Sugar Glider Community Calendar

Please click here to see larger view
Articles
More coming soon!!
Today's Birthdays
Sherri
Featured Member
Registered: 12/11/17
Posts: 5
Last 10 Posts
Self Mutilating
by Feather
05:42 PM
Grieving sugar glider
by Feather
05:33 PM
BML Help
by Feather
05:32 PM
Another Prolapsed cloaca
by JenK
02:36 PM
Recipe for glider yogi's please!
by Ladymagyver
01:58 PM
Hi new to forum.
by durga
10:36 AM
Three weeks in, first timer, questions .
by Lisa11
02:26 AM
New odor issue??
by AlyCatz
10:56 PM
Injured Tail W/No Vet Instru/Help!
by Ladymagyver
08:46 PM
Lighter Gliders??
by Feather
05:59 PM
Google+

Facebook
Join Us On Facebook
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
#162764 - 10/26/06 02:42 PM Sick Gliders - Need Input *UPDATE*
TracieB Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 4338
Loc: Lenexa, KS
Here’s the short version (yes, it really is) of what’s going on. If you want to read the more detailed version, go here

Nara & Alkina are about 9 months old, and I’ve had them for about 7 months. Had them on dry pellet diet, found GC and switched to Judie’s BML. They ate most of it for a little while, but kept eating less and less of the BML and their fruits & veggies. I switched vets in September, so they were just in for a check up on Sept 6th and everything was fine. I had an old food scale that I was weighing them on, and they seemed to be holding their weight. But with the small amount of food they were eating, I was getting concerned. So I bought a digital food scale and weighed them on that. I compared that weight to what they weighed at the vet, and Nara had lost several grams, and Alkina just a couple.

When I noticed the weight loss, I got them back to the vet. Nara had lost 8 grams, Alkina weighed the same as before. They did a fecal smear & float which were fine. They also did a cytology which showed too many rods/negative grams. The tests were run on combined fecals. Both girls were put on Baytril to be given 2 times a day for 14 days and I was to start syringe feeding them 5-6 times per day. Re-check in 5 days. I was struggling to get them to eat the BML from the syringe, and they were hardly touching the food in the cage at night. Needed to switch diets to get them to eat. I read up on Darcy’s diet and since I could go out and get the ingredients for it, I started them on that. First night they ate all the Ensure (Equate brand) mixture, scrambled egg, and picked at fruits & veggies. From then on they ate less and less of that diet as well. Most of the Ensure mixture gone by morning, but protein and fruits & veggies not eaten. Still syringe feeding Ensure 5 times a day. Next vet visit on Oct 16th. Nara had lost 2 more grams and Alkina still holding her weight. Ran a second cytology and it looked better. Continue with meds and feedings. Recheck in a week. Back to the vet on the 23rd. Nara gained 3 grams, Alkina still the same. Cytology run again on each. Nara’s looked better, Alkina showed rods/negative grams up from last visit. vet said changing diets may have some influence on tests, so keep them on same diet for next 14 days then re-check. They still play a little when out for play time, but not like they used to. Eyes look bright, ears up, noses pink, and vet said they were well hydrated.

They are both sleeping in my bra during the day and a couple of times I have heard a strange noise coming from there – almost like one of them is eating something but it is kind of a wet sound. But there’s nothing in there to eat. So when I look in Nara looks like she’s eating. I can’t find anything wet in there, but did find a few little “curds” that maybe could be Ensure. Then yesterday when I looked in, Alkina looked like she was trying to vomit. Nothing came out, but that’s what it looked like to me (unless I’m just paranoid now and she was yawning or something). I have no experience with this, so is that what happens when they vomit? Could there be no actual vomit to find? With them not eating very much again, and no extra protein besides the small amount in the Ensure, and the possible vomiting I’m just very concerned and wondering what it might be. The vet had said that if they weren’t any better, she may need to sedate them and do blood work and x-rays. I’m wondering how safe this is to do and if anyone has any experience with it. Looking for any ideas, suggestions, experiences, etc.

Also, my vet is Dr. Theresa Bradley at the Belton Animal Clinic in Belton, MO. If anyone in the area has any experience with her, I’d also like to know what you think of her.


