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#3969 - 02/18/02 12:09 AM Help!!! Sick baby???
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm sure this has been asked before but I don't have time to search, I am worried about our baby glider. He's only been home with us for 2 days and I haven't seen him eat anything. When he walks he falls over sometimes, is he just clumsy or is something wrong? Thanks for all the help in advance!<p>Thanks
Kinko's mommy

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#3970 - 02/18/02 12:16 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hello,
You don't say how old Kinko is? I never really noticed my babies being clumsy at 5 weeks oop. Do you know if he is at least drinking? I made the baby bml and was handfeeding mine till I was comfortable that they were eating on their own. They were extremely young when I got them tho. I would let them eat off my finger, like a licky treat. Then I would put baby food in the cage for at night with gliderade. I found a small painters tray with 6 wells in it and it was perfect for them, and for the baby food, I could tell if they'd eaten or not also. What are you offering Kinko for a diet? And have you started trying any licky treats? A licky treat is anything you can put on your finger and he can lick off. Baby food, applesauce, yogurt, are all good. I prefer something that won't drip off. Not too liquidy. Good Luck and if you have any more questions, please come back and ask! You might also read the old posts, and you will probably find out almost everything you could dream of to ask, will be answered! How is the bonding going?
Good Luck and enjoy you new baby, mine are precious and I don't think I could part with them for the world!
Chey <img src="graemlins/heartpump.gif" border="0" alt="heart" /> <img src="graemlins/littleglider.gif" border="0" alt="glider" />
PS if you are feeding the bml, you can put it in a container that you can fill to the top, take a knife and level it off, that way in the am, you should be able to tell if he has eaten any of it.

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#3971 - 02/18/02 12:27 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Thanks for being so quick. I am feeding him the food I got from his breeder, it's glider grub and has all of his proteins. He is eating apples with the vita glider sprinkled on it for his calcium. I have tried to get him to eat out of my hand but he won't touch it so far. I just gave him some pedialyte from the eye dropper and he got some down. I think he is about 6 weeks oop but he is really having a hard time getting around. He did get up and his tail was wagging and played for about 10 minutes and then acted as if he was exhausted and won't hardly move.<p>Thanks again
Kinko's mom

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#3972 - 02/18/02 12:47 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
BeetleJuice Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 12/12/01
Posts: 2724
Loc: Summerville, SC
Kinko's mom,<p>As far as the not eating goes. That could be attributed to being in a new environment and also his young age. Most breeders wait until they are 7 to 8 weeks oop before allowing them to go to a new home. The stumbling and falling down has me concerned though. It could also have to do with his young age but I would be afraid it might be more. It might be a good idea to let a vet check him out to make sure everything is fine. You need to have a vet check anyway, so this would kill two birds with one stone so to speak. Temperature also comes to mind as a possiblity. If it is to cold it could account for the sluggishness and lack of appetite. 70 to 75 degrees is arguably a suitable temperature range, although I just read where 71 to 74 is better. I hope this helps some, and I really hope your baby is ok. I would try to schedule a vet check asap though. Let us know how he progresses.
_________________________
Craig

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#3973 - 02/18/02 12:55 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Thank you beetlejuice.
I don't think it was his temp because we had one of those heat rocks in there but after reading posts on here we took it out immediately. I am going to look for a vet in my area right now and try to get in first thing in the morning. Thanks!<p>Kinko's mom

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#3974 - 02/18/02 12:57 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I had a lot of the same problems with one of my gliders that you seem to be having. We bought three at the same time and one of them was very shaky. She seemed to be eating, but she was not nearly as active as the others. After a week I took her to the vet who started her on Baytril and Benebac and gave her subq fluids (she was severely dehydrated). Although she seemed to get better I took her back again a week later because she was still very shaky. The vet said she was better but had a long way to go. She is better now (I've had her about 5 weeks). Started her on the BML diet plan last week. I don't think she would have survived if we had not taken her to the vet. I think mine came from the same breeder yours did and I believe she was too young to be weaned when we got her. Good luck with your baby.

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#3975 - 02/18/02 01:10 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Did you get her feom custom cage works??? I have called him several times but no response as of yet!<p>thanks<p>kinko's mommy

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#3976 - 02/18/02 01:14 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


That's the place. If you have any more questions you can email me privately
Annette<p>[ 02-19-2002: Message edited by: Annette ]</p>

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#3977 - 02/18/02 02:19 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
BeetleJuice Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 12/12/01
Posts: 2724
Loc: Summerville, SC
Kinko's mom,<p>Unfortunately, this is not the first time someone has had problems with Gliders they have purchased from this guy. The link below gives a lot of information on him and his practices. I'm glad you decided to take him to the vet, please let us know how he is doing and what the vet says.<p>There has got to be something that can be done about this guy! []images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/] <p>http://sg.nsci.net/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=001649
_________________________
Craig

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#3978 - 02/18/02 02:33 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hello everyone!<p>I took kinko to the vet this morning and they put him on Baytril and gave him injections under the skin to help the dehydration. I also mixed up some of the BML but he hasn't eaten any as of yet. I am going to keep trying. I have callled the breeder 3 or 4 times but he hasn't returned my call. I want to thank everyone for your help. I will keep everyone updated!<p>Thanks
Courtney

