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#1172045 - 09/15/11 10:35 AM Grapes?
dewbug91 Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 02/01/11
Posts: 451
Loc: Pinconning, MI
I've heard numerous times from multiple people that grapes are bad, they cause kidney failure. But then I hear Grapes are fine to feed, I feed them often and have had no problems with them. What are your thoughts on them? I know that they are not healthy for dogs and cats to eat. What about sugar gliders?
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3 Sugar Glider: Izzy,Mina,and Pixie.
2 Cats: Gizzy and Bella.

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#1172050 - 09/15/11 11:03 AM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Feather Offline
Administrator

Registered: 01/19/08
Posts: 12070
Loc: Wisconsin
I believe that the skins are what the problem is with dogs. I give grapes to my guys about 2 times a week, I serve them cut in half and I get cleaned out little bowls back.

Never had a problem.
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#1172070 - 09/15/11 12:03 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Nemo12708 Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 06/21/11
Posts: 452
Loc: Fayetteville,North Carolina
Mine also have a few smashed in their fruit mix that they get nightly. No problems here. *knocking on wood now. lol
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#1172095 - 09/15/11 01:17 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: Feather]
JillMarie Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 7748
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: Feather
I believe that the skins are what the problem is with dogs. I give grapes to my guys about 2 times a week, I serve them cut in half and I get cleaned out little bowls back.

Never had a problem.


Me too!
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#1172167 - 09/15/11 05:46 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
SugarGliderLove Offline
Glider Guardian

Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 853
Loc: US
I have never had a problem with grapes. All 6 of my suggies love them. they get them about 2-3 times a week.

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#1172302 - 09/15/11 11:59 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
MyOnlySunshine Offline
Out of Pouch

Registered: 02/23/10
Posts: 64
Loc: Twin City Metro (MN)
I've never had a problem either...Like Feather said, I give them grapes and I get hollow skins back!

I do know that grapes can be toxic to other animals. They are VERY dangerous to hedgehogs (we have one). I've never had an issue with my boys. I guess I'd be careful to not give them grapes with seeds though.
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#1172314 - 09/16/11 12:15 AM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
Mine have even had seeded grapes, they just eat around the seeds (they do that with all the not commonly edible seeds, though). Some people chose not to risk certain things with gliders because other animals cannot tolerate them.

When the grape issue first came up, I stopped feeding grapes for a year and then remembered how many grapes all of my little ones had eaten over the previous couple and how much they loved them, so I started feeding them again.
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Maia & Squish
If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.

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#1172351 - 09/16/11 02:58 AM Re: Grapes? [Re: sugarlope]
JillMarie Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 7748
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: sugarlope
Mine have even had seeded grapes, they just eat around the seeds (they do that with all the not commonly edible seeds, though). Some people chose not to risk certain things with gliders because other animals cannot tolerate them.

When the grape issue first came up, I stopped feeding grapes for a year and then remembered how many grapes all of my little ones had eaten over the previous couple and how much they loved them, so I started feeding them again.


Me too!
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^website link wink

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#1172378 - 09/16/11 07:10 AM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
xobeautifuluvox
Unregistered


I feed grapes too but not everyday, I mix it up! smile

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#1172470 - 09/16/11 01:30 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Carolyn Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 06/23/11
Posts: 378
Loc: Long Island, New York
My guys love the grapes also. I get the skins back only. I feed them 2-3 times a week. I think they wait for them. lol.
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#1172523 - 09/16/11 04:35 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
dewbug91 Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 02/01/11
Posts: 451
Loc: Pinconning, MI
I feed grapes to. But we can't see the inside of our little babies. A lot of people say no because they can't see it's bad for them or not and also because the guy Ed that has 70 rescues says his vet says not. I was just a bit curious as to why. I think other new members would like to know. In most cases where grapes are toxic to dogs, it's the skin that causes liver failure. Thanks everyone for your inputs and opinions!
_________________________
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3 Sugar Glider: Izzy,Mina,and Pixie.
2 Cats: Gizzy and Bella.

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#1172535 - 09/16/11 05:45 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
I lost a 4 yr old 2 years back. He got grapes regularly, several times a week at least. His necropsy showed his liver and kidneys were normal, no damage. His is only one necropsy, but my two 10 yr olds and my 9 and 8 yr olds are still going strong even though they have had grapes regularly throughout their life (except the one year, several years ago).
_________________________
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Maia & Squish
If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.

