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#7847 - 07/02/03 03:09 AM Please, help quick!!!!
Anonymous
Unregistered


Bandit, my rescue, is making this painful crabbing noise while curled over and attacking himself or something!! I can't tell what he is doing, i can't tell if hes hurting himself or he has poop stuck or something. It is the most horrible crying/crabbing I have ever heard!!! I was going to make a vet appointment until he was settled in, but I am calling tomorrow. What should I have the vet check for?? Maybe I can atleast get an e-collar for him, if he is attacking himself. I my heart aches for him! Something isnt right, he is trying to play with his toy, but stops to curl over and go down there and cry/crab! Please tell me what to do?!?!

I just noticed that there is liquid poop all on the shirt i gave him to sleep in. It is brown liquid. He is definatly attacking his anus area.

I turned the light on and now he is trying to sleep. He doesn't make the noise or attacks himself while sleeping, only when awake.

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#7848 - 07/02/03 03:41 AM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Could he maybe have a UTI? I know UTI's cause quite a bit of discomfort.
But he also has diarreah, that could be from the stress of being in a new home, or a sign of some form of illness.
I'd say keep him hydrated and take him to the vet as soon as possible.
Hopefully someone with alot more knowledge than I will post something to help <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
/glider hugs to you and your little baby. I hope he gets well soon and that its nothing major

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#7849 - 07/02/03 03:55 AM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
BeetleJuice Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 12/12/01
Posts: 2724
Loc: Summerville, SC
Jessie,

Can you tell if he is doing any damage to himself? I don't want to scare you, but it sounds like the classical description of a self mutilator. If you see any signs that he is definitely chewing, you need to get him in an e-collar, then get him to the vet as soon as possible.

There can be many causes for his actions, anywhere from an UTI to an impaction/ constipation problem. The primary concern is to prevent him form doing any damage to himself and keep him hydrated.
_________________________
Craig

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#7850 - 07/02/03 06:30 AM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


He needs an e-collar. This is done to prevent damage. He also needs to be seen by a vet asap. Definately check for a uti and have a fecal test. Be prepared when/if you put on the ecollar as he will fight you, but remember it is in his best interest as you do not want him to cause damage. I'm so sorry that you have to go through this right after picking up your new rescue.

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#7851 - 07/02/03 07:14 AM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
Lucy Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/14/01
Posts: 7354
Loc: Lexington, KY
Hopefully it's just a UTI or an infection related to the diarrhea -- that can be painful in and of itself. But it sure sounds like the little guy made it to the right home at the right time. Keep us posted and let us know what the vet says.!
_________________________


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#7852 - 07/02/03 12:44 PM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Well he has an appointment with the vet at 3pm which is an hour from now. This should be interesting, because he doesn't like to be handled. Also, JUST the vet visit is $47!!!!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shakehead.gif" alt="" />

People up here have big heads and think they can charge whatever they want... but I gues they could because people are willing to pay it if they really need help.

I'll let you guys know how it goes. Thanks so much beetlejuice, for the link with how to make an e-collar. I will see what the vet says and definatly make one when i get home.

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#7853 - 07/02/03 02:28 PM Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Okay, I just got back from the vet with Bandit. It was only $20, the $47 is for cats and dogs.

His anal area is definatly swollen and looks like it bleeds a tiny bit when he goes to the bathroom. The vet says it is from him biting himself.

The vet said that for tonight, to put quartizone (sp?) cream on his anal area and see if this helps with him attacking himself. He also says that he looks healthy (other than the look of his coat) and that he thinks he is self mutilating himself from years of lonliness. If the quartizone doesnt work tonight, I am to call him tomorrow and we will get an e-collar or do something else.

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#7854 - 07/02/03 02:36 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I hope everything works out okay <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />

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#7855 - 07/02/03 02:40 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


[:"blue"] Glider Greetings: <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

Think you are probably talking about "CORTISONE" cream. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />



</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
Quick definitions: CORTISONE(noun).....a corticosteroid hormone (trade name Cortone Acetate) normally produced by the adrenal cortex; is converted to hydrocortisone. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/read.gif" alt="" />

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">
[/]

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#7856 - 07/02/03 02:40 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
BeetleJuice Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 12/12/01
Posts: 2724
Loc: Summerville, SC
Jessie,

It may be a good idea to go ahead and make an e-collar just in case. It' better to have and not need then the other way around. Did the vet run fecals and a urinalysis, and if so did they come back negative? Keep us updated on his progress.
_________________________
Craig

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#7857 - 07/02/03 02:54 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Poor little baby <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/gliderangel.gif" alt="" />
I hope the cortisone cream helps and he gets better soon! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

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#7858 - 07/02/03 03:01 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hope all is well <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />

I swear that Randy must be a English teacher or something.He's always coming up with the proper spelling and definitions <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

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#7859 - 07/02/03 03:08 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Beetlejuice, he didn't do any testing as of yet because he does believe it is just self mutilation, but if the cream doesn't work tonight, I will bring him back and the vet said hed do tests and stuff. I will make the e-collar just in case, are they expensive threw the vet? I am really bad at making things... lol

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#7860 - 07/02/03 03:19 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
BeetleJuice Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 12/12/01
Posts: 2724
Loc: Summerville, SC
Jessie,

They are normally under $10 dollars. There was a thread recently about them info. on e-collars .

