GliderCENTRAL

Question about glue

Posted By: Dancing

Question about glue - 10/09/08 08:52 PM

Ok, so I've asked one of my vets and he told me the same thing the human opthamologist I used to work for told me. I would like more input.

What is the difference between Super Glue and the surgical super glue they use at the vets office or even in humans?

And if they are the same, why is it safe to use when neutering (including the extra drops for the glider to focus on in stead of the surgery site) but it isn't safe to make toys with?
Posted By: Laurens_Babies

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 08:55 PM

I always used super glue on cuts and stuff when I was working for a groomer. Stings like crazy but when your in water all the time bandaids just don't work. Dunno about the toys though lmao just thought I would share.
Posted By: cinnamonstix

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 08:59 PM

I do not know but with what we have experienced, avoid glue at all costs when possible. Only use it if it is NEEDED. My friends glider had removed his stitch, gotten a scab, then the vet covered the are with glue, three weeks in a collar this boy spent. We tried and tried to ease the glue off, nothing would budge it. We took him to the vet and the vet peeled it away but his fur came along with it, so he was bald and sore. Sore for a day, fur took weeks to grow back. He needed to be collared due to attempt to SM...all around it could have gone better and much faster without that darn glue. He is a very very stubborn boy, well now he is an angel and 100% passive. Lol.
Posted By: sweetheart26

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 09:01 PM


I always used super on any cuts i get on my hands...im not share why its not safe to use it to make glider toys ..thats a good question to ask..maybe it becouse they would try to eat the glue..but doesnt all glue have to be child safe anyway?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 09:07 PM

I believe the surgical super glue is sterile, although I can't imagine bacteria or viral agents surviving in that chemical mix!
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 09:18 PM

With what I've been reading, this glue was first made way back in 1942. It was used during Vietnam in the field to stop bleeding with severe wounds and saved many many lives.

It wasn't originally approved by the FDA for medical uses though because of the tendency to "irritate the skin" and possibly cause some skin burns. But this is in it's wet form, not after it is dry. However, using it on toys where it is completely dry before allowing the gliders near it, I don't think should be a problem at all.

It also seems to be the same chemical compound used in the "liquid bandages". Now I would't put it on the wound of a glider but if it is safe to use on animals and humans alike, then why would it be unsafe to use on toys?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanoacrylate
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 09:19 PM

Quote:
I believe the surgical super glue is sterile, although I can't imagine bacteria or viral agents surviving in that chemical mix!


That could be but it is (like everything else) only sterile until it comes out of the container. This would be important in wound care but with toys, it shouldn't matter. Trust me, 10 minutes in a glider's cage and NO toy is sterile.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 09:27 PM

roflmao roflmao roflmao roflmao roflmao
Posted By: sweetheart26

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 09:36 PM


lol smile smile
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 10:42 PM

I cant seem to find anything listing WHY it is dangerous if ingested, but there are many sources that say if it is ingested (dry) then to seek medical attention immediately. Specifically there is several mentions to the difficulty of swallowing liquid superglue - which I know has not much to do with toys as the glue would be dry. But like I said before, several places say super glue IS toxic and that if it is ingested even when dry to seek medical attention immediately.

Im still searching. If I come up with why I'll post it.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 11:39 PM

see, I've not found a single site that says it is toxic. Obviously you don't want anything consuming it wet (can you imagine your lips glued to your tongue!) And if it is toxic, then why has the FDA approved it for surgical use?
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/09/08 11:39 PM

So what I've been able to gather on this super glue topic is this:

There are two basic types of "super glue":

ethyl cyanoacrylate - which is the one usually found in your household super glue package.

AND

methyl cyanoacrylate - which is usually the formula used in medical grade/surgical glue because of its lower toxicity.

Both are toxic to a degree, if ingested, inhailed, or skin contact. However packages CAN be labeled "non-toxic if used as directed" even when containing either compound.

Ethyl cyanoacrylate if ingested and/or exposed to water to break down will break down into a couple components including formaldehyde. Formaldehyde is dangers and poisonous.

