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#88312 - 03/15/06 12:15 AM Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN
Xfilefan Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 8899
Loc: Jacksonville, FL
He started tearing his hair out again, then his face swelled and eye started to bulge..like the last 2 times...so back on the Clindamycin. If I don't see improvement, we'll go back to Dr. Emch. It's been about 4 months this time since the last course of treatment. My poor baby has had nothing but illness in his life and I feel so bad for him. Pray the Clinda works. They cant get a sample of what's in there because it's so diffused throughout the tissue. Even tho this isn't unexpected with him, I still feel SO bad for him having to go thru this every few months-he hates the meds, but is SO good for them at the same time. I just don't know what else to do for the little guy. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/needhug.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Jen/Colin :bb: Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed :wfb: Sinbad, :wfb: Gabby, :grey: Baby, and :grey: Alley

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#88314 - 03/15/06 12:35 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Xfilefan Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 8899
Loc: Jacksonville, FL
Thanks, Tom. For the first time in almost 2 years, we finally had ALL of his hair grown back. It lasted 4 weeks. I was so happy, thinking maybe we had it beat. Now he's missing half the hair on top of his head again in 4 days. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Jen/Colin :bb: Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed :wfb: Sinbad, :wfb: Gabby, :grey: Baby, and :grey: Alley

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#88315 - 03/15/06 12:39 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
glidrz5 Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 06/13/01
Posts: 7297
Loc: Quincy, IL
Awwwwwww Jen, I was so hoping that Riker was finally over this for good. I know what you're going through since I've also got furkids with "chronic" problems. You feel so bad that they have to keep going through this. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> to you and Riker and here's some <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> for the others so they don't feel left out.
_________________________
Chris
Illusion, Malcom, Isabell, Annabelle, Zach, Isis, Aly & Indy
AND Miss Emmy & Miss Chloe kitties

:rbridge: My Angels: You are always in my heart.

You've flown to the rainbow
and wait there for me
Someday I will join you
together to be



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#88316 - 03/15/06 12:53 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Jen, So sorry to hear that you/he is going through this again. Hugs from our family to yours.

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />

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#88317 - 03/15/06 12:57 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Oh I am so sorry!
*hugs*
I know how terrible it feels to have a sick animal. Then you have to force them to take medicine!!
Your sugie and you will be in my prayers!
Best Wishes!!!

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#88318 - 03/15/06 01:11 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Jen,
I understand you don't believe you have an abscess pocket to drain this time, but more of a cellulitis. Have you ever had a positive culture in the past?

One possible technique to get a bug is to inject saline into the area of cellulitis, and then drain the fluid back and try to culture it. One will not get as much back as went in, but enough to culture. One would have to be sure and not use bacteriostatic saline (with preservative) so that the germs are not inhibited from growing. We use it for preemies so the preservative doesn't poison the very small, and I keep it in my glider first aid kit. This technique doesn't have a 100% yield, but it is worth a try. I mention it in case for some reason you have him anesthetized, this might be tried to get a sample. The yield might be a little better if the clindamycin wasn't started yet, but that isn't absolute either.

Good luck.

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#88319 - 03/15/06 01:21 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Xfilefan Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 8899
Loc: Jacksonville, FL
Schlep, actually, that hadn't been presented as an option. They did try to flush fluid out of his sinuses, and got a good sample, but there wasn't anything in the sample-rather, they cultured it and got nothing at all, according to what the report said. He's been under for Xrays before, as well as the nasal flush, so I don't have a problem putting him under if there's something they can try. How many days do you think he should be off antibiotics to obtain a good sample? I'll try anything to attempt to pinpoint what is going on in there-this is his 5th go round with this-always on the right side of his head. If you think it's worth a try, I'll try it. Do you think a blood sample would be of any benefit (we haven't done that on him, either)? He's been on meds for 3 days-not much noticeable improvement yet...this one isn't as bad as the last one, as far as other symptoms (sneezing, nasal drainage, eye drainage and batting at his face haven't occured)..but the swelling is bad-every time he tries to move his eye the white shows, and his face is definitely lopsided in the cheek, as before.
_________________________
Jen/Colin :bb: Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed :wfb: Sinbad, :wfb: Gabby, :grey: Baby, and :grey: Alley