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#3979 - 02/18/02 02:46 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
KarenE Offline
Owner

Registered: 03/25/00
Posts: 41158
Loc: LittleRock, AR USA
I am so sorry that your little one is sick, and I know you must be heartsick. Taking him to the vet was the best thing you could have done.<p>As posted before, the practices of this particular breeder are horrific, and I wish there were something we could do about it.<p>All we can do is try to spread the word to anyone we know that this is definitely NOT someone you want to buy a healthy glider from.
_________________________
Your Sugar Glider Resource Center
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#3980 - 02/18/02 03:01 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hi Kinko's Mom,
I am glad to hear that Kinko is on the mend! With lots of TLC and some time, he will soon be bouncing all over and you will be posting that you can't catch him to put him in his cage so you can go to bed! Try using the BML as a licky treat, at least you know he's getting some. You might think about using the joey bml formula. You would have to do a search for the recipe tho, I don't remember the difference in the recipes. It's thinner and doesn't have the egg shells tho, so probably easier for the little ones to eat. And it might be a little easier on his tummy. Yogurt is also good for upset/stressed gliders. And it helps that they love it, and it has calcium in it too. <img src="graemlins/thumb.gif" border="0" alt="thumb" /> Good Luck and I am so glad to hear Kinko is on the mend!
Chey <img src="graemlins/multi.gif" border="0" alt="[blob]" /> <img src="graemlins/dance.gif" border="0" alt="dance" />

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#3981 - 02/18/02 03:10 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I do think we need to somehow spread the word about CCW. I know many people have purchased gliders from him and still have them - only due to the fact that they had to scramble for information and vet assistance afterwards. He obviously does not give correct info when purchased (glider grub and heat rocks?). He has success stories only because of caring owners. I hate to think how many unsuccessful stories there are. He has over 200 breeding pairs and sells a ridiculous amount per week (I actually conatacted them via email a long time ago and he responded w/ all his figures but I forget what they are now). Basically he told me he knows what he's doing b/c he has so many and sells so many. When I was first looking into getting a glider I was in contact with a very nice breeder - until I found out they sell them at 4 weeks oop. I told them I thought this was too young and they said if they are sold any older than that, bonding is much more difficult (I got mine at over 3 mos oop and bonding was wonderful). This breeder is fairly close to me (within a few hours) and patiently explained to me why they are pulled so young, how he has been USDA licensed for quite some time, etc and wished me luck on finding another breeder who was better suited for me. I asked him about diet and he had never heard of any leadbedder's diets at all. My point is, there is a huge mega-breeder like CCW who obviously doesn't care about the wellbeing of his gliders; how many small scale breeders are out there doing the same thing (like the one I was talking about)? We only hear about the big ones...I shudder to think about some of the smaller ones who also claim to know what they're doing... []images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/]

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#3982 - 02/18/02 08:46 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
the gliders angel Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/08/01
Posts: 3058
Loc: u.s.a.
i would give him a little dannon vanilla yogurt for xtra calcium. its very good for gliders. dont give the glider grub make up bml and fresh fruits melons are good.

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#3983 - 02/19/02 12:00 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


When I got my gliders from Custom Cage Works I let my heart overrule my head. I knew I should research and find a reputable breeder, but we had looked into getting gliders about a year ago (without actually seeing any in person), so when we actually had one in our hands it was too tempting. He gave a lot of bad information about diet and also cage size. He sold us an 18" x 18" x 22" cage and told us it was plenty big for two gliders. Since I bought my gliders in January, I have spent $150 on vet bills to save a sick one, money for a 2' x 2' x 5' cage (thanks K & D Exotics) and more on toys, accessories, and lots of time on the internet finding resources to help me care for these babies. Rowdy, who was sick, is doing much better, but she is still not where the others are. Hind sight is always best, but I would encourage anyone wanting a sugar glider to do their research and find a good breeder. On this note, I went into a pet store today (saw a sign saying they had baby sugar gliders for sale) and they had two with a sign saying "4 weeks OOP" they had a dish of applesauce and one of what looked like bird seed in the (very tiny) cage and a heat lamp on the cage. []images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/] I had to walk out.
Annette
Rowdy, Rocky, Flash <img src="graemlins/littleglider.gif" border="0" alt="glider" />

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#3984 - 02/19/02 07:03 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Bourbon Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 04/01/99
Posts: 5333
Loc: Bee-Bopping round SnakePit USA
chances are you can save your time and energy, as the calls will not be returned..I sent you an email, I will try to help the best I can with this one, but they are so young their immune system is not what it should be, if he makes it, it will be a hard road ahead.<p>Did your vet do a stool sample? if not get one done asap.
_________________________
Baybe,My Roots

SGGA

CustomCruiser

BML

Sugar Glider Genetic Project

321-331-1608

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#3985 - 02/19/02 07:06 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Bourbon Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 04/01/99
Posts: 5333
Loc: Bee-Bopping round SnakePit USA
I have quit posting the joey BML, since people are now hand pulling their joeys and counting on the joey BML, I will help and there are others out there, that if emailed will also help with that recipe
_________________________
Baybe,My Roots

