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#660384 - 10/22/08 04:58 AM USDA says no?
oakley Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 07/22/05
Posts: 2305
Loc: Florida, USA
Just a quick USDA question for you...

Is it possible to get USDA licensed if you have LESS than 3 breeding pairs? I had talked to someone from the USDA when I first started breeding (2 years ago) and they said that when I was 18 (I was 16 at the time) I could try to get a license, but they may not accept me seeing as I only have 2 breeding pairs. dunno

In the meantime, I got a Florida Fish and Wildlife license (which you can get at 16) and have kept that current. thumb

Has anyone with less than 3 breeding pairs had any luck getting a license? question I know I technically don't HAVE to have one, and I don't plan on having over 3 breeding pairs, but I would like to have the license anyway. laugh

Thank you! thanks
_________________________
Meghan

~__/>
{{ }}


Suggies: Basil, Mausi, Bagheera/Baloo, & the Trio
Dogs : Pretzel/Snickers
Horse: Nugget
RIP: Gato, Pepito, Pepper, and Mowgli gangel


Oakley's Glider Site

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#660426 - 10/22/08 06:42 AM Re: USDA says no? [Re: oakley]
Monster
Unregistered


I know they will license you for domestics even if you do not meet the minimun requirements, but not sure about exotics (its a whole different process) - Thats a question to ask your regional USDA office.

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#660573 - 10/22/08 12:23 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: ]
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
I maintained a license for two years with only one breeding pair after they changed the requirements. Honestly, it doesn't say anywhere on the forms "How many breeding pairs do you have". If you are willing to pay for the license and the vet inspection and your inspector doesn't have an issue with it, then I don't see why not. But realize that you may go through the whole process and you may have a stickler of a USDA inspector that comes out and says, since you don't have three, you don't need a license. dunno

But you can always send for a packet, fill it out, get your vet inspection, and go through the process. You may get approved.
_________________________
~Gretchen
Maia & Squish
If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.

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#660619 - 10/22/08 02:21 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: sugarlope]
oakley Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 07/22/05
Posts: 2305
Loc: Florida, USA
Thanks for the info!
_________________________
Meghan

~__/>
{{ }}


Suggies: Basil, Mausi, Bagheera/Baloo, & the Trio
Dogs : Pretzel/Snickers
Horse: Nugget
RIP: Gato, Pepito, Pepper, and Mowgli gangel


Oakley's Glider Site

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#660649 - 10/22/08 03:38 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: oakley]
Cr8zyanimalgirl
Unregistered


I have sent off my packet and the inspector will be calling me next week. I have a vet coming here Friday. I have 2 breeding pairs but I also have 2 southern flying squirrels that are intacted. I plan on getting more glider pairs soon. I can keep you updated.

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#660660 - 10/22/08 04:08 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: ]
jkaradeema Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 01/16/06
Posts: 582
Loc: Nashville, TN
Ours told us you have to have 3 or more breeding pairs to be licensed. You will find that different people that you talk to will say different things though.

I wouldn't bother with being USDA licensed if I didn't need to be though. You have to pay for the license every year and pay for the vet to come out and inspect your place every year. You have to have all paperwork in order according to their rules. Pop in inspections are kind of stressful even if you are doing everything correctly, they are looking for something to catch you on. They have a lot of rules you don't even think of. The cages can't be on the floor. They can't be kept in a carpeted room unless you have some kind of mats under them. Everything has to be labeled. You have to have an inventory. They even go though your refridgerator.

There is a lot to think about when becoming USDA.
_________________________
Jason and Kristin Karadeema

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#660674 - 10/22/08 05:10 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: jkaradeema]
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
While Jason is correct, you don't have to be licensed with fewer than 3 pair and the USDA will tell you not to apply for a license with fewer than 3 pairs, I liked having my license, even when I didn't 'need' it anymore. dunno

It does give you a little more credibility (because you are required to have a vet check at least once a year and you do have pop in USDA checks at least once a year. I keep records anyway, but I liked having paperwork for all of my animals and when it is a requirement, it is easier to explain the need for it. Depending on where you are, there are certain areas that require licenses to sell/buy from (whether the USDA requires it or not, the state, city, or county you are selling to might, so be aware of that as well).

The requirements for your room are going to be different depending on your USDA inspector. It isn't listed in the USDA book that cages have to be off of the floor, but some inspectors like it that way (my cages were never off of the floor and it was never an issue). You just have to figure out what works for you and your inspector, I never had any issues with mine at all.


Edited by sugarlope (10/22/08 05:12 PM)
_________________________
~Gretchen
Maia & Squish
If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.

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#660684 - 10/22/08 05:32 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: sugarlope]
jkaradeema Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 01/16/06
Posts: 582
Loc: Nashville, TN
We have never had any issues either, but there is the chance that your regular inspector may not be the one to show up and some require things that others are not worried about.

Like our inspector doesn't care if our cages are labeled as long as we know who is who. But she said if another inspector came they may write you up for it so we just keep them labeled.
_________________________
Jason and Kristin Karadeema

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#660689 - 10/22/08 05:40 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: jkaradeema]
princessmegi Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 11/21/03
Posts: 6894
Loc: NW Missouri
I don't think a USDA license has any credibility at all. Even Mike McGrath is licensed.
_________________________

"My doctrine is this: that if we see cruelty or wrong that we have the power to stop, and we do nothing, we make ourselves sharers in the guilt." ~ Anna Sewell, English Novelist

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#660694 - 10/22/08 05:55 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: princessmegi]
mommawannabe Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2443
Loc: Roanoke, Virginia
It really depends on the inspector on what you are required to do or not do. I was told that I had to have 3 breedable pairs though.

