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#686505 - 12/05/08 11:47 AM GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly)
suggiemom1980 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/05/07
Posts: 13744
Loc: Vincennes, IN, USA
Anyone have experience with this? I'm thinking about getting some.
Please PM me for the link to the product.





Edited by LSardou (12/05/08 02:26 PM)
Edit Reason: edited
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#686558 - 12/05/08 01:29 PM Re: GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly) [Re: suggiemom1980]
Marz Offline
Glider Guardian

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 708
Loc: Melbourne Australia


I don't like the misadvertising mentioning Australian Acacia gum in the blurb when in fact, what you are getting is from Africa/India (these are the main exporters),most likely processed in China and bottom line, not even the same species of Acacia that wild sugar gliders feed from. The problem with Exotic Nutrition product appears that they are repackaged for their own business therefore possibly will not have the original source of manufacture & product on them so you aren't informed. In this particular product, it says manufactured by Exotic Nutrition but I would be asking where they manufacture it and where do the contents come from.

Anyone who knows me, is aware of my pet hate of things manufactured/processed particularly in China but similar countries where the quality control that is suspect. Sadly this has shown up in recent years in the press with recalls and horror stories but it's something I have been wary about for years after dealing with Chinese beauracy with my husband's work and have seen it in action personally. If a company has the dollars to pay for it to happen, they can bypass a lot of the stringent quality checks!

As for the gel part, African/Indian Acacia gum is usually processed into a dry product-crystals, granules or powder. It is however water soluble and will turn into a gel like substance once added to water. Therefore again the advertising sounds like you are getting a Pure natural acacia gum gel when in actual fact you are getting a powder/crystal reconstituted in water which is definitely not natural. I guess this is where the Ash content in the product comes from.

Another bit of the blurb that I question is that gliders can digest 90% of the acacia gum. Acacia sap is actually difficult to digest as it has chemical properties such as tannin that makes it indigestible by most animals. Sugar gliders are able to digest some through a microbial fermentation in the hindgut but they must have natural gut florae suited to this but 90%?. I would love to know the source of their information here.

If I were you I would be asking lots of questions to Exotic Nutrititon about this product before trying it out.

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#687668 - 12/07/08 04:44 PM Re: GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly) [Re: Marz]
Glider_Invasion Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 11/25/07
Posts: 168
Loc: Maryland, USA
agree Good reply! Why pay for water when you can add your own?
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#688462 - 12/08/08 10:45 PM Re: GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly) [Re: Glider_Invasion]
big ern!
Unregistered


In the past, I have bought acacia gum from exotic nutrition and as far as I can tell, they do use the Australian sourced gum since the powder is darker with what I would assume are tannins. As far as I know, all gum is going to have an ash content which is basically where all the minerals like calcium and magnesium are going to be found when doing an analysis, I'm not sure that its from processing.

I've bought the african species gum powder and it is typically off white with very low tannin. The African species gum is much cheaper and fundamentally the same thing as the Australian stuff except for tannins, which for the most part aren't likely to be all that beneficial and in my opinion are dispensable.

Yes, I would be skeptical of anything processed in China. There are places in the US that you can buy certified organic, safely processed(not from China unless I've been lied to) acacia gum powder that I have safely fed my gliders for years. You can buy the powder and mix in juices, water or pollen at your house. You can make your own gummy treats without having to pay a bunch of money to someone else to ship you a rehydrated product wink

Gliders have a modified digestive system that incorporates an enlarged caecum that definitely makes use of some microbial fermentation to break down the complex polysaccharide linkages in the gum. I don't know if 90% is a valid figure or not though. It seems pretty high. Either they are doing some researching/experimenting, or some good story writing. wink

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#688606 - 12/09/08 01:03 AM Re: GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly) [Re: ]
Marz Offline
Glider Guardian

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 708
Loc: Melbourne Australia
Originally Posted By: big ern!
In the past, I have bought acacia gum from exotic nutrition and as far as I can tell, they do use the Australian sourced gum since the powder is darker with what I would assume are tannins. As far as I know, all gum is going to have an ash content which is basically where all the minerals like calcium and magnesium are going to be found when doing an analysis, I'm not sure that its from processing.

