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#395844 - 10/10/07 06:35 AM re: HLP, does anyone know
pappy1264 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 11015
Loc: MA
If vets could do some blood tests before the fact and show if a problem was brewing? I mean, I know in humans they can test for bone density and such. Would something like that be possible in gliders? I am thinking, if it could, it could be done on the yearly exam, just to make sure. We all know how well they hide illnesses, so something like this would be a great tool to helping us keep our babies healthy.

Anyone know????
_________________________
Timmy, Gidget(RIP), Bandit, Petey(RIP), Phoebe, Jake (RIP) Piper(RIP), Pru(RIP), Paige, Cole, Molly(RIP), Oliver, Wyatt, Roo(RIP), Romeo, Pennie, Mandy(RIP), Madison, Garth, Kikipoo, Stasia, Bella, Petunia(RIP), Helen, Sydney, Kizzy and Sweet Pea's mom,
Mary

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#396290 - 10/10/07 09:32 PM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: pappy1264]
kipluck Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 239
Loc: Orem, UT
While not a test for HLP itself, since one of the major CAUSES is not enough calcium (or at least EFFECTUAL calcium... that hasn't been canceled out by too much phosphorus) I WOULD think if you suspected something you could have a good exotic vet give them a blood test for calcium levels. And if it WERE low give injections while adjusting diet.
_________________________
BethAnn aka: Kipluck
I miss you, my babies, Epiphany Jo, Lilo,& Heber! :rbridge: :rbridge: :rbridge: http://www.sugarshock.homestead.com
http://www.critters2go.homestead.com

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#396351 - 10/10/07 11:26 PM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: kipluck]
BeckiT Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/29/06
Posts: 16083
Loc: Manitowoc, WI
Mary, the only thing I can think of is doing an xray dunno
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~Becki & Crew~
Glidin' High Sugar Gliders
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#396482 - 10/11/07 06:09 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: BeckiT]
Xfilefan Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 8899
Loc: Jacksonville, FL
A blood test can show low blood calcium...but putting them under for it is risky due to anesthesia and the blood loss, since they need a certain amount to test. Particularly on a small glider. Same goes for an Xray...a healthy (or healthy enough) glider is not going to sit still for one without sedation. I'd say prevention is the best medicine (good diet), and personally I won't take the risk unless I suspect a problem, simply because gliders are so small, and the risk much higher than for a larger animal. That's not to say it can't be done, but is it worth the risk?
_________________________
Jen/Colin :bb: Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed :wfb: Sinbad, :wfb: Gabby, :grey: Baby, and :grey: Alley

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#396484 - 10/11/07 06:13 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: BeckiT]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Diagnoses of HLP involves both a complete blood panel and X-rays. Unfortunately, gliders need to be anesthesized for both procedures. To me, the risk of the anesthesia is too high to just get them done at a regular wellness exam. Also, it is very stressful for the glider to have their blood drawn, even with the anesthesia. My Mareki recently had to have a complete blood panel done and the vet had to attempt it 4 times before being able to successfully draw it. There are only two safe places to attempt to draw blood from a glider - the hind leg and the vena cava (near the heart)... If the hind leg is unsuccessful, they have to try for the vena cava and that increases the risks even further since it is so close to the heart. Definitely not worth the risk for annual exams.

The best thing to do if you want to prevent HLP is to keep your glider on a balanced diet and to watch closely for any signs of infection. Those are the 2 most common causes of HLP...
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#398111 - 10/14/07 11:03 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: sugarglidersuz]
pappy1264 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 11015
Loc: MA
Ok, thank you. But now I am wondering, if a glider is going in for a neuter and being anesthetized for that, would it be ok to do it than? I try to give mine the best diet I can and try to cover all the bases, but I always get nervous, there is so much controversy over diets. My vet says my gliders are healthy, they have good weights, and I am doing a good job, but the little worry wort inside me always says 'yes, but what if' (one of my major faults....I worry ALOT!) Would doing it while they were going to be under for a neuter be ok or not worth the risk with the blood loss?