Edited by gliderdad79 (11/07/06 11:05 AM)
_________________________
Tracie
1 wonderful husband - Chris
1 goofy Yorkie - Dexter
2 naughty kitties - Chloe & Alek

Waiting at the Rainbow Bridge:
1 spoiled Yorkie, Myles - April 5, 1993-June 5, 2007
1 sweet :wfb: Xavier - August 5, 2007-May 20, 2010
2 sweet :grey: :grey: Nara & Alkina - February, 2006-November, 2011





Top
#162772 - 10/26/06 03:00 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: TracieB]
Srlb Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 10/30/03
Posts: 16758
Loc: St. Johns, Florida
Dr. Bradley is well known and one that does much work with gliders. I first want to say I am sorry you are going through this and I pray it all turns out for the best.

It does sound like your gliders are vomitting or attempting to. I had a glider vomit before and yes it does look like you described and they will also eat it when they are done.

Please call Dr. Bradley and let her know they are vomitting as this will cause a glider to dehydrate very quickly and if you can actually gather some fresh, it may also be tested.

Please keep us posted.
_________________________
Peggy
Critter Love
Critter Love® Diet Center

If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.


Top
#162779 - 10/26/06 03:10 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: Srlb]
Dancing Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 22746
Loc: 80 acres of paradise in KS
Dr. Bradley is one of the BEST! You won't find a better glider vet anywhere in our area. Besides, she is so sweet too.

As for protiens...have you tried babyfood? or better yet, home made babyfood? Offering it as a licky treat or syringe feed?

I know she doesn't want you to change diets until more testing but I have an idea you might want to try after that. Call me if you want (I'm just south of KC in Prescott) 620 215 4857.
_________________________
620-704-9109
Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.

I could have missed the pain
But I'd of had to miss the dance


The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.

Top
#162786 - 10/26/06 03:21 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: Dancing]
SugarBlossoms Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/23/06
Posts: 5830
Loc: USA
What does rods/negative grams mean?

So sorry your girls aren't feeling well and praying for them to get well FAST!
_________________________
Keeper of Handprints on my Heart, You left your Footprints on my soul.
My precious loves that left to quickly, Peanut, Katie
Isabella, Kiwi, Bonnie and Monroe.

Spread your wings and glide free of pain,
Until the day I see you again.

God speed my precious angels. I love you. Mama.

Top
#162859 - 10/26/06 04:56 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: SugarBlossoms]
Msdoolittle Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 10/15/06
Posts: 582
Loc: Lake Worth, FL
I think she means gram negative rods. These are bacteria that are normally found in the intestinal tract. Hope this helps!
_________________________
~Janet~
Mom to 2 daughters (Laura & Kayla)
4 suggies (Scooter & Snickers, Coral,& Portia)
3 birds (Prince,Lucy,Sidney)
1 dog (Sammy)


Top
#162876 - 10/26/06 05:43 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: Msdoolittle]
SugarBlossoms Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/23/06
Posts: 5830
Loc: USA
Oh, okay. I tried looking it up but ended up going in circles on the internet frown
_________________________
Keeper of Handprints on my Heart, You left your Footprints on my soul.
My precious loves that left to quickly, Peanut, Katie
Isabella, Kiwi, Bonnie and Monroe.

Spread your wings and glide free of pain,
Until the day I see you again.

God speed my precious angels. I love you. Mama.

Top
#162941 - 10/26/06 08:03 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: SugarBlossoms]
thefotokat Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 06/23/06
Posts: 1360
Loc: Ft. Pierce, FL
Did your vet check their teeth? Since everyone says she's great, I'm sure she did, but when my girl Ollie had periodontal probs, she showed some of these signs you described. She wasn't eating as much and would move her mouth around as if she were chewing even when she didn't have any food. I took her to the vet and he found she had a severe periodontal infection. She lost 2 lower incisors and we went through a few rounds of antibiotics and oral irrigation before it subsided. Once he removed the infected teeth she stopped doing those mouth movements and w/some changes to her diet, began eating well. Nothing showed up on her fecals at the time. I hope all works out well for you.
_________________________
Kate
SouthEast Sugar Gliders
SESG Rescue and Sanctuary
SECARES
Go To The Vet!!!

Top
#162956 - 10/26/06 08:27 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: thefotokat]
queenduck Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 6249
Loc: Kansas
OK, I am going to be the mean one here. But, is there a chance that they are passing it back and forth, one is getting better while one is still sick, neithor has a change to recover completely before they pass it on to another? And the vomit, one could eat the others, passing it even more?

I have not had sick gliders, so I have no experience, But, I do have a lot of medical background with humans/esp. kids (I have 6 kids, lol). And depending on what the kids have, I 'try' to keep them apart.

