a Monday call me. HUGS smile


Bobbi

:wfb: :leu: :grey: :rtmo: Jade, Kea, JimBob, Topaz, Sunny, Bruce, Selena, Harlan, Airyelle, George, Gracie and Pugsley.
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1137123
06/28/11 03:16 PM
06/28/11 03:16 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,214
Washington D.C. Metro Area
DCMuffin Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
DCMuffin  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,214
Washington D.C. Metro Area
Cages are being shipped from Martin's. Those of you getting replacement cages should begin to receive your notifications. smile

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1137231
06/28/11 05:36 PM
06/28/11 05:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,839
roseville, mi
H
hwh4ev Offline
Glider Addict
hwh4ev  Offline
Glider Addict
H

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,839
roseville, mi
i got an email from martins today, addressed to brandy i/o
my name, so i emailed them back to make sure they are sending the new cage to my address.

i am also concerned that these new powder coated cages
are from the same wire supplier, i would think not after
all this. i am still afraid to put any gliders in the new
cage, very paranoid at this time with cages.

has anybody received replacement cages from martins yet?

regards,
nancy in detroit
p.s. called the vet again yesterday for coco's blood work results and it still is not back
from the lab.

Last edited by hwh4ev; 06/28/11 09:09 PM.

regards,
nancy in roseville (formerly in detroit)
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1137586
06/29/11 10:06 AM
06/29/11 10:06 AM
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 128
Mississippi
M
Midien Offline
Joey Member
Midien  Offline
Joey Member
M

Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 128
Mississippi
I emailed Martin's after reading that they were sending out new cages, and they said I should get a tracking number later today. They said the new cages are the exact same style and size as the previously purchased cages. That leads me to wonder if it is the same wire, but powder coated instead of PVC coated.

Do we know if the testing was done on the wire? (It's been a long time since I read through ALL these threads, and can't remember, though I do remember mention of tests of something coming back negative?) My worry is whether the wire itself is safe underneath that powder coating. I'd LOVE to put the babies in the bigger cage, but don't want them to get hurt. D:

Short of that, is there a way to have our individual cages tested, or would that be insanely complicated/expensive?


~Laura~

<3 :grey: Nox (Approx. OOP 02/15/2011) and Luna :grey: <3
and a puppy - Tucker (Approx. birth 05/2007) <3
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1137588
06/29/11 10:09 AM
06/29/11 10:09 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,214
Washington D.C. Metro Area
DCMuffin Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
DCMuffin  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 28,214
Washington D.C. Metro Area
My cage will be arriving today, it's on the truck for delivery.

Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1137660
06/29/11 12:45 PM
06/29/11 12:45 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 137
FL
J
jimbo Offline
Joey Member
jimbo  Offline
Joey Member
J

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 137
FL
I know there is a way to get cage paint tested for toxic metals, but not sure that helps with the PVC issue...

The best way to find a local lab if you live in a metropolitan area is probably the phone book (they usually don't have web sites); also many are associated with Colleges if you have one near you.

The pricing we have experienced is "per toxic element tested for", with each being $30 or so. So if you test for Lead, Zinc, Arsenic, Cadmium, Chromium, Mercury, and Selenium, this full test = 7 x $30 = $210. Test for Lead only, maybe $30, but we have never done that so not sure. I guess it depends on how "deep" you want the testing to be.

SunCoast has our powder-coated cages tested at a lab that specializes in testing for animal issues. You can see a sample report on black HQ powder-coated cage paint here:

http://www.sugar-gliders.com/images/store/blk-2011.pdf

On the PVC cages, I don't think anyone knows, specifically, what the exact mechanism is that is causing these problems. So getting one of these PVC cages tested would be more of "hunt" to find toxic sources, and so probably more expensive. Perhaps people could donate to one of the glider non-profits to get a test done at an animal tox lab like the one we use.


Jimbo, Webmaster
SunCoast Sugar Gliders
http://www.sugar-gliders.com/
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1138104
06/30/11 03:21 AM
06/30/11 03:21 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,748
New Jersey
JillMarie Offline
Serious Glideritis
JillMarie  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,748
New Jersey
Thanks for posting that report (what a great idea)


:grey: Bosom Buddy Creations:grey:
^website link wink

Remember that God Loves You!
Re: Update on cages and recall -PART THREE [Re: Gizmogirl] #1138257
06/30/11 01:41 PM
06/30/11 01:41 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,747
80 acres of paradise in KS
Dancing Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
Dancing  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,747
80 acres of paradise in KS
I don't believe the cage issues is a "metal" issue. I believe it is some chemical used in the processing of the pvc that is toxic. With all plastics, there is the risk that the process used in manufacturing will leave behind residue that is harmful. But without knowing the processes being used, how would the average "lab" know what to look for?

The manufacture of the toxic pvc coated wire WOULD know and should be held responsible for all the testing (by independent labs) and should be stepping up to make things right for those that have had effected gliders (replacement cages from a trusted source, vet bills, as well as the cost of the animals AND emotional damages). This would take a law suit to achieve I'm afraid.

Jimbo, thank you for your reassurances that Sun Coast is doing what they can to insure the protection and safety for the gliders.


620-704-9109
Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.

I could have missed the pain
But I'd of had to miss the dance


The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.
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