Thank you for answering me btw!
_________________________
Timmy, Gidget(RIP), Bandit, Petey(RIP), Phoebe, Jake (RIP) Piper(RIP), Pru(RIP), Paige, Cole, Molly(RIP), Oliver, Wyatt, Roo(RIP), Romeo, Pennie, Mandy(RIP), Madison, Garth, Kikipoo, Stasia, Bella, Petunia(RIP), Helen, Sydney, Kizzy and Sweet Pea's mom,
Mary

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#398118 - 10/14/07 11:12 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: pappy1264]
Xfilefan Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 8899
Loc: Jacksonville, FL
I'm not certain how much it takes for a calcium reading. Plus there's the risk of infection from the puncture. IF the glider is over 125 grams, IF it's already under, and IF the vet doesn't have to try 5 or 6 times for a sample (some gliders are not easy to draw on), then it would be up to the owner. It increases the risk of something going wrong, no matter how you do it. I've only had these done when a glider was having a blood draw for a more serious reason (Chronos, Riker, Gimli)-good thing to look at if you're running a blood panel anyway, but I wouldn't have had it done for that reason alone. An Xray if the glider is under would be fairly safe, as long as your realize that 1-we don't know how much radiation exposure is safe, and 2. the deficiency can be short of HLP, but still needs to be fairly advanced before lightening or pitting in the bones will show. I wouldn't do that too often, either. I know blood sugar can be measured with a drop, but calcium I think takes a more substantial sample. Those are my concerns, anyway.
_________________________
Jen/Colin :bb: Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed :wfb: Sinbad, :wfb: Gabby, :grey: Baby, and :grey: Alley

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#398119 - 10/14/07 11:14 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: Xfilefan]
pappy1264 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 11015
Loc: MA
Thank you Jen. I am learning and just want to do what is right for my babies to keep them healthy and happy! I think as long as they are eating good food and I don't see anything causing me concern, I will leave well enough alone!

The reason I asked is mostly because of Roo. With her having lived on Parrot seed alone for two years....I guess I just worry how her body has faired. She is doing well, eats great, is losing weight (she was very fat) and is playing and has tons more energy then when she came here, so that is all a good thing!


Edited by pappy1264 (10/14/07 11:16 AM)
_________________________
Timmy, Gidget(RIP), Bandit, Petey(RIP), Phoebe, Jake (RIP) Piper(RIP), Pru(RIP), Paige, Cole, Molly(RIP), Oliver, Wyatt, Roo(RIP), Romeo, Pennie, Mandy(RIP), Madison, Garth, Kikipoo, Stasia, Bella, Petunia(RIP), Helen, Sydney, Kizzy and Sweet Pea's mom,
Mary

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#398618 - 10/15/07 06:26 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: pappy1264]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
I agree with everything Jen said... those are a lot of IF's, but truly the best scenario. In regards to your Roo, I think I would not have her tested since she is showing signs of improvement now that she is under your excellent care.
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#398622 - 10/15/07 06:40 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: sugarglidersuz]
pappy1264 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 11015
Loc: MA
Thanks, Suz. I do feel better seeing the weight coming off, seeing the huge difference in her energy, the look in her eyes, her movements in general. She was very stiff in her movements before, but she flies around the cage, now! She is still working on her stregnth for climbing in the tent, but getting better every day! Thanks again!
_________________________
Timmy, Gidget(RIP), Bandit, Petey(RIP), Phoebe, Jake (RIP) Piper(RIP), Pru(RIP), Paige, Cole, Molly(RIP), Oliver, Wyatt, Roo(RIP), Romeo, Pennie, Mandy(RIP), Madison, Garth, Kikipoo, Stasia, Bella, Petunia(RIP), Helen, Sydney, Kizzy and Sweet Pea's mom,
Mary

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#398654 - 10/15/07 08:13 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: pappy1264]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
I'm so glad to hear about the great improvements she has made! This is really wonderful news clap
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#398668 - 10/15/07 09:11 AM Re: re: HLP, does anyone know [Re: sugarglidersuz]
pappy1264 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 11015
Loc: MA
Thanks! Me, too. When she came here, she slept most of them time, only coming out to eat. And she always looked sleepy eyed. Now, she is out, even is starting to use the wheel! One thing that hasn't changed is how sweet she is!
_________________________
Timmy, Gidget(RIP), Bandit, Petey(RIP), Phoebe, Jake (RIP) Piper(RIP), Pru(RIP), Paige, Cole, Molly(RIP), Oliver, Wyatt, Roo(RIP), Romeo, Pennie, Mandy(RIP), Madison, Garth, Kikipoo, Stasia, Bella, Petunia(RIP), Helen, Sydney, Kizzy and Sweet Pea's mom,
Mary

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