I know it would be stressful for you, and the gliders, but wondering if it might help one, or both of them to be in seperate cages, and not carried around together. Share your time equally between them. Change your clothes before you bond with the other one. Don't let them share pouches, dishes, tent, nothing.

I have never heard of anyone doing it this way, but after all you have tried, I don't know if it could hurt. Just an idea.
_________________________
Alicia aka Queenduck, Bentley's Nana

We need role models who are going to break the mold ~ Carly Simon

Top
#163124 - 10/27/06 02:34 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: queenduck]
TracieB Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 4338
Loc: Lenexa, KS
Well, about an hour after I made this post I called the vet and got in to see her. I spent three hours there and have since been busy with the girls.

I know I won't get all of this right (just like the gram negative rods thing), but I'll try. Maybe you guys can at least make out what it is.

The vet put them under and did x-rays and a blood draw, and sent off fecals for culture & sensitivity on both. The x-rays showed that both had a fair amount of gas in their tummies, and Nara showed "something" in the intestines. The vet didn't seem super concerned about it at this time. She thought maybe it was just some stools that were a little firm and hadn't passed. She didn't think it was a blockage, and said she didn't feel anything unusual when she palpated Nara's stomach while she was out for the x-rays and blood draw. She said the only way to tell for sure what it is is by doing exploratory surgery and she didn't think it was time for that yet.

The blood work, however, was not good news. I have no idea what all the names for everything are that they check, but what they all showed was that both Nara and Alkina are having liver and pancreas problems. Hopefully it is something as simple as an infection that the Baytril just didn't affect, and the new round of meds will take care of it. She said that if they were liter mates, it could possibly be something they were born with but it would be fairly unlikely that would be the case if they are not liter mates (unless somehow I just happened to get two unrelated joeys with liver problems). I have no idea if they are liter mates or not since, as I stated above, I got them from a trade show where all the joeys were just put in one cage. Obviously, I'm hoping for the infection scenario because that means that it's treatable. The vet said that the liver can heal itself pretty well if it is some sort of infection. Their electrolytes were also a little low even though they don't seem to be dehydrated.

She was also concerned with the amount of fat in the Ensure and with the high numbers for the pancreas, suggested that I switch back to the BML (even though they hate it - at least it contains the protein that they need that they weren't eating anyway on Darcy's diet).

So, back to syringe feeding BML 5 times a day, plus now I'm also supposed to syringe feed them their fruits and veggies, blended up with some Pedialyte. And of course the new round of meds.
Simethecone for the gas - 2 times a day until eating & defecating normally (she also thought if they get rid of the gas they might eat a little more readily).
Flagyl (metronidazole) antibiotic - 2 times a day for 5 days
Lactulose (used in the treatment of constipation and hepatic encephalopathy, a complication of liver disease) - 2 times a day for 10 days
Amoxidrops (amoxicillin) antibiotic - 2 times a day for 14 days

I can't seem to hold them right to get them to eat and take meds. I tried wrapping them in a towel and holding them like it shows in the How to give syringe meds post- no go. I now let them stand on a towel with a piece of fleece around them and try and hold their head to get the food and meds in. But they always seem to wiggle free and I spend lots of time trying to get them back in position and get everything in them. Nara now bites a lot while I'm trying to feed/medicate her, which is sad because she was not a biter before. I know it stresses them out and I can't think that would be very good for them, but neither is not eating or taking meds. It just kills me to have to hold them down and "wrestle" with them. Any ideas?

That's all I can think of to update right now. Thanks you all for your thoughts and advise. Now, anyone who believes, please pray for my girls to get well.

Queenduck - guess that might be possible. The vet didn't say anything about it, but then again I didn't ask! I'll try and remember to ask.
_________________________
Tracie
1 wonderful husband - Chris
1 goofy Yorkie - Dexter
2 naughty kitties - Chloe & Alek

Waiting at the Rainbow Bridge:
1 spoiled Yorkie, Myles - April 5, 1993-June 5, 2007
1 sweet :wfb: Xavier - August 5, 2007-May 20, 2010
2 sweet :grey: :grey: Nara & Alkina - February, 2006-November, 2011





Top
#163135 - 10/27/06 03:23 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: TracieB]
Anonymous
Unregistered


So sorry you are going thru this.

We will include you in our prayers.