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#1172539 - 09/16/11 05:56 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Cora Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 04/16/05
Posts: 6573
Loc: Kilgore, Texas
I have given grapes daily to Spencer for the past 4 years. Back in Jan he had his yearly bloodwork, all was normal. I also feed them to the rest of mine often for past 6 years with no illness from them. I wash them and cut the ends off.
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#1172544 - 09/16/11 06:05 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
suggiemom1980 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/05/07
Posts: 13746
Loc: Vincennes, IN, USA
I give grapes regularly. I've almost always got suggies with me when I leave the house. So they have a snack that also is watery enough to quench their thirst and I don't have to worry about it making a mess or getting dirty, like watermelon or apple slices. I've given grapes for almost five years with no bad effects. All of my suggies are healthy.
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#1172597 - 09/16/11 07:50 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
manje Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 07/09/11
Posts: 429
Loc: Virginia
grapes and raisins are toxic to dogs, not gliders.
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#1173774 - 09/19/11 07:40 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Johannasgliders Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 03/21/10
Posts: 2342
Loc: Inman, SC
I give my gliders grapes. The grape is always cut in half so they don't have to eat any of the peel.
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Johanna
Husband: Gerald
3 human Kids
2 human Grand Boys
:rbridge: =(RIP Hocus 2-2009, Pocus 9-2011, Mia 4-2013 & Trooper 9-2010)
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#1174271 - 09/21/11 02:21 AM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
eshaw Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 02/11/11
Posts: 593
Loc: Iowa
I've never had any issues with grapes, or raisins for that matter. Mine don't seem to like the skins though.

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#1180991 - 10/11/11 04:25 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
fuzzyx4 Offline
Joey Member

Registered: 10/02/11
Posts: 129
Loc: SD
I had a vet tell me that studies have shown that some gliders are fine with them and in others it can cause urine infection so I dont know I just rather not take the chance so mine dont eat grapes. They go crazy for mango though.

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#1197971 - 11/29/11 05:06 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
MissB Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 11/17/11
Posts: 259
Loc: Washington
Interesting... I also heard that grapes are bad. Good thing to know that I can mush them up in a smoothie for them!
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#1198047 - 11/29/11 08:22 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Sweet_Pea
Unregistered


I Feed Grapes Nightly and have noticed that my gliders only eat the inside. I thought it was just because their sap suckers

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#1198094 - 11/29/11 10:02 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
sunjana1 Offline
Glider Guardian

Registered: 01/09/11
Posts: 711
Loc: Portland, OR
Ah, "The Grape Debate!". Sorry, just HAD to chime in with a cheesy pun.

I think grapes are a personal choice. I just suggest to read what you can about them in other animals (if only to understand the generalities of the concern) and ask your vet their opinion.

I understand the viewpoint that there's no indication they cause issues with suggies. However, just because suggies love them isn't a good enough reason (for me) to feed them.

Dogs love chocolate, but we now know they can't tolerate it. Coming to that conclusion and the relatively recent one about grapes took collaboration and study from a LOT of vets. Something we do not have readily available from expert glider vets.

Just something to think about. smile
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Twitter
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#1198128 - 11/29/11 10:57 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
mae Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 10/28/11
Posts: 213
Loc: Oklahoma
I was wondering the same thing today. I have never given grapes because i read somewhere they weren't to have them. my friend gives her marmoset grapes and they eat basicaly the same stuff a glider can eat.
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sleep Roman

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#1198300 - 11/30/11 12:13 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Sami Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 04/18/11
Posts: 267
Loc: Virginia
I've never fed them, because I've heard a lot of mixed things about them, but I do know that when they kept our little rescue girl overnight the vet gave her some. I may try them next time we travel, since we may take them out of town with us for Chrismas smile

I've had the same problem with my chinchilla and raisins...we fed him raisins for years (and still do, he 'resents' and flings poo when he doesn't get raisins!) and I've heard some people say they're bad, while others say they're fine. I've never seen any adverse affects.
_________________________
Mommy of four suggies! <3

Navi :grey: , Meeka :grey: , our rescue girl, Cinnamon :wfb: , and leu baby Gabriel :leu:


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#1198506 - 11/30/11 06:41 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Helen88uk Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 259
Loc: UK
Having heard they cause renal failure in certain animals I personally just wont take the chance. There are so many fruits out there, mine certainly aren't missing out just because they don't get grapes lol x

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#1198585 - 11/30/11 08:54 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: sunjana1]
GliderNursery Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/14/07
Posts: 20049
Loc: North Central Ohio
We don't have studies from vets, but I would think that with so many feeding grapes for so many years with no ill effects, they have proven to be safe for gliders. Of course, it is always a personal choice/preference as to what you feed your glider. But to my knowledge, there have been no reported illnesses or deaths of gliders from eating grapes.
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#1206496 - 12/19/11 01:57 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
sunjana1 Offline
Glider Guardian

Registered: 01/09/11
Posts: 711
Loc: Portland, OR
Rather than create a new thread about grapes, I decided to post this on the most recent one. If it needs to be moved, my apologies.