Pretty much that is all I can find on this topic. It sure is HARD to research.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:01 AM

Everything I've read so far has to do with both in LIQUID form, not dried form.....researching further....
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:16 AM

Ethyl 2-cyanoacrylate - is a clear, colourless liquid with a strong, acrid odor. It reacts readily with water to form a solid polymer. It is soluble in methyl ethyl ketone, toluene, acetone, N,N-dimethylformamide, and nitromethane.

Contact with alcohols, amines, or water may cause polymerization.

Degradation products include formaldehyde.

Thermal decomposition products may include hydrogen cyanide and oxides of carbon and nitrogen.
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:18 AM

Super glue is NOT safe to ingest from everything I can find. Not dry or liquid (although sources say it is almost impossible to ingest liquid super glue lol).
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:23 AM

By all means, post the links to your sources for me.

Again, I've not found a single source for information on dried glues.
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:30 AM

Do you think Im making these up T? LOL

Im always worried about linking the wrong sites on GC, I do want to keep things G-rated. Would you like me to PM them to you?
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:51 AM

Not at all Kinue. Like you, I am trying to do as much research on this as I can and I can't find anything on dried glues (either type). If you don't want to post the links, would you pm them to me?

I just don't understand how they can use it as surgical glue if it is toxic.

I see where the concern for formaldahyde is. Same reason you shouldn't let a child or animal play on new house hold carpet (loaded with formaldahyde!)

I also would like this information, documentation, to pass on to my vet and several others that I know use these glues on animals.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:54 AM

Oh, I did find on one site where they did some testing with rats. Again, this was liquid form of both types. In one test, they exposed the rats to the vapors. Another where they forced injestion. In the rats that died, the necropsies found large hard masses in the stomach, which they concluded was the polymerized glue. That is why you shouldn't injest it liquid. Seems like a no brainer there to me. lol (again, picturing tongue glued to lips)
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 01:22 AM

You should of found on the same sites that have those stuides - the mention of the degradation of the glue when exposed to water?

And super glue's when exposed to water (like in the body) turn into their dry form IMMEDIATELY. Just because rats were given the liquid form orally, it does not remain liquid once in their system.

In the same study you are referencing they also gave rats much less orally and it was radioactivly detected in their urine, showing it was absorbed into their system.

Its all brought up on google search, there's just alot to pick through and ALOT of reading of BIG articles to find the info. Just those studies weren't ever dont long term and not investigated fully on animals. Sadly.
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 01:25 AM

Dry glue breaks down into harmful chemicals, thats why both dry and liquids are dangerous. Not to mention liquids can burn the mouth from the chemical reaction.. But like was said before, super glue companies claim its impossible to swallow super glue, but warn if ingestion occurs to seek medical attention immediately?

I dunno. Weird huh?
Posted By: hipbchik

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:08 AM

Wow Teresa...you've ALWAYS been against the use of glue...how much of a kickback are you getting from the sale of the new wheel??
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:18 AM

As I posted on LGG, this has nothing to do with the wheels. NOR do I get any money what so ever from B's wheels. If I choose to buy one, I pay the same as everyone else does. This is not about the wheels.

As I also posted on LGG...

So, if the research shows that the household type of super glue is unsafe, is it safe to use the surgical type to make toys. If not, why?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:20 AM

Is there something that we consumers need to know here?

Edited to say that if TGI discontinued the sale of the Custom Cruiser for a safety reason & failed to notify the people who purchased the wheel via THEIR website - they have a legal issue on their hands, and frankly, IF that happened, I would be VERY ANGRY!
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:30 AM

THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE WHEEL!
Posted By: BeckiT

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:32 AM

Originally Posted By: Dancing
So, if the research shows that the household type of super glue is unsafe, is it safe to use the surgical type to make toys. If not, why?
Surgical glue is made to glue skin, not plastic or other toy materials. This alone I think would make it unsafe because it's not going to give you as strong a bond as super glue would...
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:35 AM

But does that mean that it would be toxic? Also, from what I've read, neither were developed specifically as a medical item. That is just one of the benefits from it.
Posted By: princessmegi

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:46 AM

T, not sure what your issue is, but I won't be risking it with my gliders. If one of yours had an issue with the super glue, I would love to see the results of the necropsy.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:47 AM

Originally Posted By: Dancing
With what I've been reading, this glue was first made way back in 1942. It was used during Vietnam in the field to stop bleeding with severe wounds and saved many many lives.


