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#1408834 - 04/11/17 11:36 PM Pouch protective
Mema Offline
Out of Pouch

Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 67
Loc: Wisconsin
So I have been reading an old post where several people have mentioned following a step by step plan by Bourbon to help with a pouch protective glider. I believe my little girl is that way and really need help in working with her. I was going to also order the oe pouch but I couldn't find it on the petglider website. I did send an email to them however in hopes to get one. I have 2 adult gliders and 2 new babies. I knew the girl was crabby but was hoping that if she was worked with she would come around. Anyway I'd be willing to pay to get step by step mentoring at this point because I so badly want a friendly hand tamed glider. None of mine are. Also not sure how to do it when u have 3 other gliders involved.

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#1408839 - 04/12/17 04:28 AM Re: Pouch protective [Re: Mema]
Ladymagyver Offline
Moderator

Registered: 10/07/14
Posts: 1854
Loc: SW Missouri
Originally Posted By: Mema
I knew the girl was crabby but was hoping that if she was worked with she would come around. *************

******** Also not sure how to do it when u have 3 other gliders involved.


How long have you had the girl, and is she a baby or the Momma?

I have found with my two (far from an expert, just giving you an option to try) that an OE (open environment) pouch isn't always a solution.

Also, there is a difference between scared and pouch protective. Peggy with Critter Love has a great U-tube video on the difference.

To me, it sounds like maybe she is scared? My glider Dot is the protector. Her favorite type of pouch is one that she can curl up in, be covered, and secretly sit up and see the world outside without climbing up and out. She does crab if I don't announce myself: coming in the room, or open their cage, or touch their sleeping pouch. A quiet hello or any soft greeting will let them know you are there. It will also erupt crabbing from the pouch protector, until they are accustomed to your presence.

There are also different levels of crabbing.

Can you describe what is happening in detail?



Edited by Ladymagyver (04/12/17 04:39 AM)
_________________________
Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Inhale the future...
Exhale the past...




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

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#1408842 - 04/12/17 06:23 AM Re: Pouch protective [Re: Mema]
sugarfluff Offline
Joey Member

Registered: 05/03/16
Posts: 111
Loc: South Dakota
Hi, just read your post and didn't know what an oe pouch was so I did a google search and came up with one available from TPG. Perhaps it's like one you're looking for.

https://www.thepetglider.com/glider-supp...vironment-pouch
_________________________
Desiree

:grey: Buttercup :leu: Falcore :wfb: Smores

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#1408845 - 04/12/17 07:29 AM Re: Pouch protective [Re: Mema]
TwoDog Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 12/28/15
Posts: 463
Loc: Pacific NW
Mema hey.
You have come to the right place. Lots of expertise here and people willing to help.
I will throw in what I can.

Can you tell us their story? How long have you had them? Were the joeys born there or did you take in the whole family together?
How is your interaction with them outside the pouch?
How old are the joeys?
Any recent events, a move, or a new cage or anything like that?
Don't Panic

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#1408926 - 04/12/17 08:59 PM Re: Pouch protective [Re: Mema]
Mema Offline
Out of Pouch

Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 67
Loc: Wisconsin
I will try to explain my situation as best I can. I have 2 adult caramel girls izzy and Bella. I have had them more then 2 years. I believe they are bonded to me but still don't trust me. The reason I say that is they don't bite or crab when I pick them up as long as I put them into another pouch right away and they will stay on me if I walk around with them but they will never approach me on their own or come to the front of the cage or bark for me or allow me to hold them? They still seem to be afraid of me after this long. I got a male joey and female Joey about a month ago. The boy is sweet and rarely crabs and takes treats from my fingers without biting. The girl was crabby from day 1 even tho the breeder allowed me to come and spend time with her at least 3 nights a week. She has gotten better as long as I announce myself, rub the pouch (even tho sometimes that makes her crab too) and are ready with a treat. She will usually crab, attack and get a bite of a treat and calm. However if she is in the tent and not in her pouch she will allow me to pet her, take treats without crabbing and occasionally climb on me. She does seem to be way more crabbier at night and will crab horribly, lunge and actually try to escape out of the pouch but asa she is out of the pouch she will take a treat without crabbing?????They all got put together in one cage a few nights ago so I'm sure that doesn't help and maybe that's why she seems to have gotten worse again? I did find her in a different pouch today (parachute) and I only undid one corner and peeked in and no crabbing so I don't know. I have never owned any pets before so I am new and totally clueless. I unfortunately am probably reading too much info and therefore getting more confused as to what I am doing wrong. I did try an oe corner pouch but they hated it but I also had other pouches to choose from and I understand I shouldn't. I purchased the ebooks by Arthur gibbons which I believe helped me get where I got with the caramels but again I still don't think they totally trust me and don't know why. It's frustrating. The two new ones (no names yet other then I call the girl sassy and the boy sweetie). I'm actually surprised I got two more because I don't feel that strong bond that everyone else seems to talk about with izzy and Bella even tho I still love them. I got the girl because the breeder was close by and allowed me to come and see her (and has admitted she's very crabby and if I change my mind can give her back)and she felt she would get better once she was away from her daddy who was a crabber. I took the boy because he was so sweet and I so badly want a pet to love, share, pet and enjoy and take care of and admittantly they are adorable and so so soft and I'm nocturnal as well so I thought it was a perfect fit. Doesn't help that my husband doesn't understand what I see in them but I think it's because I can't hold any of them. They basically are in their cage, in a pouch on me or in a tent. The two caramels don't play at all that I can see other then with pompoms and running on their wheel. They don't even do anything in the tent other then crawl into my shirt and sleep. Unfortunately the new ones aren't proving to be any different and maybe even worse (other then the boy).
Does any of my complaining help to understand what I am doing wrong? I hope so. I will check out the YouTube video to see if it does help me figure out if sassy is in fact pouch protective or if she's just sassy. Lol. Thank you!!!!