I've bought the african species gum powder and it is typically off white with very low tannin. The African species gum is much cheaper and fundamentally the same thing as the Australian stuff except for tannins, which for the most part aren't likely to be all that beneficial and in my opinion are dispensable.

Yes, I would be skeptical of anything processed in China. There are places in the US that you can buy certified organic, safely processed(not from China unless I've been lied to) acacia gum powder that I have safely fed my gliders for years. You can buy the powder and mix in juices, water or pollen at your house. You can make your own gummy treats without having to pay a bunch of money to someone else to ship you a rehydrated product wink

Gliders have a modified digestive system that incorporates an enlarged caecum that definitely makes use of some microbial fermentation to break down the complex polysaccharide linkages in the gum. I don't know if 90% is a valid figure or not though. It seems pretty high. Either they are doing some researching/experimenting, or some good story writing. wink



Hi Ern

I can almost promise you that Exotic Nutrition do not sell Australian acacia gum simply because it's not available! There were some trial harvests made but so far it's all been unsuccessful for the consumer market simply due to the type of gum produced as well as the viability of it costwise. This is why most of the acacia gum is processed in places like China simply because it is cheap to do so fr the greatest profit margin.

If the acacia gum was sourced from Australia, it would be worth an absolute fortune and just not viable to sell to the average glider owner! There are several sources of the gum in Asia/Africa but generally it's sent to places like China for processing..it's all about cheap labour and processing costs. If you are lucky to have found a US processor, excellent! There is no such thing here in Australia. Even the chinese processed stuff is not available here in non commericial quantities. Thankfully I can just put some acacia branches in my aviaries instead.

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#688648 - 12/09/08 04:37 AM Re: GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly) [Re: Marz]
Bourbon Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 04/01/99
Posts: 5333
Loc: Bee-Bopping round SnakePit USA
not to mention the 240 different species of acacia
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#688878 - 12/09/08 01:42 PM Re: GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly) [Re: Bourbon]
Marz Offline
Glider Guardian

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 708
Loc: Melbourne Australia
Originally Posted By: Bourbon
not to mention the 240 different species of acacia


You can add at least another 1500 to that figure. grin

There are 1357 taxa of acacia in Australia alone. There are so many types,looks,nutrition & chemical compositions,it's mind boggling.

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#689075 - 12/09/08 06:40 PM Re: GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly) [Re: Marz]
big ern!
Unregistered


It was years ago that I bought the gum from Exotic Nutrition so maybe they changed, or they never had it and lie, who knows wink all I can say is what I saw.

I and others use Acacia senegal derived gum with no problems. The most notable variance in gum is the variety of hexose and pentose monosaccharides that make up the more complex polysaccharides. Most of these isomers and their linkages are to my knowledge benign carbohydrates that probably depend on bacterial digestion since from a glance most of these linkages and saccharides aren't common precursor molecules to eukaryotic sugar pathways.

This is similar to how cellulose is difficult to digest since mammals don't have the enzymes to break down the beta linkages in cellulose, but, certain bacteria can digest it and make the energy available to the organism(ex. cows) harboring it in the digestive system. Cellulose is principally the same polysaccharide as starch(which we can digest), the only difference is in how the individual glucose molecules that make up the starch/cellulose are linked.

There are a few varieties listed in the chemical analysis shown at this link: http://prr.hec.gov.pk/Chapters/1411-2.pdf

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#694413 - 12/17/08 09:52 AM Re: GUMIVORE-FARE (Jungle Jelly) [Re: ]
hwh4ev Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 12/03/08
Posts: 2833
Loc: roseville, mi
big ern,
where do you get your organic acacia gum. i get acacia gum and gliderade at sun coast sugar gliders.

regards,
_________________________
regards,
nancy in roseville (formerly in detroit)

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