Angel and The Suggies

Top
#163136 - 10/27/06 03:30 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: TracieB]
Anonymous
Unregistered


TracieB, I am so sorry you have two sick little girls there. We have all of our little fingers and toes crossed that the problem will turn out to be a bacteria so the antibiotic will take care of it. I DO believe so I am sending suggie hugs and prayers your way that they will make a speedy and uncomplicated recovery. Please keep us posted on their progress. hug2 hug2 hug2

Top
#163141 - 10/27/06 04:19 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: ]
Xfilefan Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 8899
Loc: Jacksonville, FL
You need to hold the head very firmly-at the jaw hinge, and wrap the rest of the body kind of like a burritio. Use the palm of your hand-between the little finger and base of the thumb, to grip the shoulders. They won't want to open their mouth-put gentle pressure on the back teeth with the tip of the syringe from the side until they do, then slip the syringe in the mouth and put in the meds. If you can get someone to help hold the body, while you deal with the head and syringe, that can help as well. They won't want to take it, and will fight you. Usually after a few days, it gets easier. They'll still struggle, but they know you won't give up until they eat the nasty stuff, and it's not as intense. It can take a few tries to get the meds in. With some gliders, if you gently squirt just a little in the front of the mouth by those long bottom teeth, they'll open for you as well-then you can follow thru with the rest. I always follow meds with a sweet treat or a mealie-mine know post meds means treat, and look for it.

Please keep us updated on your babies. hug2
_________________________
Jen/Colin :bb: Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed :wfb: Sinbad, :wfb: Gabby, :grey: Baby, and :grey: Alley

Top
#163243 - 10/27/06 10:21 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: Xfilefan]
BeckiT Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/29/06
Posts: 16083
Loc: Manitowoc, WI
Tracie, sorry to hear the vet visit didn't hold the best news frown I'm saying prayers that it's something that the c&s finds and is treatable so they'll feel better soon! As Jen said, always follow up with a treat so they don't feel like the syringe equals punishment wink
_________________________
~Becki & Crew~
Glidin' High Sugar Gliders
So You Want to Own a Sugar Glider? Read and Share wink

Top
#163298 - 10/27/06 11:54 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: BeckiT]
TracieB Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 4338
Loc: Lenexa, KS
Jen, thank you. I tried your method again, and the added details of where/how to hold helped a lot with Alkina. I still had problems with Nara, but maybe I'll get better. Nara is the smaller of the two, but is very "wiggly". I'm afraid to hold them too tight, so I'm sure it's just how I'm doing it. (Wish you could come and show me!) And maybe she's just too stubborn or not too smart. She should know by now that I'm not going to give up - we've been doing this for 17 days now! I did follow up with a treat today so maybe that will start to help in the days to come. My main problem is that I have to give them the 4 different meds (which I actually sucked up into one syringe to aviod 4 different droppers), then try and get them to each eat 1cc of BML and 1cc of the fruit/veggie/Pedialyte mix, plus try and get a little extra Pedialyte in them. So as you might imagine, they're having to sit there for quite a while to get it all down. Not sure how much is getting IN them verses ON them.

Thanks again everyone for your prayers, thoughts, and advise. It helps more than you know.
_________________________
Tracie
1 wonderful husband - Chris
1 goofy Yorkie - Dexter
2 naughty kitties - Chloe & Alek

Waiting at the Rainbow Bridge:
1 spoiled Yorkie, Myles - April 5, 1993-June 5, 2007
1 sweet :wfb: Xavier - August 5, 2007-May 20, 2010
2 sweet :grey: :grey: Nara & Alkina - February, 2006-November, 2011





Top
#163325 - 10/27/06 12:57 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: TracieB]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Oh my goodness I'm so sorry you and your girls are having to go through this. How awful! I will keep you in my prayers and hope that everything turns out for the better! Hang in there! hug2

Top
#163581 - 10/27/06 11:01 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: ]
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
Tracie, you are absolutely right, with everything your girls are going through, now isn't the time to be adding anything else and I doubt they would eat them anyway. I'm sorry I didn't know how bad things had gotten for you and them. hug2

I'm sorry everything didn't work out better, again, I wish I were closer to help you out. If you do come up to your parents with the girls anytime soon and need an extra hand, let me know and I'll come over to help you out.

With Kira and meds (again, though, she doesn't have nearly as much to take as yours do) I 'pinch' her head between my thumb and middle finger with my pointer finger on top of her head, that way she can't move her head anywhere I don't want it to go. And I let her hold onto my other hand with the syringe in it (I feel like I should have a diagram roflmao) it has worked the best for me because she still feels like she has control. I just have to make sure her nails are clipped. She mostly just holds onto my thumb and the base of my thumb and doesn't fight at all except to try to move her head (which she can't). dunno
That's just what works for us. But have also used the burrito method - it's just so much easier with two people.

