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#1219481 - 01/21/12 08:15 AM Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away
Fruitbat Offline
New Member

Registered: 07/31/10
Posts: 19
Loc: NH
And there's nothing you can do about it.

I work in the reptile industry. I know there is a stigma associated with it but please, for the purpose of this conversation try to keep your fears and assumptions at bay and please read what I have to say.

I want to bring up a topic that affects each and every one of you. If you want to maintain the right to keep exotic animals. Whether or not you like reptiles, whether or not you even own any pets at all this is your problem. This is your country and they are just getting started.

Your government (with quite a bit of encouragement and millions in funding from the horrible people at The Humane Society of The United States-more on that later) has started turning responsible, caring pet owners into felons. After years of fighting, thousands of letters and protests from desperate pet owners and thousands of dollars spent fighting them, they have gained a foothold in an underhanded and dishonest way. They are making laws based on bogus science and flat out lies. Fear being perpetuated by the media and the HSUS only fuels the fire.

What they are trying to do will cost thousands of jobs and cause thousands of businesses, both large and small to close their doors forever. The worst part is that the lawmakers have been met with so much resistance from the reptile community that they have found a way to put laws into effect without due process, valid science or good reason. They found a loophole that allows them to circumvent congress and with the flick of a pen they are destroying a flourishing American industry. They are taking away our pets, our rights and our voices and this is NOT OK.

What happened?

Originally they wanted to ban 9 species of snakes. Besides being kept as pets by people who adore them, many of these snakes in captivity have rare genetic color and pattern mutations that many people have been working very hard on cultivating and combining over the past several decades. Mostly ball pythons and reticulated pythons. Quite a few of these animals are extremely valuable with individual animals fetching tens of thousands of dollars each on a regular basis.

On January 17, 2012, the Department of the Interior announced a nationwide, federal ban on 4 species of snakes. The ban prohibits importation and interstate transport of these snakes including the Burmese python. Off the top of my head, the most expensive Burmese python that's been sold was a leucistic animal that sold for $150,000. Yup, you heard me. That was for a single animal. That's what it sold for, not a value that was placed on it. Can you see why some people might be upset about this law?
With this law in place it would be impossible for a snake owner to move out of state and keep their pets unless they want to smuggle it which would be a federal offense and they could end up in prison. It would be impossible for a hobbyist or breeder to acquire potentially valuable genetic mutations for their breeding program if that involves importing it or getting it out of state. The majority of sales of these snake requires them to be shipped cross country or exported to other countries which often involves traveling out of state to an international airport. This law will cripple this business.
The logic behind the ban was to help prevent any further damage to the Florida Everglades which has an existing population of these pythons because the climate is favorable for these animals and they are able to reproduce there. They did this despite the fact that Florida already has laws in place controlling the ownership of these animals entirely. The problem is that this will do absolutely nothing to reduce the population in the Everglades. Making it a felony to bring one into Alaska hardly solves the problem in Florida.
These animals were slipped onto the Lacey Act. This Act is in place to prevent the transport of illegally collected game. The reason that they banned only 4 of the 9 snakes proposed originally is because there is a loophole, as long as the economic damage that doing this will cause falls under a certain amount of money they can add these animals to the list without having it voted on in congress. They will now be able to slip the others onto the list one by one until they have achieved their goal. This is not democracy. This is not fair. This is a misuse of the Lacey Act.
The worst part of all of this is that the [censored] at the HSUS and PETA are taking in massive donations. Billions of dollars from animal lovers with good intentions and none of it goes to helping animals in need, despite the persuasive imagery in their commercials, I assure you, the money donated goes into the pockets of politicians who are trying to do something spectacular to get ďput on the mapĒ and to funding legislation like this.

Why?

These people are extremists. They are terrorists. Their mission is to abolish animal ownership. ALL ANIMALS. They start with the easy ones that most people donít like or are afraid of - like these snakes - but once they have conquered the reptile industry they will move on to horses, cows, chickens, aquarium fish, birds, rats, hamsters, even cats and dogs. You name it. Pit bulls are already on the chopping block as it is. They will not stop until ALL DOMESTIC ANIMALS ARE EXTINCT. They don't want you to have pets. They fight for animal rights, not animal welfare. There's a difference. A BIG difference. They don't think there should be any animals in captivity. Period.

If you value your rights and your freedom as an American you should be OUTRAGED. If you want to have animals in your life, in your children's and grandchildren's lives you should be HORRIFIED.

So now what?

USARK, The United States Association of Reptile Keepers, is currently formulating a plan. A federal lawsuit is a likely possibility in the very near future. But everyone that is aware of this injustice needs to speak up! This is a grassroots campaign to preserve our rights! We are a small community and we need help! Even if you loathe snakes, even if you think they are gross and slimy and dangerous please agree that it's not ok for the government to dictate what we can and can not do, to take away our rights without just cause or due process! Just because you don't want to keep these animals yourself doesn't mean it should be illegal! Look at the FACTS! Horses and dogs are responsible for way more human deaths and injuries than pet snakes. Cats are way more destructive to the ecosystem than snakes could ever be, and believe me, they will be using that as ammunition in the foreseeable future. Please don't turn your back on this because you don't like snakes, that what these people are counting on! Turning a blind eye to this kind of behavior is nothing more than prejudice. Don't believe the media hype. Open your eyes, look at the facts! Please help us keep our pets and our jobs!

