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#688656 - 12/09/08 04:59 AM Help please - diarrhetic joey
BKaylor74 Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 208
Loc: Columbia SC
I'm hoping someone can give more advice that might be on at this hour. The little boy that I've been hand feeding for the last week started getting sick last night. He's been doing good the whole time, except that he isn't gaining much of any weight, but he has a great appetite, or did anyway. Last night around 7pm he started pooping and pretty much hasn't stopped. It was solid at first, but got softer as the night went on. He wouldn't pee though, and he was still eating good up until about midnight. I don't know if its because of what I've been feeding him the last two days or what. The last batch of bml I was feeding him was mixed with esbilac, maybe about 30%, and he seemed to be fine with it. Then I made a new batch, minus the esbilac, but without thinking I made it the way I usually do, which is about half-again as much as a normal recipe makes. Of course I left out the wheat germ still. He was eating that with the grape pedialyte but he won't take the pedialyte on its own.

I finally found some apple pedialyte at a walgreens. He didn't want any of that at first either, but he finally took a little bit a while ago - maybe .5ml if that. I made a new batch of baby bml with just enough for one batch, and used plain rice cereal. I mixed some with the apple pedialyte to thin it, maybe 25%, and he took a little of that too, about half a ml. He finally peed in his incubator while I went to wal-mart at 3am to get more stuff for bml.

It seems like his stomach is hurting him. Of course with the diarrhea it probably is, but even before that he was making weird little whisper sounds, and then started straining. I think his cloaca is hurting him, as every time I try to rub it with a wet q-tip (trying to get him to pee), he winces and does that hissing/whispering noise. It doesn't look red, but it might be a little swollen.

Is there anything else I can do for him on my own? I'm going to try to find a vet in the morning that will see him. He still doesn't seem dehydrated, but I could be wrong. His skin doesn't tent between his shoulders. So if he is dehydrated it isn't showing with that little tent test. And his belly is round and soft.

Another thing is, he hasn't gained hardly any weight in the last week. He was starting to, but then it went back down. He was almost 20g Saturday. He's back down to 18g today.

If anyone knows anything else I can do, please share.
_________________________
~Bryan
----------------

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#688658 - 12/09/08 05:27 AM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: BKaylor74]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Bryan,
Diarrhea is definitely a huge red flag. You will want to be waiting on the vet's doorstep when they open this morning to have him seen immediately. With the fact that he is still not gaining any weight after a week, I am very concerned about him at this point.
In the meantime, while you wait for the vet to open, continue alternating plain Pedialyte with Baby BML to try to keep him hydrated. It sounds like he may have a bit of an infection starting. Joeys will hiss while being stimulated, so that in itself does not concern me... but the painful tummy and diarrhea do worried
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#688659 - 12/09/08 05:29 AM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: BKaylor74]
beezer
Unregistered


confused From what I read you seem to be doing everything right - but there are more knowledgeable people on this forum then I am - dunno I know when they are up and start to read this they will have a better solution then I - Right now I'd just hold him and keep him warm (even tho he isn't cold) and get to a vet ASAP - good luck and please keep us informed as to what the vet said

sue
owned by
& mommy to

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#688660 - 12/09/08 05:30 AM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: sugarglidersuz]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Does he seem bloated at all? Does his tummy look like he swallowed a super ball? If so, then you will need to ask the vet about using simethicone (Little Tummies for infants)... the dosage information is on my site Here but don't start using it until you've checked with your vet first.
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#688667 - 12/09/08 06:11 AM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: sugarglidersuz]
BKaylor74 Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 208
Loc: Columbia SC
Thanks for replying.

There's a vet listed in the database that's about 5 miles away. Their site says it has 24 hour emergency care but i called and no one answered. I don't know what time they open.

His belly doesn't seem bloated, but i did feel a little rumbling a couple times last night when I felt it. It's not hard either.

He's perked up a bit and took a good bit of pedialyte and then some more bml, which also has some pedialyte in it to thin it. and he hasn't pooped in a few hours now. probably since about 4. He's back asleep in my pocket curled up with his fleece blanket. He's also stopped making that whincing/whispering sound, so hopefully his belly isn't hurting him as much as before.
_________________________
~Bryan
----------------

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#688670 - 12/09/08 06:23 AM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: BKaylor74]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Bryan,
Thanks for the update. I'll keep you both in my thoughts & prayers while at work today hug2
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#688701 - 12/09/08 07:47 AM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: sugarglidersuz]
LSardou Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/01/06
Posts: 21060
Loc: Kansas
hug2 Suz gave you excellent advice. Even if he appears to be somewhat better this morning, I still strongly suggest that you take him in to get checked.
Sending lots of hugs and prayers.

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#689053 - 12/09/08 05:50 PM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: LSardou]
BKaylor74 Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 208
Loc: Columbia SC
Well, the vet I was going to take him to won't see him until friday when their exotics doctor is back - from vacation? i didn't ask. The next closest vet that treats gliders is in Lakeland, about an hour away, or more depending on traffic, and I can't get there until thursday.

