GliderCENTRAL

Quarantine time needs to be changed!!!

Posted By: suggiemom1980

Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/22/09 02:05 PM

My vet just called and said Anu DOES have giardia! cry As soon as I'm done with this, I'm headed over to get their med (treating both Anu & Aruru since they're cage mates). They have to be treated for seven days.

The day after I got them, I had a local vet run fecals on them. He said he saw nothing wrong. Two weeks later, my regular vet finds giardia! She said they may not have been in the shedding cycle for the first fecal.

My question is this: How long are the shedding cycles for common parasites? I know roundworm is two to three weeks because I had Roo tested at two week intervals instead of thirty days. Thankfully, his first fecal showed roundworms so I routinely checked him every two weeks after that. Even more thankfully, I had decided to do the same for any new gliders coming into my home, instead of the standard 30 days. What parasites show up at times other than our standard thirty days?

How many parasites are being missed because their shedding cycle doesn't match the fecals 30 day quarantine time???[/b][/u]

If many parasites have a shedding cycle of just two weeks, maybe fecals should be done that often, instead of waiting thirty days??? Twice now, checking every two weeks, instead of thirty days, has caught a major, life-threatening parasite!

I am very concerned about this!!! It scares me to death to think I may have missed the giardia, by missing the shedding cycle, by doing a 30 day quarantine instead of 14. Who knows how long before I would have caught it, since their routine physicals aren't due again for months!!! The suffering they would have gone thru! How many would have possibly died??? cry

I have thirty other gliders! I could have gotten all my babies infected! cry I'm going to talk to my vet more about this and let you know what she says when I get back. I'd really like to hear what others think about the quarantine time and changing it.
Posted By: LSardou

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/22/09 05:35 PM

I too have been concerned about the parasite staying inactive even after the 30 day quarantine.
I have my theories, but would like to hear what your vet has to say.
Thank you for bringing this up. I sure am happy to hear that you followed protocol and had them checked when you did.
Posted By: sugarlope

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/22/09 08:18 PM

Giardia can be shed for up to 6 months (in animals and humans) after an active infection. Also important to realize, something like Giardia can be missed. An example that I recently put in one of the other Giardia threads - I took my gliders in for fecals, because of previous Giardia infection, and she ran the tests and they were all negative. Before we left that visit, one of them pooped again and it was slightly softer. She wanted to double check it, and sure enough - Giardia.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/22/09 08:31 PM

How are they getting it though? Is it because of a new glider coming in?
Posted By: sugarlope

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/22/09 09:06 PM

The reality is that Giardia is everywhere. It is so frustrating when you get a parasite in your colony and for 7 years, I didn't have one. I drove myself crazy trying to figure out where it could have come from (I had a new glider come into my population around that time also, but had also been to a get together, my other gliders had been away from me for 3 weeks because I was on a trip...) so STRESS, STRESS, STRESS for all involved and a month later 3 of them were testing positive and one got really sick really fast.

If you have ever been to a public swimming pool, you have been exposed, if you or someone you know has had a bad bout of diarrhea, chances are that at some point or other, that may have been caused by Giardia. It can be found in water, it can be found of fruits and vegetables. With gliders just as in humans, if they have a good immune system and are not introduced to anything that can decrease their immune level (stress, recent illness, depression, etc.) then they can fight it off. They still may carry it for a period of time, but they may not get 'sick' from it. Of my three gliders that have tested positive, one of them has never shown any signs of illness at all (no loss of appetite, no diarrhea/soft stool, nothing like that). And the other three have NEVER tested positive or shown any signs of illness.
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/22/09 09:35 PM

Thank you, Linda. I'm just being a responsible pet owner. :-) I too, wonder about after the 30 days. Maybe we should have fecals done routinely, every month?

Gretchen, my vet did say that it can be easily missed. I was concerned because the other vet who did the first set of fecals is not one of my three vets I go to. I just happened to be under the weather and someone was taking their dog to him and I asked if they could take the fecals for me so I didn't have to get out and drive for an hour.
I know giardia can show itself when gliders are stressed. I considered that was why it was missed at the first fecal and caught the second time. But my main concern here, is how in the world do we protect our babies better than we are now? What can we learn from this and what needs to be changed? My gliders get fecals and urinalysis every six months. More often if I've had a new comer. Even tho my gliders are two rooms away from Anu and Aruru, they will all get fecals done next week, ESP Roo, who is still so very fragile. I check their pooh every day when I check them and how much they've eaten the night before. If anything looked unusual. I'd be the first one at the vet. I freeze their food (even mealies) before using it because I know freezing is supposed to kill most parasites.