Just today I was given access to an article based on material written by Cheryl Yuill, DVM, MSc, CVH & Justine A. Lee, DVM, DACVECC, Associate Director of Veterinary Services, Pet Poison Helpline.

I found it very comprehensive, especially for those looking for more information on grape toxicity in dogs, and how it might impact your decision on grapes for your gliders. Particularly the last sentence of the article I found important: "Since there are still many unknowns associated with this toxicity, it would be prudent to avoid giving ANY grapes and raisins to your pet dog or any other pet."

I am pasting the entire article below.

"Grape and Raisin Toxicity in Dogs
Recently, veterinarians discovered that grapes and raisins can cause kidney failure in dogs. It is unclear whether this is a new problem, or if the toxic nature of grapes and raisins became recognized after the establishment of a computerized animal toxicity database about 25 years ago. Whatever the case, the number of identified cases of illness or death in dogs after they have eaten raisins or grapes is on the increase.

What types of grapes and raisins are toxic to dogs?

"The type of raisins or grapes does not appear to matter..."
The type of raisins or grapes does not appear to matter, with reported cases of toxicity occurring after dogs have eaten seedless or seeded varieties, commercial or homegrown fruits, red or green grapes, organic or non-organic grapes, and grape pressings from wineries. In fact, even certain types of currants are poisonous also. Foods containing grapes and raisins (such as Raisin Bran®, trail mix, granola mix, baked goods with raisins) are all potential sources of poison!

What is the toxic dose?
Since raisins are dried and therefore more concentrated than grapes, it appears that raisins are relatively more toxic than grapes; therefore, it takes a small amount of raisins to result in poisoning in dogs compared to grapes. While there are some potential toxic doses of grapes and raisins floating around there, there is no scientific, peer-reviewed published toxic dose. Therefore, the amount that a pet got into must be carefully weighed based on the breed, age, health, underlying medical history, and concurrent medications that the pet may be on.

Why are raisins and grapes toxic?
Currently, it is not known why grapes and/or raisins are toxic. Some researchers suspect that a mycotoxin (a toxic substance produced by a fungus or mold) may be the cause. Some suspect a salicylate (aspirin-like) drug may be naturally found in the grape, resulting in decreased blood flow to the kidneys. However, so far no toxic agent has been identified. Since it is currently unknown why these fruits are toxic, any exposure should be a cause for concern.

What should I do if my dog eats grapes or raisins?
"If you suspect that your pet has eaten any grapes or raisins, please contact your veterinarian or Pet Poison Helpline immediately."
If you suspect that your pet has eaten any grapes or raisins, please contact your veterinarian or Pet Poison Helpline, an animal poison control service, immediately. Do not waste any time. Since there are still many unknowns associated with this toxicity, it is better not to take any chances when it comes to your pet's health. As with any toxicity, the sooner the poisoning is diagnosed and treated, the less dangerous for your pet, and the less expensive therapy will be for you.


What are the symptoms of grape or raisin toxicity?
The most common early symptom of grape or raisin toxicity is vomiting, which is generally seen within 24 hours following ingestion. Lack of appetite, lethargy, and possibly diarrhea can be also seen within the next 12-24 hours. . Unfortunately, more severe signs are not seen for 24-48 hours after ingestion – often after acute kidney failure has occurred already. Signs of acute kidney failure include nausea, lack of appetite, vomiting, halitosis (bad breath), diarrhea, abdominal pain, excessive thirst, and excessive urination.
As the toxicity progresses, the kidneys may shut down and the dog will not produce any urine. As the kidney failure progresses, the dog's blood pressure will increase dramatically and the dog will usually lapse into a coma. Once the kidneys have shut down and urine output has dropped, the prognosis is poor.

How is the toxicity diagnosed?
Unfortunately, the symptoms of grape or raisin toxicity are non-specific, and are similar to kidney failure from many other causes. Instead, your veterinarian will base a presumptive diagnosis of this toxicity based on a history of eating grapes or raisins, or the presence of pieces of grapes or raisins in the dog's vomit.
Your veterinarian will recommend diagnostic tests such as a Complete Blood Count (CBC), a serum biochemistry profile and a urinalysis to assess the amount of damage to the kidneys, which will help determine what the dog's prognosis is for recovery.

