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#91784 - 03/30/06 11:12 PM Death by pouch...
Anonymous
Unregistered


I want to spread this and do so quickly. I have just had a glider die by suffocation. The pouch, which I assumed was made with 2 layers of fleece sewn together was not! It was made with one layer of fleece and and a layer of flannel WITH BATTING IN BETWEEN!! When we found our poor boy he had batting all stuck in his mouth. They had chewed a hole and gotten between the layers. His mate is fine but lonely. These pouches are NOT SAFE for gliders!! This one in particular was made by Sugar Monsters Inc. I want to warn others to be careful of what kind of pouch they buy!! Ones with batting are not safe!!

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#91785 - 03/30/06 11:19 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I don't have any of her pouches, but I know Gina and I know she cares very deeply about the safety of her pouches. I understand that you are rightfully very upset right now, but I've never heard anything negative about her products before this. She will be horrified to hear about this tragedy. I'm so sorry you lost your glider. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/upset.gif" alt="" />

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#91786 - 03/30/06 11:22 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
GliderHappy81 Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 11/20/05
Posts: 3224
Loc: NC
Im so sorry that this happened to your glider. Please do keep in mind that the people who make these pouches cannot be held responsible once the pouch is in someone elses home and being used. The pouches have to be checked on a regular basis. This does not make a persons pouches unsafe. I am so sorry that you lost your poor boy. Especially in such a bad way. Please do not take this out on the maker of the pouch though. It is our responsibility to check the pouches for safety once they enter our homes.

Once again, Im sorry:( <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
jumpKarajump

*~*GliderExpressions*~*

*~*My Gliders*~*
Burl :leu:
Aria :wfb:
Fiona :plat:


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#91787 - 03/30/06 11:29 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm not blaming the maker or trying to rant...I'm only saying that batting is not a safe product for gliders to be around. It is easy to inhale and can be unsafe for small children even.I just want to warn others that it can happen!

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#91788 - 03/30/06 11:46 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
queenduck Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 6249
Loc: Kansas
I am so sorry this has happend to you. I know Gina well, and have seen and used many of her items, and I have never seen any of her stuff lined with batting, it could be, I just haven't seen it for myself or felt it. I know Gina is out of town right now, and WILL be devistated to hear this when she gets back. Please contact her directly and save your pouch to show her in case there is something she can do differently with this type of pouch. Often gliders are determined to chew and no pouch is safe for them, but as vendors we all try, and I know Gina tries, to provide the safest pouches out there. But they are not foolproof and can be destroyed and gliders can get hurt. Again, I am so sorry this had to happen.
_________________________
Alicia aka Queenduck, Bentley's Nana

We need role models who are going to break the mold ~ Carly Simon

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#91789 - 03/30/06 11:49 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


The unfortunate/ unbelievable thing for me is that I knew they needed new pouches and had recieved them and put them in their cage that day! And then the next day this happened! The new ones I bought are only 2 layers of fleece with nothing between and I think these will be safer! If only I had caught him in time...

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#91790 - 03/30/06 11:57 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


We're not trying to jump on you, aussieluvr. Please don't take it that way. It's just that the title of your post was kind of inflammatory, and Gina is well known on this board as a caring glider lover and quality pouch maker.

I appreciate that you are only trying to point out a possible danger. I have not heard of batting being an unsafe material, but obviously it was in this case. I'm not a seamstress, so I'm not familiar with it being known as an unsafe material for small children. Not knowing how to sew, and since I guess batting is only found inside sewn objects, I'm not even sure if I've ever handled it to know exactly what it's like. I've heard of gliders choking on many types of material though.

Again, please don't feel like we're attacking you. You are perfectly within your rights to post this warning. But these kinds of posts sometimes do go South, so I wanted to head off any trouble before it starts so it won't have to be closed due to emotions running high.

And since you're somewhat new to GC (well, here for a while but still a joey member) let me take this opportunity to assure you that you are very welcome here! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />

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#91791 - 03/31/06 12:02 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Lynsie Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/07/05
Posts: 8321
Loc: Quincy, IL 62305
I also have pouches by Gina and I love them! Yes, my gliders did tear a hole in one but that is not Gina's fault. My gliders have been know to be able to rip a hole in any pouch. Please do not try to blame this on Gina. It can happen with any pouch, and the way it was made has nothing to do with this. Flannel and batting are perfectly safe for gliders.
_________________________
Lynsie,
LuckyYou Gliders


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#91792 - 03/31/06 12:07 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
queenduck Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 6249
Loc: Kansas
aussieluvr, Yes, I agree with Peepers. We are not getting on you, you have a right to post that and in the end, I know that it will help others. I know that if Gina made something that ended up being unsafe, she would change the way she makes them, that's why I said save the pouch. And if your post makes people take another look at their pouches and changes the way things are made, that will help many.
I know I made something wrong when I first started, and I had no clue. Until a customer pointed it out to me, sent it back to me, and I changed the way I made it to resolve the problem. Had that person not have told me though, I wouldn't have known to fix it.