Keep us updated, I think about you and your girls several times a day. I hope everything starts to get better for them soon. They sure have had a long haul already. hug2
_________________________
~Gretchen
Maia & Squish
If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.

Top
#163591 - 10/27/06 11:21 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: sugarlope]
TracieB Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 4338
Loc: Lenexa, KS
Gretchen, thanks for the offer to help. I'm going to try and not travel with them until I know they are on the mend. My best friend also lives in Moberly and her little girl is having her 2nd birthday party on Nov. 18th and I'm going to try and make it to that. But my girls will be all better by then because they will be finished with their meds and all will be well (positive thinking, crosses fingers, knocks on wood). wink

I have been holding their head as you described. Nara just pushes and pulls her head so much and so hard I'm afraid I'm going to hurt her. And if she can get her hands out of the fleece, she bats at or grabs the syringe and pushes it away. I just keep telling them both how sorry I am but that it's for their own good and if they would just eat on their own I wouldn't have to do this! They don't really listen well. smirk

Other than being super crabby (which I can't blame them) they don't seem to be feeling horrible. They'll still come out at play time and run around a little and play with a few things. They just don't do it as long as they used to before they crawl back in my bra for a nap.

So for now I will continue with the feeding and meds. I talked with the vet today and she said that after a few days if they were keeping or gaining weight, I could cut back one feeding per day. Continue that until they were keeping or gaining and then slowly wean them off the daily feedings if they were eating on their own. Hopefully after the meds have started having an affect, they'll feel a little better and start eating on their own.

I'll update as I have any new/additional info.
_________________________
Tracie
1 wonderful husband - Chris
1 goofy Yorkie - Dexter
2 naughty kitties - Chloe & Alek

Waiting at the Rainbow Bridge:
1 spoiled Yorkie, Myles - April 5, 1993-June 5, 2007
1 sweet :wfb: Xavier - August 5, 2007-May 20, 2010
2 sweet :grey: :grey: Nara & Alkina - February, 2006-November, 2011





Top
#163603 - 10/28/06 12:03 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: TracieB]
KattyM Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 12/24/02
Posts: 9910
Loc: Phoenix, AZ
Tracie, sending hug2 and lots of prayers your way that your two wee ones keep those meds and their food down and continue on the mend.

When I had to force feed meds, my biggest problem was making sure they didn't shake their heads and the meds out too soon. So, be sure to keep your grip until you're sure they've actually swallowed every last drop of goodness. I often leave the syringe where it is, and use the tip to "spoon" what did fall outside the mouth back in.

Following up with treats, especially when you don't have to worry about them gaining weight, is a definite must! heart
_________________________
Owned by my :grey: "Eight is Enough" colony:

• 2003: Hiroshi (M)
• 2009: Herbie (M)

:rbridge:
• 2002-2004: Keiko (F) and baby Tomoki (M)
• 2009: Sammy (F), Charlie (F), Murray (M)
• 2010: BJ (M)
My gallery

Top
#163612 - 10/28/06 12:51 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: TracieB]
the gliders angel Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/08/01
Posts: 3060
Loc: u.s.a.
never ever do exploratory surgery on a glider they will die. thats a fact too small to lose that much blood. it would be as good as putting them to sleep that would b e the same thing. i would let them eat egg or chicken baby food and sprinkle some vionate vitamins on it and give them a little yogurt and their fruit and veggies. i wouldnt force feed them at all if they were mine they would eat what i am telling you. i would also give them mealworms for protein. it would be less stress on them to do this. you can also give them gliderade. i would of had a direct fecal with gram stain and culture done. and a culture and sensitivity on their urine. this will tell you what meds you need for the bacteria in their bodies. which is most likely causing this. but they would need to be off meds for 3 to 4 days before the cultures.

Top
#163683 - 10/28/06 09:43 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: the gliders angel]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Tracie, I'm so sorry you're going through this. I was in a similar position with Piper recently, where she was sick with diarrhea and we weren't getting anywhere figuring out what was wrong with fecals. Although at one point, we found and treated trichomonads, she didn't get better when they were gone. My vets were talking about doing blood work too, but I chose not to go that route. I'm happy to report that she is getting better on her own since I switched her to a bland diet. Here's hoping that the same thing happens with your little ones.