SGGA

CustomCruiser

BML

Sugar Glider Genetic Project

321-331-1608

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#3986 - 02/19/02 10:43 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Annette & Kinko's mom, I got my gliders from this breeder as well. My story is very similar to yours. <p>It's so frustrating that this breeder continues bad practices. I don't know that we can make a difference, but this breeder at least needs to be documented with the USDA and Better Business Bureau in his area. I don't know if this will help, but it is worth the effort to try! Maybe if there are enough complaints, somebody will step in?!<p>I also requested this breeder's latest inspection report from the USDA. Get this - their last inspection was December 5 2000! <p>So please, if anyone has had a bad experience with this breeder, please report him to the USDA and the Better Business Bureau of Metropolitan Dallas and any other organization that might help!<p>Here are the addresses of the orgs in this breeder's area:<p>USDA, APHIS, AC
Western Region
PO Box 915004
Fort Worth TX 76115-9104<p>Better Business Bureau of Metropolitan Dallas, Inc.
1600 Pacific Avenue Suite 2800
Dallas TX 75201<p>Also, for anyone who is interested, I have the phone # of this breeder's USDA inspector. If anyone wants to contact her directly, please email me.

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#3987 - 02/20/02 08:45 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hi everyone-<p>Just thought I would send an update on our baby. He went to the vet again yesterday and seemed to be doing better, but last night he went downhill again. I couldn't get anything down him at all no matter what I tried. We looked for a 24 hour vet but couldn't find one who even had emergency hours that knew anything about gliders. I kept trying to get something in him and put a grape in his pouch. He did make it through the night and seems to be feeling a little btter this morning. The vet is about to open and we are going to see them. I wanted to say thank you to Bourbon and Hey Mikey for all their help and advice they gave me last night. I don't think me or the baby would have made it through the night without them.<p>Courtney

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#3988 - 02/20/02 12:35 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Bourbon Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 04/01/99
Posts: 5333
Loc: Bee-Bopping round SnakePit USA
You just concentrate on that little boy, our prayers are with you..
_________________________
Baybe,My Roots

SGGA

CustomCruiser

BML

Sugar Glider Genetic Project

321-331-1608

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#3989 - 02/20/02 04:12 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Here's wishing you and the little fellow the best of luck.
Marvin

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#3990 - 02/21/02 08:15 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Bourbon Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 04/01/99
Posts: 5333
Loc: Bee-Bopping round SnakePit USA
I am sorry to pass on, that she had lost him on the way back to the vet yesterday. This is a very hard thing to go through and we all wished there was something we could do, it was so hard for her to see him like he was, he tried to fight as long as he could, but he was so young, and without the immune system to help him, there was so little she could do for him. He would no longer eat or drink. he had only gotten him this past weekend, and had been to the vet several days in a row... My heart goes out to her, as to the many others that purchase these little ones from these types of breeders.
_________________________
Baybe,My Roots

SGGA

CustomCruiser

BML

Sugar Glider Genetic Project

321-331-1608

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#3991 - 02/21/02 08:43 AM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Is there no law that protects the consumer from breeders/dealers/brokers that sell these babies so young or ill, or in any way compromised with little chance of a long healthy life? This is so sad, she not only paid for the gliders, paid the vet bills, but got emotionally attached in the meantime. I realize the problems with the USDA and they definitely need to be contacted with some pretty strong language and strongly motivated to do something about this guy, and other breeders like him. But, in the meantime, this person is without their gliders, and out the money they paid for the gliders and vet bills. If a store did something similiar, they would be up for a lawsuit, there has to be something in the laws about this. Can someone there contact an atty and request a free consultation regarding this breeders practices? Isn't he legally liable for the product he is selling?
Chey
I realize it is very difficult for the USDA to do something, but, if a different approach is tried and he is legally liable, then maybe????? he will think twice about pulling joeys and selling them too soon?????
[]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/] []images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/] []images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/]

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#3992 - 02/22/02 01:46 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hi everyone-<p>Sorry I didn't post about the joey sooner. As bourbon said he did not make it. We tried everything but he was too young and dehydrated. Funny thing is my vet called me the evening he died and said she had another glider some in with a 11 year old owner that came from the Home Show and same breeder my little guy did. He was dehydrated as well and the little girl could not keep him. So needless to say I rushed right over and got him. He is doing much better and loves the BML and fruits. He's started climbing his cage and coming out to eat on his own!!! YEA!!! Kinko( the male that was with the joey) is taking great care of him as well. He grooms him and pulls the covers in their pouch to keep him warn when he comes out to play. I wanted to thank everyone for their advice and concern. I have learned tons from everyone over the last week.<p>Thanks Again<p>Courtney
(kinko's mom)

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#3993 - 02/22/02 10:29 PM Re: Help!!! Sick baby??? [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Glad to see that you and Kinko got a new friend. Sorry to hear about the joey though.
Marvin

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