As for you getting new pouches. Don't blame yourself. It is a part of life that after something bad happens, we ask ourselves why, what could I have done, was it me? Thats just natural. It wasn't you, please don't blame yourself. It was just a very sad thing to happen. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Alicia aka Queenduck, Bentley's Nana

We need role models who are going to break the mold ~ Carly Simon

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#91793 - 03/31/06 12:27 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm confused... how can batting be safe is someone's glider just choked to death on it? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />
Does anyone have any other experience with this material and glider products?

My sympathy to you... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

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#91794 - 03/31/06 12:30 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Lynsie Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/07/05
Posts: 8321
Loc: Quincy, IL 62305
Many people use cotton batting. It is safe because most gliders don't chew holes through all of thier pouches. The batting is inbetween 2 layers of material. If you ever buy a Pillow Pouch or any other kind of insulated pouch, it has cotton batting in it. That is why we have to take precautions to this and check our pouches everynight.
_________________________
Lynsie,
LuckyYou Gliders


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#91795 - 03/31/06 01:14 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
I'm confused... how can batting be safe is someone's glider just choked to death on it? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

I'm not saying it is or isn't safe. In fact, until the above post that said it's what's in pillows, I thought it was a thin stiff material that would make a pouch keep its shape better. I think Lynsie was saying it isn't considered unsafe in most cases because most of the time gliders wouldn't come in contact with it. Only gliders who are chewers would ever find out it was there. If you know your gliders to be chewers, you have to take extra precautions. That said, sometimes you don't consider them chewers and they just decide to do it one day. I guess maybe pouch makers shouldn't necessarily stop using it, but maybe a caution to buyers that a pouch has batting in it and to be careful with chewers might be in order.

Also, just because one glider choked on it, that doesn't necessarily mean it's unsafe to the point that it shouldn't be used at all. Gliders have choked on carpet and gotten tangled in threads too. That doesn't mean you should remove the carpet from the glider playroom or stop buying any type of pouch made with thread. It just means you have to be careful.

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#91796 - 03/31/06 01:41 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Got it! Thanks for explaining - I haven't gotten my gliders yet and don't want to make any fatal mistakes! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thanx.gif" alt="" />

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#91797 - 03/31/06 01:47 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
queenduck Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 6249
Loc: Kansas
I have to go to bed, lol, but I have to make one correction. Pillow pouches made by Glider Daydreams does not have batting, it does have a filling, but not batting. And some other pouches that feel like they have batting in them, actualy have an extra layer of fleece/the safest in my opinion, or cut fleece/scraps, to add fluff.

There are some vendors that will not use batting/fiberfill, and some that will. Some owners that feel it's safe, and some that don't. It's a matter of opinion.

I once had a glider family chew through the pillow that comes with Bonkers pouches, and they nested right in there happy as could be. Chase and I could not find them and thought they had all got out ( doors were closed to the cage, but still, couldn't find them ) then found them all sleeping inside a pillow with fiberfill all around them. Thankfully they did not choke, and were very upset when I removed them and threw the pillow away. They thought it was the neatest cozy, warm, hiding place they had ever found. But, I just don't want to chance it, so I don't make anything with batting.

I did look at a nosey nursery after reading this, and I think it might have batting in it, I don't know. But the fleece is such good quality, it is sewn so tightly, and the gliders using it do not chew/never had, and it is still in great shape, so I'll just keep an eye on it.
_________________________
Alicia aka Queenduck, Bentley's Nana

We need role models who are going to break the mold ~ Carly Simon

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#91798 - 03/31/06 05:03 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


aussieluvr, I am so sorry your baby has died. My prayers are with you and your now lonely glider. I hope you are able to find him a friend soon. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />

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#91799 - 03/31/06 05:52 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
iwuvmahmonkaypuppays Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 12/13/04
Posts: 233
Loc: Plano, IL
i get my pouches through glider daydreams and after i had a couple of scares involving my gliders chewing through the 1st layer and getting into the batting (thank god i caught it soon enough) i jus ask her to not stuff if...out of my 8 gliders 4 of them are chewers (all the boys of course lol) so next time just ask for no filling
_________________________
Jen
My monkays-Ares, Apollo, Peter, Philbert, Lily, Frodo, Peppermint and Eggnog, Willow, Pebbles and Bam-Bam and Boo