What can you do?

Currently there is a petition on the white house website. Please sign it and urge everyone you know to do the same. https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/petition/overturn-python-ban/4wGFbc4Y

Spread the word, the more people that know whats going on the better!
Watch these videos and SHARE them!

(I'm in this one smile wee! )





Join USARK.org or PIJAC.org. https://www.pijac.org/membership/forms/index.asp

Don't wait until it's too late and the government wants to take away something thatís important to you. We need to nip this in the bud! There is strength in numbers. We are David and they are Goliath. Every single penny and signature helps and is greatly appreciated!

And please, whatever you do, don't donate a penny to the HSUS or PETA! If you would like more information about them visit www.HumaneWatch.org


Edited by GliderNursery (01/21/12 02:17 PM)
Edit Reason: edited text
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#1219771 - 01/22/12 12:29 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
Sami Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 04/18/11
Posts: 267
Loc: Virginia
I wouldn't personally own snakes, but have friends and former teachers who had snakes I handled that I really enjoyed. I think EVERYONE should be able to have pets, so long as they have the time, money, and interest to give the animals everything they deserve. I'm a firm believer that pets are meant to be a member of the family - for their entire lives. To me, forcing someone to give up an animal is like telling a mother to drop her kids off for adoption and accept it. Signed the petition, because pets and their loving owners need each other.
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#1219817 - 01/22/12 09:04 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Sami]
sitkasmom Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 09/27/11
Posts: 3039
Loc: Finally in the Mountains!
I cant own a snake, my mom would have a coronary. I like them. Its not really shocking that they are doing this. The politicians have been doing this since the start of the government.

I believe if an owner of an animal can pass a test (much like the driving test) that is put together by vets and zoos and recognized handlers of the animals, pass a home inspection showing where the animal will be housed (parallel parking), then they should be allowed a license for that animal. They can charge a fee for the license just like DMV. Have to get it renewed just like DMV.... They could make a TON of money and ensure that animals are properly taken care of at the same time...
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#1219820 - 01/22/12 09:25 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
lovely1inred
Unregistered


While I support the effort to remove the ban, the video would hold much more credibility if feral were spelled correctly. Just sayin'.

I've only recently gotten into the ball python trade but they sell for comparable prices to colored gliders, if not more money in some cases. I was looking at piebald albinos the other night and the cheapest one was 17k, and I've seen others for 65k. Clearly this is a huge industry. I also wonder how the ban is going to affect the hybrids some people are producing with the carpet and burmese python. Does that include more animals in the ban, or is it a way to get around it, seeing as how it's not technically a burmese? I saw one breeder last night put up her entire breeding stock for 1k, out of the fear that she ought to get rid of her reptiles before they are illegal for her to own. Mind you, a ball python doesn't grow *that* big. They get about the size of a baseball around the middle, and maybe about 4 feet long, and are known for their easy temperament. This is the easiest type of pet I've ever had! Ever! I love it!

I liken a lot of these laws to the ones they make for gun control. Not only are there federal laws, there are state laws, county laws, and individual city codes. So much of it is overkill or the same law - just enforce what we have. If it's a good, just law, it ought to work, right?

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#1220125 - 01/23/12 04:15 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
eshaw Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 02/11/11
Posts: 593
Loc: Iowa
I like snakes, always have BUT I also understand why some are being placed on the list. They can be dangerous, especially with an owner who doesn't know what they are doing, becomes bored with the animal and then just turns it loose. It's too late to do anything about the populations in Florida but I can understand why they'd want to head off problems else where. Another example, look at all the damage caused by feral hogs and they are aggressive also.

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#1220152 - 01/23/12 07:43 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
MissSarah Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 02/29/08
Posts: 3039
Loc: Bristol, Va
I signed the petition. Which (I never thought I'd say this. lol), but I sort of agree with Eshaw. I understand why dangerous animals may be placed on a ban list. Irresponsible owners ruin pets for everyone. Go ahead and try to rent a residence while having pets. Where I live, it's impossible.

My reason for signing though is the idea "Where will it stop?" I've been screaming from the rooftops for years that PETA and HSUS is not what they seem to be. They won't stop until all our animals are "liberated". frown
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#1220500 - 01/23/12 10:55 PM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
lovely1inred
Unregistered


The Florida populations have had genetic testing done and the majority of the animals were produced in controlled breeding facilities that were damaged from hurricane Andrew - not released by careless owners.