What else can I do to protect my babies??? Am I missing anything??? This is unbearably, heartbreakingly frustrating!

AmyLynn, yes, these were two rescue gliders that were brought to me.
http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/775853/1

I forgot to say, my vet was in surgery when I picked up the medicine this morning, so I sent her an email asking the questions about parasites and our fur babies. I'll let you know what she says. She may not respond til Tues since this is a holiday weekend.
Posted By: LabNGliderMom

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 01:21 AM

All of my glider's food os frozen prior to consumption EXCEPT their mealies... those only get refrigerated... thankfully, NO giardia here!
Posted By: cyndiekb

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 01:31 AM

I do fecals 4 times a year and if I even think something is off we are getting check ups. (took one to the vet for being fat blush )
Posted By: sugarlope

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 03:06 AM

Giardia cysts can remain viable up to -20 degrees Celsius for some amount of time, so I would not assume that will do it every time. Boiling is the best to make the cysts inert.

I also want to say that for nearly 7 years I thought I was doing 'everything right' too - never had any parasites in my colony...until I did. I tried to follow proper quarantine procedures before everyone got sick and nothing else had changed, but it CAN happen to anyone.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 03:14 AM

I have been thinking about this all day now. Everyone goes in to be checked again in July. I wonder if they can get it from our drinking water. Who knows. I just don't know how mine would come into contact with it if they are not around any other water source or any other animals. And I wash their fruits and veggies very well. I never cut into anything until its washed. So are mine at risk? I will talk to both my vets on Tuesday.
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 03:16 AM

Thanks, Gretchen. I didn't know that about the freezing. Sigh. We all just want the absolute best for our babies but it seems we're not going to have 100% safety with them, no matter what we do. I guess I'll just continue doing decals every two weeks for every new glider and/or infected glider, until they're 'cured', then fecals once a month for at least six months. Actually, I think I'm just going to say the heck with it and EVERYONE gets fecals once a month, regardless. My vet doesn't charge much for float and smear and it's the only thing that will keep me from worrying myself sick all the time.
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 03:31 AM

Originally Posted By: AmyLynn
I have been thinking about this all day now. Everyone goes in to be checked again in July. I wonder if they can get it from our drinking water.

I only use bottle spring water. My tap water has too many "floaties" in it. I won't even drink it, let alone use it for my babies. Do let us know what your vets say!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 03:42 AM

Ok I will.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 04:07 AM

Gosh.. so sorry to hear that. I hope everyone is ok. My gliders get their normal 6 months checks. Is it in tap water? Or should I switch to distilled or spring water? I don't swim in public pools, however, I have two girls in public schools.. Can they bring it home? Kinda paranoid..
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 04:10 AM

Ok. I have a question. Do you still do a quaranteen if the new gliders you are introducing are from the same place you got your origional gliders?
Also, what if you are getting a glider from a close friend that you trust and know her gliders are very healthy?
I was just thinking about this as I was reading through this thread. I also thought that using bottle water was the safest? Correct me if I'm wrong. Thanks!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 04:12 AM

I have always made it a habit of washing my hands in hot water with antibacterial soap before touching my glider. I also make my kid's do the same. It makes me less paranoid about germs getting accidently passed along.
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 04:20 AM

Originally Posted By: sheila82
Gosh.. so sorry to hear that. I hope everyone is ok. My gliders get their normal 6 months checks. Is it in tap water? Or should I switch to distilled or spring water? I don't swim in public pools, however, I have two girls in public schools.. Can they bring it home? Kinda paranoid..

I don't think it's in tap water but tap water has so much stuff added to it, including fluoride, that gliders certainly don't need. I don't drink it and don't want my babies to drink it either. I don't know about the swimming pools. I would think the chloride would kill germs but I can't say for certain. Your girls could possibly bring giardia home (although I think it would be rare) but they could also bring home other germs and viruses. I always taught my kids to wash their hands every time they turned around. Now, they teach their kids to not only do the same, but to also carry hand sanitizer with them and use often.
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 04:28 AM

Originally Posted By: NavyChiefWife
Ok. I have a question. Do you still do a quaranteen if the new gliders you are introducing are from the same place you got your origional gliders?
Also, what if you are getting a glider from a close friend that you trust and know her gliders are very healthy?
I was just thinking about this as I was reading through this thread. I also thought that using bottle water was the safest? Correct me if I'm wrong. Thanks!