My angels- Butch, Nibbles, Bonny, Peaches, Spock, Boomer, Spot, Pinky Feb. 21 2004, Autumn Oct.7 2004, Pearl June 13 2005-only the good die young

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#91800 - 03/31/06 06:06 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
sugarglidersuz Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 14788
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
[:"green"]I am so very sorry about your loss <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />. I know you are hurting & grieving and my hugs & prayers are with you.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />

This entire thread does bring up a very crucial point that should be reiterated periodically...
Gliders are very active little critters and are chewers by nature. It is very important to inspect all pouches & accessories in your gliders' cage each and every day. If you see even a little bit of damage, the pouch or toy should be immediately removed to prevent tragedies such as this one. It is not your fault that this happened, nor is it Gina's fault - that is not my reason for saying all of this. If even one person can learn to be extra cautious through this experience, then it will be a lesson well learned. Hopefully, a lot of people will learn from this.

So, what should be looked for during pouch/toy inspections? Loose threads, holes, "pills" of fleece (gliders have choked on them in the past, too), broken parts, rusty clasps... just to name a few of the things I look for every day in my pouches & toys.

Again, I'm very sorry for your loss...
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders

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#91801 - 03/31/06 07:41 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Srlb Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 10/30/03
Posts: 16733
Loc: St. Johns, Florida
I am also very sorry for your loss and sorry I was not online last night to post then.

It is devastating to loose a glider in any manner, and for that we send our prayers to you.

Did you contact Gina to let her know about this? I think if you did not, you should. She is going to be absolutely beside herself to hear this news as her heart is bigger than she is. Her care for gliders is so high and heartfelt I can not see her ever doing anything that she would even consider to be dangerous. I have many of Ginas items, each of them are remarkably made and you can tell a lot of time and love went into each product.

I am sorry your gliders decided to chew through the pouch, I am sorry you lost one, may your heart heal soon.
_________________________
Peggy
Critter Love
Critter LoveŽ Diet Center

If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.


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#91802 - 03/31/06 09:06 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


No, I have not contacted her as someone said she was away? I myself work at a very large quilting store and am a quilter so have had plenty of experience with batting and have heard of such stories ( choking ) with children. We sell certain battings that are made very differently so that they will not fall apart and these are used and recommended for kids quilts! Polyester batt. will separate with the first few washes and turn into fluffy stuffing but a good cotton batt. will not come apart for years! I think for me I will stick to the pouches that are made with double layers of fleece- no chance of an accident then. I just wish I had known what was in the pouch I would have been more careful!
I am so sorry for my poor Dawnie! She seems so lonely and doesn't want to play! Do gliders get depressed or "mourn"?

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#91803 - 03/31/06 09:17 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Yes, gliders absolutely do get depressed and they definitely mourn. During this time, you should spend as much time as you can with her. Carry her in a bonding pouch during the day, play with her a lot at night and keep a close eye on her. Watch for her to change her eating habits, changes in stool and especially for bald patches in her fur, especially around the tail. Getting her a new friend is a good idea.

If you have any further questions about glider depression, you should make a separate post so we can keep this one on topic because it's a good thread. I guess that new post could go in Behaviour and anatomy or in bonding and Relations, depending on whether your question involves more of the physical signs of depression or whether it is more about how to help your glider through the process of mourning her friend.

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#91804 - 03/31/06 09:43 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Dancing Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 22746
Loc: 80 acres of paradise in KS
I am so sorry for the loss of your little glider. It is a pain like no other both for you and for your little girl. She will need time to mourn too. Prayers that the needed mourning time for both of you is short and you will quickly move past the pain to where only good memories fill the space.

I know this is going to completely upset Gina. I know Gina very well and I can tell you, she will be devistated. She makes pouches and things because she wants to make sure all gliders have nice soft SAFE places to cuddle. Sadly we often learn the extremely hard way about different dangers to our gliders.

I had made some toys using these plastic garden wind spinner things. Very cool looking toys. I gave one to Peggy and as it turned out, the plastic they are made out of are toxic and it almost killed one of her little gliders. There was absolutely no way to know these were unsafe or toxic until it happened.

I have Gina's pouches in all my cages, all 15 of them, and have just ordered 20 more because of the confidence I have in her sewing abilities and the quality and the love she puts into each and every thing she makes.

Each person needs to decide if their items are safe (regardless of where they come from) before they use them. I don't think this tragedy was a foreseeable danger. I'm so sorry we had to learn the hard way...
_________________________
620-704-9109
Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.

I could have missed the pain
But I'd of had to miss the dance


The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.