I wouldn't rely on what they said the government used during the Vietnam War.....they also used Agent Orange....

and dunno if I can put this hear or not but


Cyanoacrylate (CA) has been used as both a commercial and tissue adhesiveIt can be concluded that, if CA adhesive is used for repair of broken dentures, it will release substances which are toxic to human oral fibroblast cells.
Posted By: hipbchik

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:48 AM

It has EVERYthing to do with the wheel since SUPER glue was used to lock the crews into place in the wheel, not SURGICAL glue. They have completely different main active ingredients...one is safe for surgical use and one is not.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:54 AM

Quote:
I wouldn't rely on what they said the government used during the Vietnam War.....they also used Agent Orange....


I certainly don't argue that one at all.

So, house hold superglue is toxic due to the formahyde break down. What about the surgical type?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 02:57 AM

nope ............its not the same compound
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:01 AM

http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/569097/Searchpage/1/Main/55634/Words/%2Bsuper+%2Bglue/Search/true/Tape_or_glue_okay#Post569097

http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/533195/Searchpage/1/Main/51926/Words/%2Bsuper+%2Bglue/Search/true/Re_Questions_relating_surgical#Post533195


These are both examples where super glue was questioned in the past.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:03 AM

<shrug> Im not even gonna look let me ask you this Teresa........what do YOU want to do with super glue & a sugar glider? or is this just a hypothetical question?
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:04 AM

So again I ask, would the surgical type be safe to use on toys?
Posted By: USMom

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:05 AM

Why would you want to use glue in toys? What kind of toy needs glue?
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:05 AM

I have some toys in mind involving some of the large wiffle balls. I've not made one (with super glue or surgical glue either) but wanted to ask about it to see if it would be safe or not.
Posted By: krysKritters

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:05 AM

I, personally would NOT use or trust anything not intended for animals... more specifically sugargliders....

Chocolate is safe for humans but poisonous to many animal species... An FDA approval doesn't matter when it comes to animals...
That's just my opinion...
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:06 AM

and so then I will ask of you, again. What toy is so important to YOU that you would even think of risking a gliders life that you would come here and ask peoples opinions, and not take the scientists quotes as word enough?
Posted By: Jackie_Chans_Mom

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:07 AM

Surgical glue is created to hold TISSUE together - not plastic, acrylic or metal or any other substance used in toys. Correct?

It is simply not worth the risk - at least not in my home, not with my babies. Let's all remember that toothpaste is SAFE to put in our own mouths, but is not safe to injest. Period. That is why there is a warning on toothpaste packaging. So, the reasoning that something that is safe for use ON the body is safe to be injested does not hold up.

I would think, also, that if you were planning to vend these toys, you would not get many sales given as how you have created a huge topic about it and allowed many to see that you are argueing in favor of something that is not proven safe. If you were planning to make toys with glue and put them in your own cages, then you KNOW, Teresa, that when you have another questionable death in your home, you will be questioned about your toys and the glue - unless this time you were to get a necropsy.
So, it would seem to me that it would be in your best interest, T, to drop the subject.
Posted By: USMom

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:07 AM

So, why would you use glue? Why not weld them?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:07 AM

ok fair enough...........I am by no means ANY expert on ANYTHING but I would say NO NO NO and In YOUR heart your saying no no no....you knew the answer before you asked the question
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:09 AM

With the wiffle balls, IF the surgical glue is safe, then I would buy some and test it here as far as how it will hold up to washings and such. Currently I use a ton of zip ties and stainless steel rings to make my toys and it works. But with the new idea I have been toying with, the glue would be easier IF IT WERE SAFE.
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:10 AM

As a wise friend of mine said...