If they are coming from different times, then yes, you need to quarantine. It isn't a matter of trusting the person you get your glider from. As it was pointed out earlier, we don't know what all sources parasites can come from. Her gliders can look healthy, while carrying bacteria or parasites. Anu looks and acts perfectly healthy, eats well, is active and his poo is sold. BUT, he has giardia. Even an sick glider will hide their illness until it can't hide it anymore. You can't always tell how sick or healthy a glider is by the way it looks. That's why quarantine and fecals are so vital. Bottled water is best. I use spring water because it has no additives. Be sure to check the label. Spring water isn't the same as filtered water. I buy gallon jugs of spring water for $.82!
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 04:30 AM

Originally Posted By: NavyChiefWife
I have always made it a habit of washing my hands in hot water with antibacterial soap before touching my glider. I also make my kid's do the same. It makes me less paranoid about germs getting accidently passed along.

That's an excellent point, Brandi! Hands are notorious for being the biggest cause of spreading germs! I have bottles of hand sanitizer all over my house and carry some with me. When I shop, I go to the store that offers sanitizing wipes for shopping cart handles.
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 04:35 AM

I'd like to point out, I make sure my hand sanitizer has dried before touching any of my gliders. I don't want a drunk glider! LOL!
Posted By: JillMarie

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 10:55 AM

this is one of the reasons why I dont let anyone except my immediate family touch my gliders. My coworkers think I am nuts cause they all want to touch her, but I say NO WAY! I tell them "NO! I dont know where you've been" LOL and if they get upset, tough! to those I like I will say "I dont kiss you, but I do kiss my gliders, so you can not touch because I dont kiss you!" LOL
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 01:49 PM

Unfortunately parasites are everywhere in the enviroment and we cannot avoid them.

For example, adult dogs and cats can be infected with coccidia and NEVER show any symptoms. They eliminate in our yards, (along with the neighbors pets) and then walk around our yards and can carry the parasites right into our homes. We can pick it up on our shoes too and bring it in.

To keep your home parasite free you would need to have the equalivent of a sterile hospital enviroment. You'd have to put on a jumpsuit, cover your hair and skin and shoes and lets face it, are we going to do that? No, but routine fecals and well checks are easy to do and need to be done regularly to ensure our gliders are healthy and parasite free.
Posted By: sketchyglider

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/23/09 04:55 PM

we havent had any parasites in our colony yet *knocks on wood* but everyone still gets routine check ups and fecals. My boyfriend and I shower everyday before we even go into our room. I ecspecially need to considering i handle animals all day and we do currently have 4 puppies with coccidia. We also keep hand sanitizer right outside the door before we go in. They other animals are not allowed in our room ecspecially the cats because they are outdoor/indoor kitties. and the family must put on clean clothes and wash and sanitize hands before they are allowed in.
My job (animal caretaker) and my moms job( shes a CNA) make me very leary of going into the glider room if not totally clean.
Posted By: LabNGliderMom

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/25/09 03:03 PM

Never underestimate the power of handwashing!
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/30/09 01:02 PM

Am at a site now, reading about parasites. Unfortunately, it's not about sugar gliders but I would think they would be the same for all animals.
Parasitology
It states briefly, that repeated fecal exams over a 3-5 day period will better ensure a positive sample being identified.
After reading this, any new gliders who come into my home, will be tested daily for a week, then at two weeks, four weeks and six weeks. This is, of course, providing they have clean fecals. If they don't, the testing will continue for six months.

I'm headed back to read more. If anyone wants the link, let me know and I'll PM it to you.
Posted By: GliderKitten

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/30/09 09:02 PM

I get the concern and more frequent fecals and new quarentine times are all a good idea, but if we get too concerned with "sanitize everything" you just risk a very poor immune system. They get passed on some immunizations from their parents and like people, and all other animals, with slight exposure to bacteria and parasites they develop a slight immunity, hence another reason why they can get infected and not get sick.

I'm not saying don't wash hands and all that, it's all good advice and good ideas but as it's been said already, exposure risks are EVERYWHERE, I'm in vet school and believe me minimal exposure can be a good thing. Definitely still follow safety procedures like washing fruit and hands and not using tap water, but don't fret over eliminating ALL risks EVERYWHERE because it's impossible and potentially unhealthy.
Posted By: sugarglidersuz

Re: Quarantine time needs to be changed!!! - 05/31/09 10:53 AM

I found out after my Mambo died on 5/01/09 that there is a more conclusive test that can be run for giardia - it is called zinc centrifugation. If you suspect that your glider may have a parasite, request that your vet order this test instead of the standard Fecal Float and Fecal Smear that we are used to ordering.
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