You have a wonderful vet. I, too have heard of Dr. Bradley through Dancing. In fact a while back, my vet called and consulted with her when I had another sick glider. I think you can trust that she wouldn't suggest an exploratory if it meant certain death. However, you do have to weigh the invasive nature of tests against the potential information it can provide and whether or not it is likely to suggest a viable course of action. In my case, my vet said that he had had inconsistent results in being able to get blood from a glider, and when I asked what he thought he might find out, he said it would direct him toward more tests like biopsies, etc. I didn't feel the potential gain outweighed the potential risk (and expense) and he said he certainly understood that decision.

I would like to point out that what seemed to turn my Piper around was not medication, but a switch to a bland diet. I think she may have developed an allergy to something in her normal diet, and it was irritating her gut. Now that we seem to have her gut normalized, I now need to figure out what it was that set her off. I'm going to add back in each part of her diet individually until I find one that she reacts to. The top of my list of suspects are something in the PML (possibly the Wambaroo) or the yogurt. I suspect the yogurt because when I took her off the meds, I started feeding more yogurt and she got definitely worse. I thought at the time it was because she was off meds, but now I suspect what I thought would help her was actually irritating her gut more.

You can read about Piper's story HERE .

Top
#163821 - 10/28/06 07:30 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: ]
Kitkatt1216 Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 10/28/06
Posts: 1763
Loc: Connecticut
I've had a little experience with feeding one of my girls pedilyte out of a syringe lately, and the wrapping up method didn't work with her either. I found it easiest just to grip her in my hand with my thumb on her belly and her head between my pointer and middle fingers, using gentle pressure to hold her there. I think it's a little less scary than the blanket and it makes for quick access.
_________________________
Katrina
Owned by Murphy and Peanut

**RIP My loves Amunet, MiaKoda, and Kieko**

Top
#163924 - 10/29/06 12:01 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: Kitkatt1216]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Wow Tracie, I'm sorry I'm just now catching this - When I first started reading I was going to suggest a shotgun approach with cephalexin and baytril, but I see you're using metro & amoxidrops currently (not a big fan of amoxidrops, but should be ok) - What concerns me the most is the intestinal blockage, her "gagging", and their ensure diet. I hate to say this, but I believe that it's the ensure that has caused the blockage. That would explain the mass in her digestive tract & the gagging/dry heaving.

I agree completely with Dr. Bradley, get them back on BML. Do it any way you can. Mine went on strike for a while & I had to introduce it back to them slowly - I started with the chicken baby food w/ calcium - then I added some yogurt juice w/ cereal - then add a little wheat germ...The key is to do it slowly until you are feeding BML, it took me about a month to get all the ingredients in there, but they are eating it all every night.

Top
#164000 - 10/29/06 07:08 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: ]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
When I switched my gliders over to BML about a year ago, I consulted on the phone with Bourbon on how to go about it...
I mixed the ingredients in the specific order that she gave me (which you can now see by going to http://www.angelfire.com/nb/sugargliders/bml/leadbeat.html ). Then, for the first two weeks, ALL that was fed to the gliders was the Basic BML mixture - no fruits, veggies, or insects. After that, I gradually started to add the fruits and veggies in the evening a couple of HOURS after the BML was put into the cage; then in the morning, the insects were offered.
This really worked for all 11 of my gliders and they all eat BML with no problem now.
HTH
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

Top
#164467 - 10/30/06 11:53 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input [Re: sugarglidersuz]
TracieB Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 4338
Loc: Lenexa, KS
I have been trying to “spoon up” any lost meds. I put all of their meds in one syringe and give it to them before anything else. That way they're not already tired of eating (not that they like it, but they're not too frustrated yet!). And I think it may be starting to help a little giving the treats afterwards. At least they have something to look forward to. grin

Maybe I worded my first post wrong, but I have no plans to do exploratory surgery, and I don't think the vet was suggesting it. She just mentioned that it would be close to impossible to see what the blockage was without it. She said it might be possible to find something out with an ultrasound, but it still may not show enough detail to see what it is. As far as the food, I tried eggs, plain boiled chicken, eggs and chicken mixed, chicken and yogurt mixed, and baby food - they wouldn't eat any of it and they won't eat any vegetables and very little fruit if left to eat on their own. So I have tried to offer things that I thought would be appealing to them, but no luck. I voiced my concerns to Dr. Bradley about the stress that force feeding them causes, and just the waking them up multiple times during the day to feed and medicate. She said that it does stress them which isn't great for them, but not eating and losing weight isn’t good for them either. At least if I can get some food in them it will help them keep their strength up so they'll hopefully be able to fight this better.