Quote:

Now, if you'll excuse me - I have some toothpaste drying on toys in the other room. I figure it is safe to use on toys since it is safe to put in my mouth. Pay no attention to the warning on the toothpaste packaging that says to call poison control if ingested.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:11 AM

Quote:
Why not weld them?


How would I weld them? I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I've just not heard of welding plastic.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:12 AM

Im still gonna say why risk it? its just not worth it when you have so many other options that you already know are safe for your gliders. There is NO TESTING ever worth a gliders life.....RIGHT?
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:14 AM

Honestly, if I wasn't concerned about glider safety, I wouldn't be asking.

And for the toy I have in mind, like I said, the glue (SURGICAL IF SAFE) would work well. IF it is safe, the testing would be for durablity and not in the glider's cages until I was sure it would hold up and BE safe. But I am interested in this "welding" thing. How would I do that?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:16 AM

I would get a soldering iron & melt the plastic together - my ex husband used to use something to plastic-weld the plastic pieces on his dirt bikes dunno
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:17 AM

Im thinkin you couldn't weld plastic ....... but could you use a soldering gun and melt the plastic balls together?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:17 AM

LOL Great minds think alike Gina LOLOLOL
Posted By: USMom

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:19 AM

Just like welding metal, you heat it and melt it together. It can also be done chemically, but that puts us right back at the start of this discussion.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:19 AM

Thank you Gina. I'll try the soldering iron idea.


Thank you too Shawna, we were posting at the same time.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:24 AM

OH well your welcome anyway Teresa
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:54 AM

Both glues are to some degree toxic if ingested. So says the labels on the product. If ingested seek medical attention immediately. Not to mention that they are not intended to be consumed and have proven to be absorbed into the system and passed into the urine for BOTH types of glue.

It would be something to use at your own risk. The long term effects have not been studied. Only the one-time exposures. And in large quantities some animals did die like you stated before.
Posted By: USMom

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 04:30 AM

Seems like there are several great minds here.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 05:52 AM

Ok,I was doing some more reading just for curiosity sake and found some interesting information.

It seems that the concern with the super glue stated here is it breaking down to formaldehyde.

Well, some interesting info on formaldehyde (check this on wikipedia).

Formaldehyde is a antibacterial that kills most bacteria and their spores.

It also is used as a preservative in vaccines. And in things like the meds that remove warts.

Formaldehyde is used as a wet-strenth resin in sanitary paper products (facial tissue, table napkins, and roll towels) so this means every time we blow our noses we are exposing ourselfs to formaldehyde. It is used in the manufacturing of plywood and househould carpet.

The fabric industry uses formaldehyde in crease resistant fabrics.

It is also used in some shampoo products.

Also, the human body naturally produces formaldehyde.

Pretty interesting reading!
Posted By: Lynsie

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 06:51 AM

Obviously you have already made up your mind that super glue is okay so why keep asking for opinions when your not going to listen to them? I think you have been provided some very good advice already. I personally will not be exposing my gliders to a substance that may or may not be toxic to them.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 07:04 AM

I conceeded that the household type of super glue would be considered unsafe but NO one has given any reason why the surgical glue is unsafe to use other than it might not be durable. Well if it can be tested for durablility and proves to be durable, then why would it be unsafe to use SURGICAL glue to make toys?

If it is safe for them to injest while grooming themselves post neuter, then why would the surgical type be unsafe for toy making?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 08:12 AM

Originally Posted By: Dancing
the glue would be easier


Theres no proof that it IS safe, so it isn't worth the risk. Just because something might be easier, it isnt safer. IF theres other safe ways, it isnt even worth trying. I wouldn't personally EVER try it.

And anyone can edit Wiki, it isnt a 100% reliable source. Also..Gliders dont get vaccines, nor do they need wart removal. (And that stuff you can ONLY USE on the wart, and they make it very clear that it can cause permanent skin damage on people.) Gliders also dont use tiolet paper, or shampoo. We risk ourselves to all sorts of things, but it isnt worth doing it to our pets.
Posted By: Laurens_Babies

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 08:45 AM

I think the topic is no longer about using household super glue. I think the question is now if its safe to use surgical glue on neuters where the glider grooms and can digest why can't surgical glue be safe on toys?? Maybe in an area where gliders couldn't get to easily??
Posted By: Xfilefan

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 11:23 AM

I wouldn't use it. I wouldn't let a glider pick at it when used on skin-if they won't leave it alone-get a collar. I would not want it on a toy-because by God mine will find a way to get at it.