Anna
_________________________
Hubby Tommie
son Logan - 11
Pugs-Duncan and Raven,
Bunnies-Foo&Friday
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suggies-Izzy, Miley~Toff, Jasper~Twinkie, Nix~Ash, Nash~Riley, Barney~Spryte~Pixie, Apollo~Athena.
Turtles - Shelly~Petunia

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#660728 - 10/22/08 07:04 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: princessmegi]
jkaradeema Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 01/16/06
Posts: 582
Loc: Nashville, TN
Originally Posted By: princessmegi
I don't think a USDA license has any credibility at all. Even Mike McGrath is licensed.


Even Perfect Pocket Pets is USDA.
_________________________
Jason and Kristin Karadeema

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#660729 - 10/22/08 07:09 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: mommawannabe]
Raquel
Unregistered


Related to what "princessmegi" said:
I've seen quite a few breeders with USDA licenses approved shakehead off_topic , to whom everybody here would put a very big question mark!!! question question question

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#660757 - 10/22/08 07:56 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: ]
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
I am not saying that people don't slip through and know how to work the system, but consider the state of Georgia. If you don't buy a glider from a USDA licensed breeder, then you are not legally supposed to have a glider.

Not all USDA inspectors care what the facilities look like or how animals are kept either (at all). BUT, with a license, there are two people that have to sign off on the breeder, versus a non-licensed breeder where no one does. It is just a personal opinion.

She asked if you could carry a license without 3 breeding pairs, the fact is, technically, you can if you are willing to pay for it.
_________________________
~Gretchen
Maia & Squish
If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.

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#662045 - 10/25/08 10:34 AM Re: USDA says no? [Re: sugarlope]
oakley Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 07/22/05
Posts: 2305
Loc: Florida, USA
Wow! Thanks for the great feedback!

I think, taking everything into consideration, that I will continue to stay Florida Fish and Wildlife licensed for now. I personally keep records on my little guys just for my own use.

One last question in regard to the 3 breeding pairs thing... I do know that the rule states 3 breeding FEMALES... would this include the female joeys that I have before I sell them? I do not breed any of them (they get their own cages at 8 weeks)
_________________________
Meghan

~__/>
{{ }}


Suggies: Basil, Mausi, Bagheera/Baloo, & the Trio
Dogs : Pretzel/Snickers
Horse: Nugget
RIP: Gato, Pepito, Pepper, and Mowgli gangel


Oakley's Glider Site

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#662108 - 10/25/08 12:30 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: oakley]
Glider_Invasion Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 11/25/07
Posts: 168
Loc: Maryland, USA

I agree with Mommawannabe & Princessmegi!
But sometime I think it's mostly the Inspectors discresion. AFTER you are able to get the license. (waiting period can be a while. I think they are trying to figure out what a Sugar Glider is)!lol
And,yes you have to be 18, at least in most states, before they will even talk to you. Six yrs ago, my grandson tried to get ours, for himself. But they wouln't even return any calls concerning questions on # of pairs,( I think because he was a teenager), until I contacted them myself.
And no this does not include joeys. They have to be in with a male and of breeding age, to be considered a "breeding pair".
(Giving that your inspector knows the difference between males & females). This was an issue I incountered recently.
When a new inspector asks "which is the female"....???
Really shook my confidence in them!
And I agree, if (PPP) Perfect Pocket Pets can maintain a license, what good is it? Except the yearly ck-up. Even that I question, since it's only a Well Check-up.
_________________________
Diane

http://www.glider-invasion.webs.com

Happy & Educated Parents, have Happy & Healthy Suggies.

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#662146 - 10/25/08 01:39 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: Glider_Invasion]
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
The 'rule' is MORE than 3 breeding females, so no, joeys do not count.
_________________________
~Gretchen
Maia & Squish
If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.

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#662562 - 10/26/08 12:16 PM Re: USDA says no? [Re: sugarlope]
oakley Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 07/22/05
Posts: 2305
Loc: Florida, USA
Thanks! I was pretty sure the joeys didn't count, but then again better safe than sorry. I am 18 now, and was just thinking about calling and asking again. Given the advice I have gotten here though (which is GREAT by the way) I think I will just be content with my FFW license.

And the once a year vet check up rule is nice... but I would prefer a rule that states that the breeder must take gliders to a vet at the first sign of injury or illness. The second female glider I ever got managed to lose about 1/3 of her tail the first day I had her... (I posted a frantic "HELP" post on here!) I called the breeder I got her from (USDA licensed btw) and he said,

"DON'T WORRY, JUST PUT SOME SUPER GLUE ON THE TIP AND SQUEEZE THE SKIN TOGETHER UNTIL IT DRIES, NO PROBLEM"

Needless to say, I DID NOT take his advice and brought the poor thing to my vet... I would hate to think what would have happened if she had gotten that injury while she was with him!
_________________________
Meghan

~__/>
{{ }}


Suggies: Basil, Mausi, Bagheera/Baloo, & the Trio
Dogs : Pretzel/Snickers
Horse: Nugget
RIP: Gato, Pepito, Pepper, and Mowgli gangel


Oakley's Glider Site

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