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Gilder being bullied!!! #1421319
09/22/19 12:39 AM
09/22/19 12:39 AM
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 11
Spokane wa
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Misti Offline OP
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Misti  Offline OP
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Spokane wa
I have a juvenile female sugar glider 16 weeks old who only has three legs I’ve had her for about six weeks. 14 days ago I picked up her cage mate who is a juvenile male 12 weeks old. I think she’s afraid of him. they do not crab at each other but they do grapple with each other while making a weird spitting or sneezing kind of sound. When I do see them awake it seems like she avoid him at all costs in the cage And he seems to chase her around a lot. I am not sure if this is normal getting to know you juvenile behavior or if he is being a big meanie head to her because she only has three legs.


Please tell me what to do . I am fairly sure my breeder will allow me to take him back for a different glider if he’s going to be dangerous to her.

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Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421320
09/22/19 03:32 AM
09/22/19 03:32 AM
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 134
DFW, TX
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Xeno Offline
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Do they sleep in the same pouch when given a choice? Any wounds? They might just be figuring out dominance. What is her stance like? Is her tail sticking up in fear stance while they are chasing or when she watches him? Is his?


Dobby :grey: Elric :wfb: Arwen :plat: Eilonwy :leu:
Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421321
09/22/19 04:09 AM
09/22/19 04:09 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
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SW Missouri
Ladymagyver Offline
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Is the male neutered? If not, he may be trying to mate.

We're they introduced right away, or were you able to have them in separate cages before introductions?


Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Be patient,
and
Trust your journey....




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

Stewie :rtmo:
Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421322
09/22/19 09:44 AM
09/22/19 09:44 AM
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 42,901
LittleRock, AR USA
KarenE Offline
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Originally Posted by Misti
I have a juvenile female sugar glider 16 weeks old who only has three legs I’ve had her for about six weeks. 14 days ago I picked up her cage mate who is a juvenile male 12 weeks old. I think she’s afraid of him. they do not crab at each other but they do grapple with each other while making a weird spitting or sneezing kind of sound.

The spitting or sneezing sound is the normal sound of grooming. If you are hearing this from the pouch (do they sleep together) then they are grooming.

When I do see them awake it seems like she avoid him at all costs in the cage And he seems to chase her around a lot. I am not sure if this is normal getting to know you juvenile behavior or if he is being a big meanie head to her because she only has three legs.

So this little male is now 14 weeks old, correct? He is still a baby and so is she for that matter. She seems to be more independent than he is, and IMO, he is just looking for some companionship. I really don't think he is trying to hurt her.

BTW, how did he loose her leg? Was she born that way or what?


Please tell me what to do . I am fairly sure my breeder will allow me to take him back for a different glider if he’s going to be dangerous to her.

If they were mine, I would work on the bonding process with them together. Try carrying them in a bonding pouch together so you can see how they sleep with each other.

Also put two sleeping pouches in the cage so you will know if they prefer sleeping
together or separate, if you don't know that already.


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Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421324
09/22/19 12:44 PM
09/22/19 12:44 PM
Joined: Jul 2019
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Spokane wa
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Misti Offline OP
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Spokane wa
There is 6 pouches to choose from in the cage to sleep in. So they get to choose if they want to sleep together. I can not see any wounds on either of them but neither of them likes me to pick them up so I’m not checking every inch. She does stick her tail straight up sometimes while she is watching him. She also does not really run from him much because when she does he is so much faster that he catches her and bites her. Then they ball up and make that sneezing sound. Is this just very excited grooming or what?


He is neutered that is why I got him 4 weeks after her. The vet could not get him in sooner then that. She had her leg amputated at about 5 weeks OOP due to an infected wound. The breeder found it and took her to the vet and they were able to take the leg to save her life. But her other back foot has no nails and is slightly deformed as well so she is quite slow by comparison. I have had to make lots of special arrangements in her cage including fabric on the bottom because it’s hard for her to stand on bars. I also have a net across the whole cage Incase she falls.
At the end of the day I just don’t want to risk him knocking her off the wall and her getting hurt.

I always do everything together with them Tent time, bonding pouch time, Treats and everything I do with both. She is more bonded to me because I’ve had her longer but I am very careful not to play favorites and they will both sleep all day happy as can be in a bonding scarf. I do that at least 4 days of 7 so they are being exposed to as many smells and such of my life. I’m a stay at gone mom so I get to have them with me all day.

Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421328
09/22/19 10:10 PM
09/22/19 10:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 134
DFW, TX
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Xeno Offline
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They have six pouches but how often do they sleep in the same one?

Sticking her tail straight up is a sign of fear. It is not an automatic indicator of dangerous conflict. Mine will do it when spooked or they are working out dominance. Occasionally it happens when one of the girls is in heat.

Balling up can be wrestling and I know of gliders that ball up all the time. If they have been together for two weeks and no one is hurt they are probably just wrestling. Best way to find out is to stay up one night and watch them. Gliders tend to be on best behavior when the humans are around but if you sit still long enough and watch they will often revert to normal behavior. When he bites her does she accept it or does she panic? Gliders sometimes bite when mating. If he has not broken the skin yet he is probably not trying to hurt her. Male gliders sometimes try to mate even when neutered but that should not be ongoing even when she is not in heat.

