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The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays...

Posted By: Srlb

The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 06:43 PM

Not too very long ago we had a discussion about the importance of blood work and xrays being done to our gliders.

Many thought it was too risky, some thought it was not necessary. I am here to explain to you why I have and will always feel both of these things ARE of GREAT importance for not only your gliders but others as well.

I have a set of twins, Womba and Roo, that needed to go in for neutering today as they are being shipped to their new home July 3rd.
Whenever I take in a glider for neutering, I normally take in one or two of mine for blood work and/or Xrays. Just too make sure everyone is doing fine and staying healthy. Today I was going to take in Pepper and Bear with me, as I know they havent had theirs done in a while, but I decided against them, and took Dasher in instead. Afterall, I wanted him neutered as well.

We got the twins neutered with no problems, next came Dasher. Of course all the new employees that are there now hadnt seen him last time, and they all fell in love with that pug nose of his. grin

We do the neuter and that goes fine, got blood fine and xrays fine, but Tristan noticed that it seemed like Dashers stomach was distended...concern .... he asks me if he can do an ultrasound and of course I say yes, we start to think possibly his food just didnt digest maybe?

He wheels over the ultrasound machine and fire it up. Unfortunately, it wasnt Dashers stomach at all, it was his liver. He has a LARGE mass on his liver. Mind you 21months ago when he was in, both his blood work AND xrays showed him to be 100% A-OK...

Dasher shows no signs of having any type of issues. He eats fine, he runs and plays, he is purely all glider for sure. But his liver definitely has issues.

Tristan is going to go in on Monday and do an abdominal surgery on our little man. He is going to see if he can *see* what is going on and also do a biopsy on the liver and send it away to have numerous tests on it with hopes that we can figure out what is going on, as you can get better findings and answers on a live organ than that of one that is through a necropsy.

I am scared to death, as this will be a very serious surgery, and I know the chances are there that we may loose my favorite little boy, but I HAVE to do EVERYTHING in my power to try and do what is needed to save him and possibly stop what is causing this.

I asked Tristan if he thought it was from honey, he said no he really didnt think so as there would be a much larger number of gliders than what we see with this problem. I asked him if it could be too much protein, once again, he doesnt think so, but like he said, he can not give any kind of answers without first sending off a biopsy to run tests to see WHAT is causing this.

Please everyone keep Dasher in your prayers.

Had I not taken him in today, we would have never of known.

When we were just holding Dasher you could not feel anything. It wasnt until he was under sedation and Tim strecthed his back legs down did we notice anything.
Posted By: SugarBlossoms

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 06:51 PM

Peggy, have your vet contact Dr. Ness about the Milk Thistle prescription.

Are you sure you want to do this? You could lose him on the table. Is he in pain? Is he jaundiced?

I'm so sorry he is going through this! I've seen what can happen with liver malfuntion and disease!
Posted By: DirtyPaws

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 06:53 PM

Wow Peggy! Sure glad something in your head was telling you to take that boy in! mlove

Will sure have you and Dasher in my prayers.

hug2
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 06:59 PM

Yea, Tristan has spoken with Ness before, they discussed both the milk thistle and the Sam-E for liver.

Quote:
Are you sure you want to do this? You could lose him on the table.


Am I sure I want to do this...NO...I dont WANT to, but just treating the liver with the milk thistle and/or Sam-E is really not going to be a sure thing of fixing anything if we arent sure what the issue is in the first place.

Yes, the chance of loosing him on the table is there. As with any surgery. But I trust Tristan will do EVERYTHING he possibly can to prevent that. But I wont fool myself, I know how dangerous this could be. But I also know with the size that mass was, it will just be a matter of time before it takes him down.

No, he is not in pain, or doesnt *seem* to be, and he isnt jaundice at all, which is really surprising with the size this thing is.

If there was a for sure way of telling us why this is happening, and the answer to at least stop it in its tracks from growing, without surgery, you better believe that I would.
Posted By: Janie

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 07:00 PM

Will keep you and Dasher in my prayers
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 07:17 PM

I am glad you followed instincts and took him in. Things do happen for a reason and in this case, his life may be saved as well as many others in the future.