The first thing I had expected someone to mention (and they didn't) was this part of the chemical name of EITHER glue:

CYANO

Which is short for CYANIDE. A CYANO-anything has a cyanide component, most of which are toxic, some are deadly-even the normally non deadly can be if exposure is in sufficient amount.

A web search for CYANO will turn up a lot of info-including toxicities. Any compound with that in it's name and a red flag should go up-potassium cyanide is the instantly deadly one most have heard of-but all but one form (in a color-prussian blue) have some degree of toxicity.
Posted By: Laurens_Babies

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 11:38 AM

Originally Posted By: Xfilefan
I wouldn't let a glider pick at it when used on skin-if they won't leave it alone-get a collar.


Ok just being picky here.. the glue doesnt just disappear in a day.. still there. So I'm talking more about regular grooming.. A glider doesn't have to pick or SM after a neuter to come into contact with that glue.
Posted By: Xfilefan

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 11:53 AM

Externally the toxic effects of that variant should be minimal as long as it's not ingested. So far (since gluing after neuters on gliders has BEEN the lab tests on this)skin contact is survivable. Whether they have itching, burning, other effects...who knows? They aren't going to start talking and tell us. No studies have been done on them. It's "assumed" they can handle it as well as other animals-and we all know how well that works-Metacam may be fine for a cat or dog-but more than a few days can and will kill a glider. So will catnip. I had glue on ONE glider-my SM, Riker, 6 years ago. Since then, only stitches. Just because my glider can't tell me their throat is swelling and it's hard to swallow doesn't mean it's not-and I'd rather not have them in discomfort I don't know about and can't predict-medically speaking. I've been through enough SM. I won't put a glued toy in their cage or tent (among other things) either. Or anything with resins that may be harmful (a pine branch can kill). And so on. Cyanide is a known toxic agent.
Posted By: Laurens_Babies

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:04 PM

Well I'm with you. To me glue and glider toys automatically I would assume a no no. Intresting to think about though.. We could probably have some VERY cool toys if some sort of glue was ok
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:46 PM

Quote:
I conceeded that the household type of super glue would be considered unsafe but NO one has given any reason why the surgical glue is unsafe to use other than it might not be durable.


I did last night after hearing back from Tristan, but when you were asked more questions there, you chose to not come back to respond any longer. Guess you missed my post.

First of all, ANY type of glue can be/is toxic. Whether it is highly toxic or low toxicity and the instructions should be followed as directed. Especially when using SURGICAL glue.

Secondly, he uses no where near the amount on a glider that would be needed for use on toys OR wheels...

If too much is ingested(surgical glue), it could be harmful to your glider. Could cause diarrhea & vomiting.
Super glue can be FATAL...

He said sorry for the short answer but he is now sick....

I can not believe you would still even be CONSIDERING this an option with even the slightest bit of doubt on the safety issue...then again, I personally dont believe this question was originated for you and your wiffle balls...
Posted By: Laurens_Babies

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 12:47 PM

Humm I just re-read your post. More in detail about gliders glue not going so well for you. I've been thru a few neuters no glue on any, so I've never really needed to think about it. BUT lmao as I stated very early in this tread I'm a pro at super glue and cuts and it feels VERY funny. I can't imagine what it feels like to the gliders. On top of the pain all ready in the neuter.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 01:10 PM

Quote:
If it is safe for them to injest while grooming themselves post neuter, then why would the surgical type be unsafe for toy making?


I would imagine first of all that with a post neuter incision the AMOUNT of glue vs the amount needed to super glue a bunch of plastic balls together would differ.

Secondly, is ANY toy that important that you would continue with your plans to create it with ANY questions regarding the safety of the products involved??