Keeping you both in our prayers that everything turns out ok. Just keep a close eye on him and get him in an e-collar if there is an evidence that he is chewing. Treatment for the SM and any underlying causes (if there is determined to be some) will be much easier if damage is prevented.
_________________________
Craig

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#7861 - 07/02/03 09:34 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hope your little guy is better soon!

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#7862 - 07/02/03 09:47 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Just out of curiousity since the vet did not do any tests how did he come to the conclusion that it was due to boredom? I would highly suggest to go ahead and make up an ecollar if necessary. From experience I can say that self mutilation is a scary thing that can progress very quickly and the vet bills can get very expensive. If you need any information about this please vist the glider health website or if you need support feel free to email me.

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#7863 - 07/02/03 11:00 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


The reason why we came to the conclusion it was boredom, is because he does not do this while sleeping and does not do it if he is distracted. If am I near the cage he is in, he wants to know what im doing and wants to come out. If he is crawling around on me, he doesnt attack himself. Aslong as he is stimulated, he doesnt even stick his head down there for anything. I will request an e-collar or make one myself, just incase I need it in an emergency.

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#7864 - 07/03/03 06:36 AM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


With self mutilators it is actually quite common that they do not attack themselves while they sleep or while they are being entertained by the owner. The glider does not want to cause injury. They first bite for one reason or another, however once there is even the smallest wound they will keep attacking it because it is painful and they need to rid the body of the pain. This is natural instinct, however it can be a vicious circle. How did he do last night with the cream? Did it prevent him from attacking himself? If not, I highly recommend returning to the vet and having the test run. They are very routine tests.

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#7865 - 07/03/03 10:15 AM Re: Bandit-UPDATE! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" /> Well, he didnt attack himself last night! I spent about an hour with him, in the play tent, feeding him apples and letting him lick me (he would bite my [censored], but not my skin, and he likes to lick). I also moved him from the cage and set up the tent as a temp home for him until the new cage gets here. So I am not sure if it was the cream, the nice big tent to stay in, or the attention, but he didn't attack himself! I saw him lick down there a few times, but I think that was because of the cream. There was no biting or painful crabbing/crying. I can't believe we made it through the night!

I will still keep putting the cream on and watching him closely, to see if he does it again. Hopefull I caught him at the beginning of this ordeal and he will be able to live happily here with me, with no problems.

Last night I gave him apples, zookeeper, and some grasshoppers. He ate every single piece of apple and every single peice of zookeeper! So he likes the zookeeper!!! He didn't eat the grasshoppers, but I am sure he will have to slowly learn how to like those, lol. Anyway, we made alot of progress and I can tell bonding is going to go great. Keep your fingers cross that he doesn't start self mutilating again! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />


Attachments
113878-Bandit\'s first apple!.JPG (17 downloads)


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#7866 - 07/03/03 10:53 AM Re: Bandit-UPDATE! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


jessie...glad that sweet bandit is doing OK <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> keep us posted on anything else <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

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#7867 - 07/03/03 12:27 PM Re: Bandit-UPDATE! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


That is great news! I hope there are no more problems.

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#7868 - 07/03/03 12:51 PM Re: Bandit-UPDATE! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm glad to hear that your little Bandit is getting better. For helping him get used to eating live bugs, try releasing a couple of live crickets in the tent when you have play time with him, for him to hunt. I do this with my own girls, and it's hilarious to watch them hunt. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

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#7869 - 07/03/03 03:32 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


If I were you, I'd find or make an ecollar. You can put it in your emergency kit if you don't need it. My vet didn't even have any (and she's very knowledgeable re: gliders). I took a catalog page in to her, and asked if she could order me two (they want to sell to vets only). I told her I wanted one for my emergency. She told her receptionist to order a stack of them.

Anyway, my point is that you can't rely on your vet to have them. Make one and take it with you, when or if you go. The vet may not have one.