Is there an antidote?
No.

How is this poisoning treated?
The goal of treatment is to block absorption of the toxins and prevent or minimize damage to the kidneys.
The best treatment is to decontaminate a patient right away – this prevents absorption of the unknown toxin from the stomach or intestines. As grapes and raisins stay in the stomach for a prolonged period of time, inducing vomiting is of the utmost importance (even up to 4-6 hours after ingestion). Your veterinarian will also administer activated charcoal orally to block further absorption of the toxins. Ideally, aggressive intravenous fluids should be started promptly to flush any absorbed toxins out of the body as quickly as possible and to help maintain kidney function. Drugs to control nausea or vomiting, to help maintain blood flow to the kidneys, and to control blood pressure will be administered as indicated.


"The goal of treatment is to block absorption of the toxins and prevent or minimize damage to the kidneys."
Ideally, dogs should be hospitalized on intravenous fluids for 24 to 48 hours, depending on how severe the kidney disease is. Affected animals may need to be hospitalized for up to 2-7 days. During the course of treatment, your veterinarian will monitor the patient's kidney values daily to assess the response to treatment and determine whether the treatment needs to become more aggressive. Blood work should also be repeated 2-3 days after going home; this is to make sure the kidney blood values haven’t increased at all.
What is the prognosis for recovery from poisoning from grapes or raisins?
Prognosis depends on many factors, including how severe the poisoning was, how soon the patient was decontaminated, whether or not the patient has already developed kidney failure, how soon treatment was initiated, and whether the clinical signs and kidney values improved once treatment was started.
Approximately 50% of dogs that ingest grapes or raisins go into kidney failure. If a dog only ate a few grapes or raisins (depending on the size of the patient) and received immediate treatment, the prognosis is reasonably good. If the kidneys shut down so that no urine is produced, the prognosis is poor. It is important to realize that the kidneys have very little capacity to regenerate or repair themselves, and once the kidneys are damaged, they will not function as well as they did before the episode. When in doubt, seek treatment right away by contacting your veterinarian or Pet Poison Helpline for treatment advice. Your veterinarian will estimate the prognosis for your dog based on its symptoms, individual situation, and response to treatment.

How can I prevent this problem?
Keep all grapes and raisins, or foods containing grapes or raisins, out of reach of your pets. Do not share any food that may contain grapes or raisins with your dog, and especially do not use grapes as treats for your dog.
What other common foods are toxic to dogs?
Onions, chocolate, cocoa, macadamia nuts, fattening foods, and foods containing the sweetener xylitol can also be fatal.

Are other animals at risk?
So far, grape and raisin toxicity has only been identified as a problem in dogs. That said, there have been possible, anecdotal reports of cats and ferrets being potentially affected. Since there are still many unknowns associated with this toxicity, it would be prudent to avoid giving ANY grapes and raisins to your pet dog or any other pet."
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#1206543 - 12/19/11 03:09 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Dancing Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 22746
Loc: 80 acres of paradise in KS
That is interesting but with gliders, I for one have fed grapes and raisins for over 12 years and had no issues with all the gliders I've had though my home. I can't help but question WHY I wouldn't have seen it in at least ONE of my gliders by now.

It is a personal choice, whether to give them to gliders or not. Gliders certainly won't suffer any long term effects by NOT getting grapes or raisins.
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#1207162 - 12/20/11 08:41 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
danileigh Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 05/10/10
Posts: 596
Loc: La La Land
hmm i have given grapes to my kids they get cut in half and i get little skins back but even so i have never had an issue feeding grapes to my babies they love them but to each their own if it makes you nervous dont feed them thats what i do when i find something questionable

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#1208059 - 12/22/11 10:35 PM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
Mikini Offline
Out of Pouch

Registered: 10/03/09
Posts: 76
Loc: Maryland
The only glider I have had that had a UTI/Kidney infection came from a home that fed her lots of baby food and grapes. I cut out the iron all together for a while and now use grapes as a treat about once every other week and have had no more problems.
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#1208099 - 12/23/11 02:43 AM Re: Grapes? [Re: dewbug91]
JillMarie Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 7748
Loc: New Jersey
I am not saying to feed or not to feed grapes, but I would like to point out that something that is toxic to one animal may not be toxic to another species of animal.

Every glider owner should make an INFORMED decision on whether or not they want to feed grapes. From there, it is their own choice.
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