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#47500 - 05/28/05 03:48 PM Joey Cannibalism
Anonymous
Unregistered


I woke up this morning to find that my sugar gliders had eaten their 1 1/2 week OOP babies. They were both males. One had been completly eaten with some remains, i picked up the other one without seeing it was half eaten. I dropped it immediatly. It was the most horrific thing ive ever seen. I dont know why this happened? Could someone please give me some input? Thanks. -amy <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" />

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#47501 - 05/28/05 04:19 PM Re: Joey Cannibalism [Re: ]
USMom Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 7356
Loc: Austin, TX
I am so sorry for your loss! I know it is heartbreaking. Their moms and dads know things about them that we don't. Likely there was something wrong with the babies, and they took care of it before the babies suffered. I know how hard this is, but nature knows best. ((((HUGS))))
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Shawna
Who are you networked with? Networking could save your gliders life. Create one now.


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#47502 - 05/28/05 10:43 PM Re: Joey Cannibalism [Re: ]
Srlb Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 10/30/03
Posts: 16743
Loc: St. Johns, Florida
So sorry this has happened to you, but as stated, moms and dads will know when something is wrong with the lil ones and will *dispose* of them. There could be many factors as to why.
May I ask what kind of diet you are feeding? How old are the parents? Were/are you giving mom a little extra protein?

Some of these things could be a factor.
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#47503 - 05/28/05 10:45 PM Re: Joey Cannibalism [Re: ]
USMom Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 7356
Loc: Austin, TX
Also, helps educate those of us who are still learning. Thanks, and again, so sorry!
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Shawna
Who are you networked with? Networking could save your gliders life. Create one now.


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#47504 - 05/29/05 02:07 PM Re: Joey Cannibalism [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I was feeding them the modified BML recipe that my breeder gave to me (pocketexotics.com). Fruits, veggies, extra meal worms to the mommy. The daddy doesnt eat insects? this was their first litter ever. Margo is 11 months. Calvin is 7 months. The babies were both boys. I only held them two times, for a very short period. I hope is wasnt my fault that they died. Do you think they will eat them again when they have another litter? Should i let them have another? What precautions should i take next time? Thanks for all of your support. --amy

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#47505 - 05/29/05 02:12 PM Re: Joey Cannibalism [Re: ]
USMom Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 7356
Loc: Austin, TX
You holding the babies had nothing to do with it. Otherwise none of us would ever have joeys that make it to get weaned. It sounds like a good diet. From what I have heard, the first litter may not make it all the way. The second ones do much better. That is just what I have heard, I'm not an expert. It sounds like you did everything you were supposed to. Your gliders are old enough to have babies (I think the reccommended age is 1 year?) Many have them at 6 months. Someone else will come along and correct me if I am wrong, and be able to give you more info!
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Shawna
Who are you networked with? Networking could save your gliders life. Create one now.


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#47506 - 05/29/05 02:52 PM Re: Joey Cannibalism [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


This has happened to me three times and led to me neutering my male. The reasons are vast, so you can't tell. It could be that your female was too young, as was your male. They could have just been overwhelmed and rejected their joey until it died and then 'cleaned the nest.' It could have been an outside stress. Was anyone else in the room they were in they didn't know? Did you wipe the joeys down with a freshly scented cloth from the parents before putting them back in the cage? Was there any unfamiliar loud noises going on around the house? Was there any big changes inside the cage, like new toys that could have carried new scents from where they were made? Or did you change their cages, bedding, etc. within the past 2 months (for the cage) or last week (for the bedding). I let my gliders scent up several pouches when the joeys are in pouch so that I can change out pouches when they come oop without making them have to rescent.

It could be the joeys had something internally wrong with them, but this can never be proven. It could be your gliders have a psychological problem when it comes to joeys, but this cannot be proven without countless cannablisms. It could be what my male's problem was, your male wanted your female to go back into heat, so killed the joeys; you will not know this until he does it again, though. Is there any other animals in the house that could have caused stress to the gliders? Did you have unfamiliar scents on your hands or clothes when you touched the joeys? It's best to wash your hands, then rub them down with a freshly scented blanket before handling joeys, that way you smell like the parents. Your female could need more calcium and so killed the joeys for it instead of getting sick. Just feeding them BML will not give the extra calcium unless you put more calcium into the mixture when you made it. You need to give extra protein, not just a couple of bugs, but an extra meal almost of protein, that's what I do, I wake the female up in the day and give her protein snacks like bugs, gerber meat sticks, boiled chicken/turkey, etc. until she stops eating, and I sprinkle extra calcium on all of this so that she has extra calcium. Your male might be eating the BML and getting the calcium, leaving her with the veggies and friut.

Like I said, there is so many reasons that can trigger this. IMO you should let your female have a month off before breeding her again, so that she is fully healed, maybe even wait until your male is a year old. Then give your female extra protein and calcium from the moment you see her mate, so that she will be getting extra stuff when she's pregnant too. Try to eliminate all stresses like noises, people (maybe only allow one person to feed and hold the gliders until the joeys are weaned, having more than one owner around the gliders can be stressful). Also don't push your female to give up her joeys; mine does not like to have her joeys taken away from her before they are a week oop. She will even shove them back ip to keep them away from me; even though, I never force her to give them up. Just watch over the parents, but not more than usual, to make sure everything is alright and think of this as only a memory. It may never happen again, or it may happen again. The most important thing is to think about your gliders and if they can't be good parents to just get your male neutered.

I know this is stressful and sad and hope you don't have to go through it again like I did. But keep your chin up and don't blame your gliders for doing a natural thing. They only acted on instinct and don't know it was a 'bad' thing. It could be just a fluke. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />

If you have any questions to add to all of mine, PM me, I would love to talk.

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