I am not sure of the sounds. If it is spitting they might be grooming. If it is hissing they might be talking. sounds like they sleep together just fine in the bonding pouch which I doubt would work if they hated each other.

I would just watch them. He will probably calm down a little bit once he has been neutered a little longer. Your girl will sadly always have a risk of falling but better that slight risk over the greater risk of loneliness causing depression or self-harm.

Another option might be to separate them temporarily and keep their cages close and hope the loneliness makes him behave better once you reintroduce.

I am a relative amateur though. Others may have better advice.

Last edited by Xeno; 09/22/19 10:11 PM.

Dobby :grey: Elric :wfb: Arwen :plat: Eilonwy :leu:
Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421329
09/23/19 12:33 AM
09/23/19 12:33 AM
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 11
Spokane wa
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Misti Offline OP
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Spokane wa
They have only slept in separate pouches two nights out of the 20 days they have been together.

No one has drawn blood.

The sound sneezing sound is something that she makes at him when he jumps on her or grabs at her. It is the single most common noise I hear all night. No crabbing but twice ever. No barking since he moved in to the cage. But the spitting or sneezing noise happens all the time when they are out of the pouch.

Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421336
09/24/19 05:08 AM
09/24/19 05:08 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,717
SW Missouri
Ladymagyver Offline
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SW Missouri
I think Xeno has a good perspective on this.

At this point it does sound like juvenile play. Just watch them.

Do they have a glider safe wheel and toys?

Do you have an OE (Open environment) pouch?

What other things are in the cage? ( Like hammocks, bridges, vines)

What type or size is the cage?


Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Be patient,
and
Trust your journey....




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

Stewie :rtmo:
Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421341
09/24/19 01:17 PM
09/24/19 01:17 PM
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 11
Spokane wa
M
Misti Offline OP
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Misti  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 11
Spokane wa
Yes they have a wheel and climbing vines from fleece, toy boxes and ball pits. The cage is 32x19x 60in tall. I add different little boxes they can open for treats ever night and move the stuff in the cage every few days to make sure they don’t get board. After watching them the last two nights I am fairly certain the noise I am hearing is her telling him to leave her alone. He is a very active young man with much busyness to attend to and she is not so much. My primary concern was that he was bullying her because of her disability now I am convinced that is not the problem. I think he’s just wanting to play and she is not my plan moving forward is to get a third sugar glider so he will have someone to play with so he will leave her alone is it always been our intention to have a larger colony anyway.

Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421342
09/24/19 03:26 PM
09/24/19 03:26 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,717
SW Missouri
Ladymagyver Offline
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Ladymagyver  Offline
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Posts: 3,717
SW Missouri
Awesome! That will help him a bunch. Re arranging or changing out toys every few days helps too.


sounds like my Stewie. He is over rambunctious. Fiona tries to keep up, but it's not enough for him. I have a wheel and a treadmill in their cage. He jumps in the wheel, and while it's moving, he jumps to the treadmill and spins it up fast. Jumps off and watches them both spin at the same time. When they start to slow down, he dives from the top of the cage onto the treadmill with a loud thump, leaps into the wheel and repeats all night long. He also goes crazy in the runabout I made. It rolls across the floor.


Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Be patient,
and
Trust your journey....




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

Stewie :rtmo:
Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421345
09/24/19 03:56 PM
09/24/19 03:56 PM
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 11
Spokane wa
M
Misti Offline OP
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Misti  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 11
Spokane wa
Lol that sounds just like Echo! I’m glad it’s nothing to worry about.

Re: Gilder being bullied!!! [Re: Misti] #1421423
10/03/19 12:30 AM
10/03/19 12:30 AM
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 11
Spokane wa
M
Misti Offline OP
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Misti  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 11
Spokane wa
So now I know that the sound is Sen telling Echo that she doesn’t like what he is doing. Three days ago I just got to standard great female sisters they are the same age Echo. We were little bit crabby according to my breeder so I got the set for a great price. we were very busy this weekend so rather than doing the introductions at my breeders place in her bonding can’t my husband just picked them up and we decided to try the introductions here. The crappy girls and echo hit it off instantly!!! The girls even were climbing all over me and I didn’t get bit once. :D. when the problem started, Sen came out of her pouch and promptly attacked the new girls. I first I thought it was just a fluke because she was startled it didn’t happen another four times before I finally got everyone in separate zipping pouches and called Tent time for the day. this all happened on Sunday since then I have the cages set close enough to see and smell but not close enough for anyone to hurt anyone else. I have been swapping cage toys couches and blankets for them to get used to each other scent. The first night I’ll Sen did was stand on the edge of the cage and stare at the new gliders with her tail strait up. Last night and tonight she is very interested in sniffing the fleece robe that smells like the other gliders but she is not mean mugging them in the cage anymore.

So the question is when and how do I attempt to introduce these guys to each other again!??!!?!


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