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#53337 - 08/07/05 10:40 PM rejected baby
Anonymous
Unregistered


I have a new mom and she has a baby in pouch but the secound one is out and he is way to little to be out on his own. Mom won't let him back in the pouch but she is in the bed with him, what can I do to try to save this little guy? I have only had one other joey rejected and the parents (not these ones, another pair) ate them before I could do anything and I don't want this to happen again. Please, any help would be greatly appriciated.

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#53338 - 08/07/05 10:54 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
[:"green"]Immediately take him away from the mother. If she has already rejected him from her pouch then she may cannibalize him fairly soon. You will need to keep him warm. The best way to do this is to make a mini-incubator. Take a shoe-box size Rubbermaid container and poke holes in the lid. Then line the bottom of it with multiple layers of fleece. Wrap a heating pad with multiple towels and set it at "low heat". Place the heating pad/towels under the Rubbermaid bucket. Test the bottom of the bucket with your hand to make sure it isn't too warm or too cold. It should feel fairly warm to the touch. Place the joey in a pouch inside the bucket on top of the layers of fleece.
You will need to start hand-feeding the little guy. He needs to be warm in order to eat. Make up some baby BML or joey formula. There are many other threads that will tell you how to do this. He will need to be fed every hour or two throughout the day & night. You can tell if his tummy is full by looking at his belly. To the lower right (as you are looking at him) you should be able to see a small white area - that is the 'milk' in his tummy. At first he may only take a few drops at a time. That's why it's important to feed him frequently.
Good luck. My prayers are with you & this little one.
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#53339 - 08/07/05 10:57 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


How are you sure that it is being rejected?
How are you sure it is too soon for it to be oop?
Sometimes mothers will take one joey out for a bit while the other remains in pouch.

Does the joey have any hair at all?
How developed is it? There is a point at which they are too early oop to hand feed.

Can you see any milk in the tummy of the joey?
Just hold it up to the light, if it is young enough, you should be able to see through the skin and see the milk or lack of.

If you haven't found it out of the sleeping pouch or on the cage floor, I'd probably just let the mom do her thing, it may not be rejected.
With what I know so far, I would not pull the joey.

If you can fill us in some more?

Good luck to you, hope all goes well <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />


Edited by big ern! (08/07/05 11:01 PM)

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#53340 - 08/07/05 11:06 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


The baby has very little hair, his head is too big for his body (his body is very small), you can see through his skin, mom will not even let him get close to her. There does seem to be 2 more joeys in her pouch (if there is only 1 other one it is a big one)I held him for a while because he was starting to get cold.

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#53341 - 08/07/05 11:10 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
[:"green"]I still contend that you should pull him & start hand-feeding him...
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#53342 - 08/07/05 11:11 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
USMom Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 7356
Loc: Austin, TX
Hopefully Angie or Judie will be along soon to help you! Read the sticky about rejected joeys, and keep him warm.
_________________________
Shawna
Who are you networked with? Networking could save your gliders life. Create one now.


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#53343 - 08/08/05 12:55 AM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


She might have triplets?
Can you see any milk in the joey's stomach?

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#53344 - 08/08/05 02:03 AM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Triplets are hard. I had them, one was rejected during the night and when i woke up..he had passed. Id make sure the baby was warm, and try and see if the mom will take it back. If the baby is old enough to hand feed, id feed it and put it back. If mom is crabbing and being violent, pull it completely and put it in an incubator.

im not an expert...so id take the advice of other breeders before mine.

anyhow! good luck!