On the BML I did use the recipe from the angelfire link - sort of. I didn't realize that the blender was supposed to stay on after the first two ingredients so I added the first two, blended then turned it off. Then added the others and blended for 5 minutes. I'll also ask to see if Dr. Bradley thinks it might be some sort of food allergy/reaction. They didn't have diarrhea when this all started, just stopped eating and started losing weight. I really would like to find out what caused all this to start with to make sure it doesn't happen again.

They now both have very soft stools - sometimes very watery - which I pretty much expected from the Lactulose, but I'm hoping that's a good thing - for Nara at least. Maybe it will help clear out whatever it is in her intestines. I am giving Pedialyte 3 times a day, and they are drinking a good amount of water on their own, but I offer it after every feeding and they usually take it. They’re still not eating much during the night. I have been offering BML, fruits and veggies cut up, and some of the fruit/veggies blended mix. This morning a fair amount (not quite half a tablespoon) of the fruit/veggies blended mix was gone, but they hardly touched the BML or the cut up fruit and veggies. I’ll weigh them again tomorrow and see how they’re doing. Then they have a follow-up vet visit on Thursday so maybe I'll know more then.

thanks again everyone for your input. Lots of info to take in!


Edited by TracieB (10/30/06 11:54 AM)
_________________________
Tracie
1 wonderful husband - Chris
1 goofy Yorkie - Dexter
2 naughty kitties - Chloe & Alek

Waiting at the Rainbow Bridge:
1 spoiled Yorkie, Myles - April 5, 1993-June 5, 2007
1 sweet :wfb: Xavier - August 5, 2007-May 20, 2010
2 sweet :grey: :grey: Nara & Alkina - February, 2006-November, 2011





Top
#166259 - 11/03/06 10:44 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input *UPDATE* [Re: TracieB]
TracieB Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 4338
Loc: Lenexa, KS
Nara and Alkina had their follow-up visit yesterday. Nara was up 3 grams from her last visit (now 76 grams) jump and Alkina's weight was still the same (83 grams). Dr. Bradley re-tested the blood and most of Alkina's numbers looked better, and some of Nara's did. The levels for the pancreas were still high, but the vet said that just as it takes a while for them to show up it can take a while for them to come back down. She felt they had definitely improved. Also, Nara had another X-ray and everything looked good so she must have passed whatever it was that was in there. They still are barely eating anything on their own at night, but I'm now stopping the last feeding of the night to see if that makes any difference. They will eat some mealworms when offered, and are always happy to take their Yogurt Drop treat after feeding and med time! If they continue to maintain/gain weight then I'll stop the first morning feeding next. Hopefully they'll start eating right on their own soon so none of us has to go through the stress of the feedings! crazy

They have finished their round of Flagyl, will finish the Lactulose on Sunday, and then finish the Amoxidrops next Thursday. We'll see the vet again in two weeks and hopefully all will be well again. agree
_________________________
Tracie
1 wonderful husband - Chris
1 goofy Yorkie - Dexter
2 naughty kitties - Chloe & Alek

Waiting at the Rainbow Bridge:
1 spoiled Yorkie, Myles - April 5, 1993-June 5, 2007
1 sweet :wfb: Xavier - August 5, 2007-May 20, 2010
2 sweet :grey: :grey: Nara & Alkina - February, 2006-November, 2011





Top
#167470 - 11/06/06 12:29 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input *UPDATE* [Re: TracieB]
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
Tracie, I'm so glad their weight is doing better. I hope everything continues to look up!
_________________________
~Gretchen
Maia & Squish
If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.

Top
#167475 - 11/06/06 12:37 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input *UPDATE* [Re: sugarlope]
BeckiT Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/29/06
Posts: 16083
Loc: Manitowoc, WI
TracieB, how are Nara and Alkina doing?
_________________________
~Becki & Crew~
Glidin' High Sugar Gliders
So You Want to Own a Sugar Glider? Read and Share wink

Top
#167839 - 11/06/06 11:14 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input *UPDATE* [Re: BeckiT]
TracieB Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 4338
Loc: Lenexa, KS
For the past three days I have dropped another feeding so now we're down to three per day. They are still taking the Amoxidrops and Simethecone until Thursday. I mixed up just some water, honey, and egg and am leaving that plus some BML in the cage at night, but still feeding the BML during feedings. The last two nights they have eaten almost an entire tablespoon of the honey and egg mixture, but hardly touched the BML (they weren't eating the BML on their own, that's why I mixed the other up. Since honey and egg are part of the BML, I wasn't introducing anything new to them). They are starting to nibble on the fruits a little, but not much. As long as they maintain their weight, I'll stick with the three feedings a couple more days then try dropping another one and see how they do with that. I will probably wait until after they have finished their meds, then start skipping the morning feeding (that's when I give meds) so I'm not waking them up shortly after they've gone to bed. The vet also suggested starting to add the BML ingredients to the water, honey and egg mixture one at a time and see if they continue to eat it. We go back for another check up and blood work on Thursday the 16th. So for now, things are looking better.