And, you keep asking us why then is surgical grade glue ok to use for the neuters and not for toy making and Oh, I dunno, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say firstly, that we don't all claim to be scientists or to know it all, but an ounce of common sense goes a looong way. If in doubt, THROW IT OUT.
Posted By: MatchMakerMagic

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 03:03 PM

off_topic

Originally Posted By: Srlb
I can not believe you would still even be CONSIDERING this an option with even the slightest bit of doubt on the safety issue...then again, I personally dont believe this question was originated for you and your wiffle balls...


But this is EXACTLY what I said about polydactylism in gliders since it was Dr. T that said there COULD be serious health complications associated with it (as well as NUMEROUS other research indicating the same), but that only time could tell... However go breed and be prosperous was the conclusion reached in that thread... Just thought I would mention that since this is potentially dangerous too and we SHOULD opt to refrain from exposing our gliders to it as well.


dunno
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 04:06 PM

Kinue, we see it differently, but thats ok. I still love ya grin

Glue has been PROVEN to be toxic and/or cause illness if too much is ingested...

The polydactylism has not been. There has been no studies bringing health conditions and polydactulism together.
Posted By: jacknsally

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 04:25 PM

Plastic and glues do not go well- most glues only work with a surface that will absorb some of the glue giving a tighter bond. Any glue that is strong enough to bond 2 plastics permanetly together, cannot be safe for gliders even once dried.

Just use a strip of fleece to tie the wiffle balls together.

Ta da- safe toy for the gliders.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 05:37 PM

Quote:
Ta da- safe toy for the gliders.


And there ya have it.....LOL
Posted By: krysKritters

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 06:03 PM

ADULT MALE glider gets nuetered only ONCE in his lifetime, So he could be potentially exposed to a SMALL amount of glue ONE TIME...but the glider would be exposed MULTIPLE times to the toy and potentially the glue.

I also brought up ADULT MALE glider b/c somethings act differently between sexes...
there could be harmful outcomes in a FEMALE exposed to glue, not to mention a momma w/ joeys ip or the joeys themselves!
Joeys immune systems are not as strong as an adults.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 07:32 PM

Jen, you have been the first to give what I see as credible insite on this. The cyanide aspect is definately a concern.

As I already said, I will, for my toy, use the soldering iron and "weld" them together.


I'm still intrigued/concerned by the use of it for neutering. I see a lot of assumptions that the amount I was considering using was somehow vasty more than one or two drops (less than being used on a neuter with extra drops).

I did some more research and found that cyano is a carbon atom joined to a nitrogen atom. It can then be joined to another atom at the carbon atom or joined back to another cyano (again at the carbon atom)forming cyanogen. Depending on just which atom, determines what type of substance it becomes. For example, if joined with a hydrogen atom, it becomes hydrogen cyanide.

Acrylate are the salts and esters of acrylic acid and is what makes up most plastics and vinals.

When these two compounds (combinations of atoms) are combined (again at the carbon atoms), the two become "super glue".

In order for the cyanide to be toxic or lethal, the compound must be able to release cyanide ions. Methal cyanide does NOT release the cyanide ions.

So, methal cyano acrylate (super glue) would not release the cyanide ions. Hence, why it isn't a lethal form of cyanide.

However, the Methal is a combo of Myristic, ether and alcohol. It is considered an alcohol in the methane series. Also known as methyl alcohol and acording to the MSDS sheet is highly toxic and can not be made non poisonous. It effects the nervous system and the liver.

So, I suppose the "lethal/toxic" issue here would be the amount of exposure to it.

With the super glue, not worth the risk with a small animal.


The surgical super glue is 2-octyl cyanoacrylate. Still researching the 2-octyl aspect of it...



Posted By: Msdoolittle

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 10:46 PM

I'm pretty sure formaldehyde is a human carcinogen.
Posted By: Trigger

Re: Question about glue - 10/10/08 11:03 PM

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/risk/formaldehyde

You are correct.
Posted By: Xglider

Re: Question about glue - 10/13/08 07:49 PM

I had not really been following this thread ... as a toy maker myself I always think first about safety first … I would never even think about using something that *might* cause a health risk … Glue is definitely on that list of NO …
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