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#7870 - 07/03/03 09:21 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Jessie that is such good news! you are such a great glider mommy!!!!!!! I am so glad you were able to rescue him! How'd the e-collar work out? Great job! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" />

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#7871 - 07/03/03 11:04 PM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
Bourbon Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 04/01/99
Posts: 5333
Loc: Bee-Bopping round SnakePit USA
Mizzboo, please listen to Bindy, she knows from experience, that this is nothing to play around with. It is very easy to think that distraction will help on a regular basis, The fact that he has already done damage, as minimal as it may seem, means there is definitly a problem there that needs to be addressed. The vet should do the minimum testing of urinalysis, fecal and bacterial culture. in the meantime, I HIGHLY suggest the e-collar, the one that is listed on the gliderhealth site has a double layer of moleskin on it, to allow you to put it on tight enough to stay, it also shows how to tell if it is on too tight. My hat goes off to bindy for staying with us, throughout her ordeal, sadly by the time we got him to someone else that understood, the urgency it was too late. I for one really appreciate Bindy trying to help others so they don't make the same mistakes. She was told not to put an e-collar on hers, and she did everything in her power to keep him from going after himself, sadly, he got to it, at a time she wasn't there. Since that time, she has helped many understand the importance, and helping people noticing the signs. If you don't collar him, and he gets to it again, he may do irreversable damage, as in BO's case, who has had several surgeries and has to pretty much live in his collar. The key thing is NOT to allow the damage to be done.
read some of the stories regarding the gliders listed below at the Glider Health Self Mutilation Site
Some people you can email privately and speak to about this if you feel more comfortable, who has had exerience with the SM's is....
Bindy and (Danielle of K&D Exotics) Spikes Story
Tom Self mutilation symptoms (currently has one)
Mary H Mary's post on BO and Gizmo (currently has 2)
Dawn Petey's Story (Had 1 that mutilated for 2 years, designed the e-collar on the site and hasn't had an episode in 2 years, but will always be an at risk glider)
Myself (Casper's story) look at the attachment of a self mutilators tail, you will notice the similarities..


Attachments
114220-life1.jpg (14 downloads)

_________________________
Baybe,My Roots

SGGA

CustomCruiser

BML

Sugar Glider Genetic Project

321-331-1608

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#7872 - 07/03/03 11:38 PM Re: Bandit went to the vet [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


[:"blue"]Glider Greetings, Suzette: <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
Hope all is well <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />

I swear that Randy must be a English teacher or something.He's always coming up with the proper spelling and definitions <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

[:"blue"] Actually, I been involved with making maps of one sort or another most of my life and hold the distinction of being one of the worlds top one hundred worst spellers.....couldn't even spell my own name until I was 14 years old.....LOL. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/roflmao.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/roflmao.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/roflmao.gif" alt="" />

I have a wonderful spell-checker(thanks to Lucy) that checks BB messages and I have an Internet dictionary programed to start up whenever I get on GliderCentral. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />
[/]

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#7873 - 07/04/03 12:40 AM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
Bourbon Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 04/01/99
Posts: 5333
Loc: Bee-Bopping round SnakePit USA
here is a pic of a glider that did get to himself, he was one of the lucky ones, inspite of the fact he didn't make it, most just chew holes into their cloaca to the point you can't see a cloaca dime size to quarter size.


Attachments
114271-surgcas3.jpg (35 downloads)

_________________________
Baybe,My Roots

SGGA

CustomCruiser

BML

Sugar Glider Genetic Project

321-331-1608

Top
#7874 - 07/04/03 03:37 AM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


He has been doing much better since tuesday night. Last night and tonight he didnt attack himself once. I've been spending all night watching him, just to make sure and I would wake up from that sound ANYTIME, what a horrible sound. I am getting the materials tomorrow, to make an e-collar, just incase something does go horribly wrong, but the cortizone cream seems to be working with him. He is also eating alot, which I think is a good sign. Believe me, I don't think I am in the clear yet. I think some people are worried that i think he is totally healthy now, and i do not think that at all. The vet was closed today until monday so I couldnt call today, but I will call about getting the tests done. I do believe his self muitilation was caused by loneliness and how small his cage was, only because the doctor said he must have just started attacking himself because he had very little swelling, but just enough to notice. I am hoping I caught this in time to be able to bring him back to good health in no time, but believe me, I do understand that this could turn into a long uphill battle at any second and I am prepared for that. Thank you for all the help and for all the info. I really appreciate it and I feel better prepared because of all of you that helped!

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#7875 - 07/04/03 05:45 AM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
mary h Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 385
Loc: Wallis, Texas
MizzBoo
When you go back to the vet and have the fecal test done, tell
him to check closely for Giardia. It is quiet common for the
stress of a change of enviorment or diet to trigger an explosion of Giardia. It is easily treated with Flagyl. This
could be causing the dis-comfort for your glider. Most vets
would have done a fecal on the intial visit. I think Bourbon
or Judie once posted a list of the basic tests that should
be done on a vet visit. Maybe we could get them to post them
again.
mary h & Charlie
_________________________
mary h

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#7876 - 07/04/03 11:02 AM Re: Please, help quick!!!! [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm so glad things are getting better! I hope they continue to do so - keep your guard up and know that we're all pulling for Bandit!

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