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#53345 - 08/08/05 07:21 AM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Here's a link with pictures on how to make an incubator. I really hope everything works out.

http://www.crittervillerescue.com/joeys/icu.htm

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#53346 - 08/08/05 07:50 AM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
I just saw this post, can you give us an update on how the jeoy is doing now? The joey sounds like its out of pouch very early, can you post a picture of it. How is mom doing with the other joey, is it still in the pouch? I would myself attempt to save the joey, I feed baby BML thined with vanilla ensure or soy milk, being that small he will need to eat about evey 30 minutes. Will post more after update.
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Angie <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

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#53347 - 08/08/05 01:28 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Thanks for all the help and good wishes!!! It was a long night but both joeys are oop and doing fine so far. They are eating a suppliment of puppy milk for the time being. Mom (or the babies) has both babies oop now. They are eating pretty good but they are so small. I've added an attachment so you can see how tiny this little guy is.


Attachments
436849-8-11-05Leela\'sbaby002.jpg (65 downloads)



Edited by lost in love (08/08/05 01:36 PM)

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#53348 - 08/08/05 01:37 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Awww, I wish you the best of luck!

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#53349 - 08/08/05 01:45 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Is the other baby that small? Hang in there, hopefully all will work out.

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#53350 - 08/08/05 01:55 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


No, the other joey is smaller. I have had other joeys from other pairs and have only lost 1 set of twins. This is Leela and Apollo's first set of joeys. I know that it's pretty common for them to lose the first ones but I have to do whatever I can to save these little ones, my gliders and grand son's are my life!!

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#53351 - 08/08/05 02:32 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Were you able to see milk in their bellies?
Especially the smaller one?
Whether or not you can see milk is how you can decide if the little one needs to be supplemented.

They are fairly early oop from the pics I see.
Is the mother small?

Honestly if you're afraid of rejection, you need to possibly focus on supplementing the mother to help her make more milk and leaving her be a bit more.
Handling her joeys and intervening may be more harmful to the situation.

My opinion may not mesh with that of others, but far too often I see people intervene unneccesarily with the best of intentions. I'm not saying that intervening is unneccessary, don't take this the wrong way. I can't see the gliders for myself. Most glider moms do a good job, but sometimes their worried but caring keepers stress them out. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

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#53352 - 08/08/05 02:42 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


The mother is normal size. I did not see any milk in the bellies. Mom seems to be taking care of them ok now, they are not cold and don't seem hungry. She is cuddled with them now. I thought about the situation big ern, and have decided to help out only if they are pushed from the sleeping pouch. It will break my heart if they die but I guess Leela knows best, animals do have that instinct about them.

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#53353 - 08/08/05 03:53 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


One thing you can do is offer the mother some more mealies.
Some also like to add some wombaroo milk replacer to the food that you feed the mother to help her boost milk production.

I'm glad to see that all is going better.
Hopefully she'll keep taking care of them <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />

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#53354 - 08/08/05 08:17 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


The smallest one just died. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/gliderangel.gif" alt="" /> It was the sadest thing to see but knowing in the back of my mind that it was going to happen made it a little easier. The other one seems to be pretty lively and strong so far. I guess I'll see what tonight brings.

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#53355 - 08/08/05 08:43 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
USMom Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 7356
Loc: Austin, TX
Oh, lost in love! I am so sorry! My heart goes out to you. I hope that things go well with the other one.
_________________________
Shawna
Who are you networked with? Networking could save your gliders life. Create one now.


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#53356 - 08/09/05 09:40 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Both babies have now died. There was nothing I could do to save them but I will miss them even though they were only here for a few days.

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#53357 - 08/09/05 10:26 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Awww Im so sorry to hear that!

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#53358 - 08/10/05 12:26 AM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Judie Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 10/25/01
Posts: 9173
Loc: Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
I am so sorry. It is really sad when babies die and especially for reasons only Mother Nature knows.

Babies that come oop. this early have a really tough time surviving if the mother is inexperienced.

Parents usually will rebreed in a few days and they will start over. Perhaps, second time around they will be able to raise a set of babies for you.

Take care.
_________________________
Web site: www.MyLittleGremlin.com

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#53359 - 08/10/05 01:00 PM Re: rejected baby [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm sorry.

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