Keeping you in my thoughts...
Posted By: ozzi

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 07:41 PM

angel We will be praying for Dasher angel

Pat, Boo-Boo, and BJ angel
Posted By: sugarlope

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 07:47 PM

My thoughts and prayers are with you and your boy. hug2
Posted By: LSardou

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 07:47 PM

I'm sorry Peggy to hear this about Dasher. I will keep him in my thoughts and prayers. Many hugs being sent to you too. hug2
Posted By: CharmedSuggies

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 07:57 PM

I'm sorry you have to go through this Peggy. hug2 I will pray for Dasher for a safe surgery and ask St. Francis of Assisi to watch over him.
Posted By: tbull

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 09:59 PM

Our thoughts are with you and Dasher. hug2 hug2
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 10:37 PM

Peggy, I am so sorry you and Dasher have to go thru this. I know you are doing what you believe is best for him and I agree, it is only a matter of time, concerning his liver. I would opt for surgery if it were one of my babies too. Many prayers are being sent your way! hug2 hug2 hug2
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 11:15 PM

Aww I am so sorry Peggy... I am sure Tim will make him all better and your little boy will live for many more years smile
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 11:20 PM

Thank you ALL for your support and prayers.

I talked with Dashers other Mommy tonight. Yes, he is THAT special of a glider to have two mommys. I didnt want to commit to anything until I spoke with her about this as well. Karin, Dashers other mommy, made a wonderful suggestion. We are going to ask Tim to try out either the milk thistle or the Sam-E treatment. Give it to him and in two weeks, I will have another ultrasound done. If the treatment seems to be working, well, of course we will continue it. If it seems as though it is the same size, we will opt to try the treatment for another two weeks and check again. If it seems as though there was growth in the liver, we will then do the surgery.

I am totally sick to my stomach over this. When I talked with another dear friend of mine, thank you Shawna, she told me no hands down NOT to do it. She will be along later tonight to explain why. It is NOT an easy decision to make, and know that I will NOT be making the decisions concerning him alone.

Karin also asked me to post some pics of Dasher in case there are any of you that have never had the chance to see him. He has been a part of the GC community for a long time. These are from just a few minutes ago.

Once again thank you all for your support, it DOES mean a LOT. hug2

Attached picture Dasher Collage6-15-09.jpg
Attached picture Dasher Collage 2 6-15-09.jpg
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 11:21 PM

One special picture for Karin. She has always said Dasher always look mad in pics...I couldnt resist to post this one just for her...

(you really need to enlarge it to get the full effect...)


Attached picture Why does my other mommy think I am always angry.JPG
Posted By: Karin

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 11:26 PM

roflmao roflmao roflmao (that last pic)

Omg, I love that boy heart .

It's all going to work out, somehow the way it is meant to, I know it.

Tell me that is not the most unique glider face you have ever seen!?!?!

Karin
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 11:32 PM

I love his little piggy face lol he does look like a pug! haha
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/15/09 11:33 PM

I am also glad yall are able to share a glider... I do not think I could share mine lol... Tyler is lucky smile
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 12:54 AM

He has the most unique face I've ever seen on a glider! I pray for the best for him!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 01:21 AM

May God bless you and Dasher.
Posted By: Cora

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 02:07 AM

prayers for little Dasher.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 02:51 AM

Sending prayers and hug2 to Dasher.
Posted By: USMom

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 03:31 AM

Peggy and I did talk about this. And it is still very, very hard for me to talk about my Tucker. Reading over some of what I wrote, I think he really had a lot more going on than I remember. He was pretty sick. I just hate that he was so miserable and in pain when he died. He didn't have to have that pain, and I think that's why I say no. I feel very guilty about it, still.

Peggy, here are Tucker and Allie's threads. Tucker and Allie died within a very short time of each other from Aflotoxins. Tucker, Allison and Reese were a Trio that had always been together. The third thread is the one where we did Tuckers surgery. From February 14 to March 3 is all the time we had. When I get the reports from the Vet, I'll send them to you. I also told Dr Lusk that he could talk to Tim about any of it.