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#1408933 - 04/13/17 03:40 AM Re: Pouch protective [Re: Mema]
Ladymagyver Offline
Moderator

Registered: 10/07/14
Posts: 1854
Loc: SW Missouri
Ok. I will cover some basics I have learned.

First, you have a colony and when they are fully awake they only tolerate being held. For a short time. As they mature, they begin to accept your hands more. Trust is something you earn.

Second, try feeding all of them treats through the cage bars from the front. Not all will do this at first. It will be a "Monkey see monkey do" when the others see it is safe, they will eventually follow suit.

Third, remember each glider has a job in a colony. Also they are individuals with a unique personality.

They bite? While they are in the bonding pouch... Wait are you transferring them by hand, or using a piece of fleece to catch, move into bonsing pouch, or clip their nails?

Have you tried fist time in their bonding pouch?


Edited by Ladymagyver (04/13/17 03:43 AM)
_________________________
Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Inhale the future...
Exhale the past...




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

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#1408940 - 04/13/17 08:56 AM Re: Pouch protective [Re: Mema]
Feather Online   gc/lgc
Administrator

Registered: 01/19/08
Posts: 11903
Loc: Wisconsin
Not all gliders will allow you to hold them for long periods of time.

As, Dawn said every glider in the colony has a job, the one that is crabbing in the pouch is warning the others that something is near.

Have you read Bourbons article in bonding & Relations? Building a Relationship with your Glider

That article should help you also.

Good Luck and keep us posted.
_________________________
Kimberley
Feathers-Sweetie, Sklyar Blue, Mister Peanut, Big Mack & Ibo
Fur-Widget, Gadget, Guinan, Mr. Spock, T'Mir, Micheal, Flower, Stevie, Cho & Pappy :bb: T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon :wfb: TY, TJ & T'Pring :rtmo: O'Ryan :leu:
Forever in my heart, Gizmo, Tucker and the rest of my babies over the :rbridge:


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#1408943 - 04/13/17 09:22 AM Re: Pouch protective [Re: Mema]
TwoDog Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 12/28/15
Posts: 463
Loc: Pacific NW
Wow, caramels? You might be the only person on here with caramels. You should post some pics!

Yes, Ladymagyver, +1
Fist time. Possibly even Yogurt Fist.

My guys don't like to be held. I can pick them up and move them, though. I can pet them, but if I close my hand around them they tend to run off.
I can even rub them all over my face. Sooo soft
They are prey animals, birds and monkeys eat them. Your hands are on an uphill battle to earn their trust.
If they are sleepy, you can get away with more, and that's a good time to handle them--when they are too drowsy to get nervous.
They aren't like a puppy. A puppy or a kitten has thousands of generations of domestication in their genetic memory. They instinctively know from birth that humans are ok.
Gliders have only been in the pet trade a short time, so even though you got them at eight weeks (or so) like a puppy, what you have is basically a wild animal. No intrinsic trust built in.

Never having had pets before, you chose to jump right into the deep end with gliders. :-) It's not your imagination--they are difficult. But sooo rewarding.

SO, Don't worry. You got this. Patience, time and love are your weapons, and they have no defense against those.

And empathy. You must always see yourself through their eyes.

Try never to chase and grab. Trick, lure, cajole, etc. If you must grab them, do so with a fleece cloth or something, to help disassociate your hands with the action of grabbing.

You are teaching them that Mama's hands are always a PARTY! The Fist (do a search, there's a couple threads) will help with this a lot.

And baby talk. Much baby talk. And air guitar. They love to watch you air guitar.

You are in the right place now. Welcome to GC. :-)

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#1408946 - 04/13/17 02:01 PM Re: Pouch protective [Re: Mema]
Mema Offline
Out of Pouch

Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 67
Loc: Wisconsin
Dawn, Izzy was a biter but rarely does any more. She will try and bite like most gliders when clipping her nails but otherwise she doesnt much any more.
Sassy hasn't bitten me now in a few days but she does crab and lunge so i am always prepared with a treat that she gets a taste of instead of my finger. To be honest i havent tried more then a few times to transfer her from her pouch into a bonding bag. I usually just let her stay in her pouch and i tuck that into my shirt so i havent used my hands at all with her. The boy i can actually pick up with my hands and he is ok with it. I guess i didn't realize i have a "colony" now. Does that change their personality a lot? How? They don't seem to hang out together. The two caramels sleep together and the other two sleep together and they seem to play at different times.
Feather i coincidentally found Bourbons website (i think) and copies her articles. I will be studying that. I also found her youtube video and listened to that as well.
TwoDog, i will see what i can do to post a pic. I do think they are different in a lot of ways. I was told they are more docile and friendlier so that is why i started with them. They are bigger. They are not big treat eaters which made it difficult to bribe. Izzy has always been the crabbier and she still doesnt allow anyone else to hold her. My breeder said she has never seen a caramel as "crabby" as her. :)))) I have tried fist time and have to admit its much better "taking a bite" that way. Since doing that the girl does seem better about the biting. My husband is constantly reminding me they are wild animals and doesnt believe they will ever be a good pet. I want to see what everyone is talking about when they say they are so "rewarding" Thats what i havent found with any of mine as of yet. I have learned some things from having the two first but have a long way to go to understand them but i will not give up on them either. I will keep trying to learn everything i can and this forum has helped me feel like i can do this so thank you. Thank you to you guys taking the time to listen and reply. I truly appreciate it. I will be back for sure.

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