He's doing a lot better though, it seems. His diarrhea has stopped and his appetite has gotten back to normal. He's warm and he's grooming himself after he eats. He's still so tiny though. His sister has gotten much bigger. I haven't weighed her in a few days now, but she's at least half again as big as he is. He's still at 18g.

He's stopped wincing or hissing and he's not constantly moving around like he was yesterday. It seemed like he couldn't get comfortable. He kept climbing out of my pocket and up by my neck under my collar. But today he's staying curled up in my pocket and completely silent.

I'm hoping it was just the change in his diet that caused his stomach to hurt him. I think the last batch of BML i was feeding him was too rich. It's my only guess, other than a possible bacterial infection. His poo isn't green or anything though. I'm still going to get him to a vet as soon as possible, if I can just find one that will see him. I have class all day tomorrow, but I'll be taking him to school with me as their won't be anyone at home to look after him and feed him every 2 hours. There's a microwave in my lab dept. that I can heat his food in. I'll just have to keep it on ice the rest of the time.

How much should a joey weigh when their 19 days OOP? I've read that hand-fed joeys don't gain weight as fast as nursing joeys, but that they usually catch up to normal size by weening age. Is this very true?
_________________________
~Bryan
----------------

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#689058 - 12/09/08 06:02 PM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: BKaylor74]
LSardou Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/01/06
Posts: 21060
Loc: Kansas
I'm sorry but I really don't have an answer for you since my experience with joeys is limited. However, here is a link that might be of some help.
I would like to suggest though when you do take your little one with you tomorrow to please make sure that he is kept plenty warm and away from drafts.
Joey Growth and Development

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#689067 - 12/09/08 06:32 PM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: LSardou]
BKaylor74 Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 208
Loc: Columbia SC
Yes that's another concern I have. Our computer labs get pretty cold, as the equipment has to be kept as cold as possible. It usually requires a jacket to sit there for 4 hours in one of those labs. They run the ac at about 55-60 F non-stop through the entire building.

I was reading about sugar warmers in another thread, and am thinking about trying to make my own for tomorrow. He'll be warm against me in my shirt pocket, and I have a hoodie I can wear over that. I'd order one from whoever came up with the idea, but of course I need one for tomorrow.
_________________________
~Bryan
----------------

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#689377 - 12/10/08 05:49 AM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: BKaylor74]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Bryan,
The Joey Development Study I have been doing hasn't had any rejected joey results submitted yet, but the average of the joeys' results compiled so far at 19 days oop is 29.63 grams with the median @ 23.4 and the range being {19.4, 45.0). It IS true that hand-raised joeys are generally smaller and they do catch up, but not usually by the time they are weaned, from my experience.
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#689945 - 12/10/08 08:28 PM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: sugarglidersuz]
BKaylor74 Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 208
Loc: Columbia SC
Thanks for that info Suz. 29.63 at 19 days? that's a big joey, isn't it?

He seems to be doing pretty good today. I hope I'm not jinxing anything by saying so. I had him at school with me and he stayed in my pocket curled up the whole time, except right at the beginning he had to climb up my neck. Not sure if he was very aware of the different environment or not. No one noticed him though.

He's still only eating about 1ml per feeding, and he seems to really like the apple pedialyte. I have to weigh him to see if he's gained anything since yesterday. But his stool is solid and normal looking. I'm about to feed him again. It just so happens that my breaks at school are right about 2 hours apart, so it worked out fine. I'm taking him to the vet Friday, since that is the earliest the vet here can see him.
_________________________
~Bryan
----------------

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#689976 - 12/10/08 09:21 PM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: BKaylor74]
BindiAndScrubbie Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 11/20/08
Posts: 1837
Loc: Florida
I hope he is alright. It is so stressful to worry about a sick baby.
_________________________
Davie

:rtmo:SpoiledRottenSuggies.com

Think of all the beauty still left around you and be happy - Anne Frank

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#690151 - 12/11/08 12:26 AM Re: Help please - diarrhetic joey [Re: sugarglidersuz]
ScootersPet Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 2092
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Originally Posted By: sugarglidersuz
Bryan,
The Joey Development Study I have been doing hasn't had any rejected joey results submitted yet, but the average of the joeys' results compiled so far at 19 days oop is 29.63 grams with the median @ 23.4 and the range being {19.4, 45.0). It IS true that hand-raised joeys are generally smaller and they do catch up, but not usually by the time they are weaned, from my experience.


Suz, just so you know, I have been keeping very detailed notes/weights on Bart as he grows (as detailed as how many times he pooped and peed, and how many times it was by himself or stimulated LOL) And will be filling out a form for him as soon as he is 60 days laugh

I hope your baby is feeling ok, I know how it worries us substitute mommies and daddies to find something wrong with our babies...Im going to go grey before I am 22 years old! lol
_________________________



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