In case anyone wonders, Reesie is still around, she has a new momma, but is still doing fine.

http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/83081/Tucker_Update#Post83081

http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/83732/Tucker_and_Now_Allison#Post83732

http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/85709/Tucker_Update#Post85709
Posted By: LSardou

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 03:50 AM

I just wanted to send you a big hug Shawna. I'm so sorry, I can only imagine how difficult this was, and I admire your love and strength. hug2
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 03:50 AM

Hugs to you and Dasher hug2
Posted By: reeny

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 05:30 AM

I am so sorry about Dasher. I am also sorry I couldn't call you today. You were in my thoughts and prayers. I read through everything. I trust Dr. Tristan but I am glad you decided to wait, and try the milk thistle, etc.

Let me know if there is any thing I can do. If you need to talk call me. I am here for you.
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 06:25 AM

just my 2 cents. from past posts. and from australian vets i have spoken with in the past. i would not do the surgery the stress will definetly kill him. i would rather let nature take its course until the end and he is in pain then put him to sleep. and do the necropsy. thats just my opinion. i would try all alternatives though.
Posted By: Their_mommy

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 07:12 AM

Praying for you both and for the right decision to be made.
He is such a handsome little boy and what an addorable face he has.
Little tickle under the chin for me ok.
Posted By: mommawannabe

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 10:20 AM

Praying for you and Dasher!!!

Anna
Posted By: Feather

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/16/09 04:29 PM

Sending prayers and good thoughts to you and Dasher.
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/18/09 05:00 PM

I was waiting to hear back from Karin before posting the new info I have to share with the community.

Dr.Tristan contacted me and we have decided instead of doing a surgery, we are going to do a bile acids test to see if that will show us anything. This type of test has not been done on a sugar glider before so we are in hopes that is will show us something. Tristan said and I quote

Quote:
This has not been done in gliders, but may be something everyone with suspect liver cases should start to do as this is a definitive test for liver disease. It is just not a commonly run test, unless a liver problem is suspected.


I will keep everyone posted, and hopefully Dasher will be able to show us how to help him through having this test. And how to help others as well. thumb

I also would like to add that the rest of Dashers bloodwork was surprisingly normal. grin
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/18/09 10:41 PM

Peggy, this sounds promising! I hope and pray it turns out good for little Dasher!
Posted By: Dancing

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:05 AM

Peggy, differences aside, Dasher is special to me (because of Nickolas) and he's in my thoughts and prayers.
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:14 AM

Teresa, thank you for that. I promise you I will keep you posted. I know you feel strongly about him.
Posted By: hushpuppy

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:48 AM

OMGosh, Peggy I just saw this. Hugs and prayers for both you and Dasher.
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:50 AM

Connie, lets hope so. Anita, thank you my friend. hug2
Posted By: reeny

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 04:11 AM

Peggy when are they going to do this blood work? Hope all goes well.
Posted By: Karin

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 04:32 AM

The end of next week Reeny. Seems like forever.

Karin
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 04:54 AM

I just ran across this. He is pug nosed! How precious! I will be saying a little extra prayer for you and Dasher tonight as well!
Posted By: USMom

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:17 PM

This seems like a much better route than the one I took with Tuck. P, I know you'll keep me posted. I'm very interested in this.
Posted By: BCChins

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:40 PM

Peggy Dasher, you and Karin are in my thoughts. I hope the treatment helps him and the bile acids test gives you some answers.

Please give him a special treat and lovins from me.
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:44 PM

Thanks everyone. Dasher will be going in at 8 am next Friday. We figured we needed to give him some time to recoop from his neuter.

We will take the first draw of blood, and hoping that the numbers are normal, because if they are not and they are high, that will show us that the liver is not doing its job the way it should be.
Posted By: BCChins

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:53 PM

Peggy have you started the Milk Thistle and Sam E yet? If so will it alter the blood work at all or will it not effect the results just being on it for a week or so?
Posted By: SugarBlossoms

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:53 PM

I'm so glad Dasher will be going on treatment instead! Liver surgery (any surgery) is too dangerous. He is an adorable boy and looks to be very happy. After what I've seen and been through with liver issues in gliders, my personal opinion is to treat them and let them be happy and live out their lives. I realize we need more information in this aspect in order to save other lives, call me selfish but I would rather wait until which time our babies have lived out their lives happily and loved...then find out what went "wrong" rather than put them through pain with a huge chance of losing them in the process.