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#88320 - 03/15/06 01:23 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Xfilefan Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 8899
Loc: Jacksonville, FL
Also, they did attempt to extract a sample from the cheek, during two different infections...a straight extraction didn't work because of the diffusion. They didn't try it this time, because the vet couldn't feel a pocket, and the previous failures.
_________________________
Jen/Colin :bb: Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed :wfb: Sinbad, :wfb: Gabby, :grey: Baby, and :grey: Alley

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#88321 - 03/15/06 07:10 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I have a female that was bald on the left side of her head when we got her...she was about 1 1/2 - 2 years old. Her hair has never grown back. She is on her 5th round of Clindamyciin for a swollen jaw. Soon going in to be put under anesthesia to see if she has an infected tooth this time. It has been round and round, but she is just so sweet. She doesn't even seem bothered by it..but I know she has to be. And, yes, she HATES the medicine. Hang in there, again.

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#88322 - 03/15/06 07:51 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Carrie T Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 06/10/01
Posts: 4049
Loc: Doniphan Mo
Sending hugs and prayers your way Jen <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />

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#88323 - 03/15/06 10:32 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Dancing Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 22746
Loc: 80 acres of paradise in KS
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> Poor Riker! Jen I'm so sorry the little guy is going through this yet again (and that you are). Know I'm here if you need/want to talk. I sure wish I had something wise to say that would help. Just know you are in my thoughts. Give Riker a kiss for me.
_________________________
620-704-9109
Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.

I could have missed the pain
But I'd of had to miss the dance


The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.

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#88324 - 03/15/06 11:41 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
[:"green"]Jen,
I'm so sorry to hear the Cmdr. is sick again <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />. My prayers are with you both as you go through this yet again...
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#88325 - 03/15/06 09:13 PM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Jen,
I think a sinus flush or directly aspirating a fluid cavity or abscess is better than my suggestion if they work, I'm grasping at other approaches given the lack of cure to date. But you have been given good advice. The fluid in and out option is a lesser choice, but just what was seemingly left. I'm not real confident the yield will be great. I personally would not stop meds or anesthetize just to get that sample. If he was out for another reason, that is another matter.

I suspect in these cases that there is an abscess present, but it can be so small and hard to hit with a needle that it can't be found. Unless the needle tip happens to luckily get in the spot between tissue planes, getting back a sample (finding the abscess pocket) can be very hard. Diffuse cellulitis is much harder to get a sample from even with my suggestion. It just doesn't require being lucky enough to hit the pocket.

As always, check with your veterinarian on this next set of thoughts. - I normally don't go to prophylactic antibiotics easily, but there is a time and place. If Riker were mine, I would clear him like before then give him daily meds for life. I would not use clindamycin for the prophylactic med. The risk for bowel overgrowth with hideous stuff is too great. But Clavamox daily for months, then Amoxil or Bactrim (TMP/SMX) for the duration is a consideration. They are both cheap and well-tolerated. They both have a pretty good track record for long-term use in people.

I would consider steroids for a week now as well. I know that there is not good data to support such a suggestion in gliders, but you are in new territory and we don't have the New England Journal of Gliders to consult. And lastly, if he is put under for treatment or exam, flush his nasal passages. At least ruling out a foreign body, polyps, etc. is worth a thought and the debridement can't hurt. I'm looking for anything to try to tip the scales in your favor. Bummer of a problem. Good luck.

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#88326 - 03/22/06 02:58 AM Re: Cmdr Riker's facial infection is back AGAIN [Re: ]
Xfilefan Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 8899
Loc: Jacksonville, FL
Schlep, thank you for the advice, as always, and i'll talk with the vet about it.

The swelling in Riker's face is way down, so I know the meds are working. His hair isn't growing back in yet, tho. Here's a pic I took Sunday night-my little Mohawk man. He'll be on a couple more weeks of meds.


Attachments
547440-RkrOvergrm32006.jpg (27 downloads)

_________________________
Jen/Colin :bb: Commander Riker 12 16 02-10 04 12 you will be FOREVER missed :wfb: Sinbad, :wfb: Gabby, :grey: Baby, and :grey: Alley

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