Most dangerous reptiles already have a series of permits or other requirements for owning them. The laws they just put into place make no sense whatsoever. Example: banning the yellow Anaconda, but not the green Anaconda. The green gets much bigger. The largest on record was 28ft.

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#1222470 - 01/29/12 12:14 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
eshaw Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 02/11/11
Posts: 593
Loc: Iowa
All I know is that the article I read said that Andrew was part of the reason but it also stated that some were just freed, just like I said and just as you stated when you said the majority. The article also stated that a snake was taken that swallowed a whole dear and they are the same size as kids or bigger so that makes them a danger in my book.


Edited by eshaw (01/29/12 01:32 AM)

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#1222487 - 01/29/12 12:29 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
SecretSquirrel Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 12/12/11
Posts: 193
Loc: Kentucky
I'm going to sign it mainly for the sake of gliders. I have owned snakes in the past, have nothing against snakes (not saying much for irresponsible owners- just like with any pet) but my view on this is that if they're using the Lacey Act which would be for preventing the transport of illegally collected game and are able to do it with snakes and are already lumping gliders in with all other "Dangerous" exotics then it's not a far cry to think that they'll be coming for our gliders eventually. They're already being banned in some states because they're being lumped in with every other exotic... They'll be using the same loop hole for all the rest as soon as they can get away with it or some dumb [self-censored] get's the bright idea.

Sorry I had to add what my husband's input was because I loved it!
"If they want to ban everything that's dangerous- they should start with the politicians."


Edited by SecretSquirrel (01/29/12 12:32 AM)
Edit Reason: What my husband has to say on the subject.
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#1222510 - 01/29/12 01:44 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
eshaw Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 02/11/11
Posts: 593
Loc: Iowa
I've watched the videos and read what was stated above. What I don't see is anything on the internet that alludes to what was stated above, i.e, amendments to the Lacey Act. If it's out there I'd like to read more on it. I believe that this is one industry that may be under pressure and they aren't alone. As far as them crying wolf I believe that they are correct when they say the Lacey Act isn't what it was meant to be. I think that when it was originally passed it was for a specific purpose, but like with everything else it's become contorted due to the agenda of special interest groups, just like the one fighting it. If there is a problem with it, it should be addressed by Congress and you should contact your legislators.

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#1222523 - 01/29/12 06:52 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: eshaw]
Fruitbat Offline
New Member

Registered: 07/31/10
Posts: 19
Loc: NH
Originally Posted By: eshaw
I've watched the videos and read what was stated above. What I don't see is anything on the internet that alludes to what was stated above, i.e, amendments to the Lacey Act.


http://www.kingsnake.com/blog/archives/7...l-Register.html

The time for pleading to the lawmakers is over for this. USARK is now gearing up for a federal lawsuit because their faulty science won't hold up in court.

This is an internet radio show, the head of USARK discusses the game plan. It begins with a very disturbing HSUS podcast.
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/urbanjungle...tion-for-battle
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#1222524 - 01/29/12 07:01 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: eshaw]
Fruitbat Offline
New Member

Registered: 07/31/10
Posts: 19
Loc: NH
Originally Posted By: eshaw
All I know is that the article I read said that Andrew was part of the reason but it also stated that some were just freed, just like I said and just as you stated when you said the majority. The article also stated that a snake was taken that swallowed a whole dear and they are the same size as kids or bigger so that makes them a danger in my book.


The number of pet python deaths in the past 20 years can be counted on your fingers. These pythons have been loose in the everglades for 40 years and no one has ever gotten killed. You are probably more likely to be killed on amusement park ride. Besides, if you're running around in the Everglades you have a lot more to worry about than big snakes. In fact, when they did the "python Hunters" show, they had to plant snakes to film because they just couldn't find any. It's not the epidemic the media makes it seem like.

Regardless, this ban is based on them being an invasive species, not the danger they pose to the public. There are countless others doing far more damage to the Everglades (cats, plants etc) but these snakes are an easy target because of public misconceptions like yours.
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:leu: Obi

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#1222791 - 01/30/12 02:01 AM Re: Your rights as a pet owner are being stripped away [Re: Fruitbat]
eshaw Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 02/11/11
Posts: 593
Loc: Iowa
Well Tammy, we all form opinions by what we are exposed to and if I read something I take it into account. I'm not saying it's true, just the propoganda I've read. Depending on ones point of view I could construe what you post as propoganda also but I'm trying to maintain an open mind on this. I know that there are things about the Lacey Act that are ridiculous. I also know that I've read what an invasive species is, it's non-native to the ecosystem and whose introduction causes or is likely to cause economic or environmental harm or harm to human health. I also know that and invasive species can be plants, animals and any other organism. I also know that typically human actions are usually the primary means of introducing the invasive species. That being said I can see how a lot of things could be considered invasive. That's why there are laws in place to try and limit their introduction. I'm not saying that you should have to give up your pet or business. I do think they need to find a better way to regulate the trading of exotic animals. Look at the laws for Ohio as an example.

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