Prayers for Dasher!!
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/19/09 03:56 PM

Brenda, no we did not start it yet because it would alter the test results.
Posted By: Karin

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 02:12 AM

Be a good boy tomorrow Dasher heart .
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 05:07 PM

So Dasher went in for his test today along with another issue he decided to spring on me last night. I thought for sure he broke his leg. It was just dangling there and he wasnt using it last night nor today. Got him into the office a bit before 8 this morning. Tristan couldnt believe it when he saw Dashers leg...ok, so another round of xrays coming up....

He calls me back there to look at the xrays, guess what? NO BROKEN BONES at all. No signs of any problems with his bones. Bone structure is great. All he could think is maybe he twisted it or hyper extended it. Gave me a bit of pain meds for him. But what DID show up was a very large tumor...

We wont have results from the bile acid test for a while, but as soon as he does he will let me know and we will go from there. I will let you guys know as soon as I find out and let Karin know. As of right now, you could NEVER tell there was something going on with the inside of him....my poor little man....
Posted By: BCChins

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 05:40 PM

Peggy we will be keeping Dasher in our thoughts here.
I am sorry everyone has to go though this.

Can Dr. Tristan palpate it when he is awake or is it only by seeing it on Xray's.
Posted By: DirtyPaws

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 08:29 PM

So this tumor is the same "mass" you spoke of before right? When he just by chance went in to begin with... Not a new one?!

party Must have been a big party in his cage last night roflmao
Posted By: Janie

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 08:48 PM

praying for Dasher and you *hugs*
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 09:01 PM

I'm so sorry! I'm sending many prayers and best wishes for little Dasher!
Posted By: cyndiekb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 09:06 PM

Peggy I am praying for you and Dasher. I will not be one to tell you not to do surgery I will say you WILL KNOW when it is time. I caught flack for Patches surgery but I knew I had to do every thing I thought was right for him just like YOU WILL DO what is right for you and Dasher. I support you what ever you decide to do. I pray treatment helps. I know the meds have helped mine since they have gained back their weight. Also a great reason for every one to regularly weigh our furbutts.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 09:07 PM

Aww poor little dasher frown I will keep yall in my thoughts
Posted By: Srlb

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 09:20 PM

Brenda, yes Dr.T could, but I couldnt when I held him, but then again he knew what he was looking for today.

Crystal, yes, this is the same one as the other day.

CKB, Thank you. Its NOT an easy thing to do or even think about. I thought Tristan said we would have the results back in a couple hours...my mistake, we wont have them back until Monday.

Everyone knows what Dasher means to me. He was my very first joey ever born in my house, conceived right after (possibly right before) his daddy got the big snip. He is special in many ways and whatever is decided for him, from both Karin and myself, together we will NOT make a snap decision and will only do what we believe to be the best for Dasher. You are right KB,many probably wont agree no matter what is decided, but it is Dasher that I think about and have in mind.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 09:27 PM

Whatever you two and Tristian decide and do, we know you are only doing it for little Dasher. You love your gliders, there is not doubt about it smile I miss you Peggy!
Posted By: Karin

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 09:36 PM

ohwell Ok, gear my head to chut up until Monday *sigh*.

Feed him good tonight for me Peggy roflmao !

Keep us posted on his arm too.

Karin
Posted By: Karin

Re: The Importance of Blood Work AND Xrays... - 06/26/09 09:38 PM

You all probably think Peggy and I are nuts, so a little background quickly so you understand. My gliders had never given me joey's (long long story) so I lived and breathed this first joey experience via Peggy. All you have to do is look at Dash and understand the rest. I use to make her send me pics like 3x a day when he came OOP, and he always looked so MAD!
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