_________________________
Tracie
1 wonderful husband - Chris
1 goofy Yorkie - Dexter
2 naughty kitties - Chloe & Alek

Waiting at the Rainbow Bridge:
1 spoiled Yorkie, Myles - April 5, 1993-June 5, 2007
1 sweet :wfb: Xavier - August 5, 2007-May 20, 2010
2 sweet :grey: :grey: Nara & Alkina - February, 2006-November, 2011





Top
#167850 - 11/06/06 11:29 PM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input *UPDATE* [Re: TracieB]
BeckiT Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/29/06
Posts: 16083
Loc: Manitowoc, WI
That's good news, wtg girls! Now I have a ? - I know what the amoxidrops are for, but what is the simethecone for? The only thing I've ever seen that used for is gas, lol..
_________________________
~Becki & Crew~
Glidin' High Sugar Gliders
So You Want to Own a Sugar Glider? Read and Share wink

Top
#167862 - 11/07/06 12:02 AM Re: Sick Gliders - Need input *UPDATE* [Re: BeckiT]
TracieB Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/07/06
Posts: 4338
Loc: Lenexa, KS
Yep, that's what it's for. grin When the vet did the original X-rays, she saw a large amount of gas in their tummies shock and thought that might be part of the reason they weren't eating. At the last visit, the vet re-did the X-rays on Nara (because it looked like there was something in the intestines on the first visit - which were clear this time) and the gas had been reduced, but there was still a little there. So, you're right, it's gas!! It's the exact same stuff you'd get for a human baby. wink
_________________________
Tracie
1 wonderful husband - Chris
1 goofy Yorkie - Dexter
2 naughty kitties - Chloe & Alek

Waiting at the Rainbow Bridge:
1 spoiled Yorkie, Myles - April 5, 1993-June 5, 2007
1 sweet :wfb: Xavier - August 5, 2007-May 20, 2010
2 sweet :grey: :grey: Nara & Alkina - February, 2006-November, 2011





Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >




Moderator:  Feather, KarenE, Ladymagyver, Philwojo 
Sugar Glider Help Page



Please click above to see how you can help!!

Moon
CURRENT MOON
Who's Online
0 registered (), 19 Guests and 22 Spiders online.
Key: Owner, Admin, Mod
Newest Members
Sal305, Cherylr1995, SarasotaSugs, Lisa11, JessicaSound
6450 Registered Users
Forum Stats
23 posts in the last 24hrs
6450 Members
134 Forums
8995 Topics
148710 Posts

Max Online: 478 @ 07/15/07 01:24 AM
Last 10 New Topics
BML Help
by Alan
04:59 PM
Grieving sugar glider
by Firefly
01:04 PM
Self Mutilating
by Anonymous
11:26 AM
Injured Tail W/No Vet Instru/Help!
by
03:57 AM
Recipe for glider yogi's please!
by Claralice
12/12/17 10:03 PM
My Caramel Gliders anything I need to know about neutering?
by Claralice
12/12/17 04:14 PM
Three weeks in, first timer, questions .
by Lisa11
12/12/17 04:42 AM
RIP Spencer
by Cora
12/11/17 04:58 PM
New odor issue??
by AlyCatz
12/08/17 05:37 PM
Lighter Gliders??
by AlyCatz
12/08/17 05:25 PM
(Views)Popular Topics
I just found a lump on Timmy's chest--HELP! 20205028
Spencer needs your prayers/good thoughts 12468405
TEXAS 658803
Pitbull biter needs advice/help 607539
OHIO 519546
Member Titles 460958
MISSOURI 394560
HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's 372133
OKLAHOMA 354280
URGENT - Genetic Flaw discovered 352779
Supported Browser
This site was tested and is best viewed in Google Chrome & Mozilla FireFox



Firefox 3

Download your copy today!!!


GliderCENTRAL
©1998-2017