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#91805 - 03/31/06 10:15 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Karin Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/06/01
Posts: 11583
Loc: Sycamore Illinois
First let me say I am so terribly sorry for the loss of your baby, and yes, glider's do mourn. Give the one lots of love and extra bonding time, and watch her carefully for any other signs of depression. Sometimes it will help to *show* the other glider the dead body, as they can then understand where their buddy has gone <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />.
Please contact Gina about this...she is a wonderful person and will be devastated this happened. She should be back home within a day or two, and I am sure she will get back to you right away.
A suggestion I give to those that have chewers and diggers. Try using an all denim pouch (not the fabric store denim, but an old pair of jeans type denim.) It really helps prolong the life of a pouch for the digger...now the chewer is a different story. You can try it with a chewer, but to be completely safe...I suggest an alternative such as a chin bathhouse with fleece blankets, etc. No fabric is really safe for a chewer to be honest.

Note: (Thank you Alicia)....I DO NOT USE BATTING in the cage pouches that I make, nor do I use the reg. fiberfill...what I use is completely different.)
Karin
_________________________
Miss Lily and Bud
Prada and Armani
Tessa, Deuce and Cami

Tira and Misu angel Deja and Vu

Glider Daydreams



"Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass...It is about learning to
dance in the rain!"

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#91806 - 03/31/06 01:11 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Lynsie Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 02/07/05
Posts: 8321
Loc: Quincy, IL 62305
Haha, sorry guys. I thought cotton batting was any kind of cotton filling. That's my bad.
_________________________
Lynsie,
LuckyYou Gliders


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#91807 - 03/31/06 10:19 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
myprideandjoys Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 03/05/06
Posts: 456
Loc: Eureka,Nv
This is the second post that I have read about a glider chewing thow thier pouch and dieing from it. Is there some ideas that we can all get together to come up with to hopefully stop this from happening. I mean just small things. I've thought about heat bond instead of thread. There has to be something we can do for these babies.
_________________________
wife to 1 understanding hubby
mom to 4 childern 5y-o,13y-o&15y-o and a 1 y-o
6 sugar babies Gizmo,Munchkin,Pepcy,Stinkbug,Egypt&Cairo all living in 1 cage now
and 3 dogs Cassie,Isis & Tiye

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#91808 - 03/31/06 11:27 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Karin Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/06/01
Posts: 11583
Loc: Sycamore Illinois
Unfortunately, if a glider is going to chew, it is going to chew through anything. Threads are not the issue with chewers. Those teeth can destroy if they want to. I highly suggest if you have a chewer, to not use a fabric pouch. There are nest boxes and chin bath houses as alternatives. If they are stinkers...and will only sleep in a pouch, check with you pouchmaker to see if they can help you with a pouch designed to meet your glider's needs.
Karin
_________________________
Miss Lily and Bud
Prada and Armani
Tessa, Deuce and Cami

Tira and Misu angel Deja and Vu

Glider Daydreams



"Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass...It is about learning to
dance in the rain!"

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#91809 - 04/01/06 08:39 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Aussieluvr -- So sorry for your loss. It is never easy to lose someone you love... and even harder when it was something so sudden and unexpected. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />

I have a glider who tears his pouches apart and I know that he does it. So I check his pouches twice a day..once in the morning and once a night before putting him back in his cage. I also know he is more likely to chew his pouches before getting up at night and I am in and out of the glider room during that time to see if I can catch him in the act and stop him. He onyl chews every couple of weeks, and I have yet to determine what sets him off, but I know to watch him and his pouches very carefully

But Karin's right. If you have a chewer, let the pouchmaker know so they can work with you and know what they are facing. Karin has been so sweet and has been working with me to find a pouch that Petrie won't chew....some have worked...some haven't <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shakehead.gif" alt="" /> .... RIght now we're trying a denim pouch. He's a spoiled little stinker and has refused to sleep in anything but a pouch thus far, but I am going to try one of Peggy's nestboxes to see if he'll take to that more than some of the other things.

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/offtopic.gif" alt="" /> Karin -- I got the pouches the other day and I haven't thanked you yet....but they are awesome! Especially the cuddle corner one. He already loves that one and so far it's standing up just fine with him! Thank you, thank you, thank you! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />

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#91810 - 04/01/06 09:24 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Dancing Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 22746
Loc: 80 acres of paradise in KS
There are round pouches also that have no seams in them at all (hidden or otherwise) except for around the top (where most gliders don't chew/dig at). For real diggers/chewers, denim seems to work well (with lots of fleece blankets for them to snuggle in). I use denim for my ferrets because they will dig and destroy anything else. If it can hold up to a ferret, it can hold up to gliders.
_________________________
620-704-9109
Judge not until you have walked in their shoes and lived their lives. What you see online is only part of the story.

I could have missed the pain
But I'd of had to miss the dance


The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears.

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#91811 - 04/01/06 09:48 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I am so very sorry for your loss. I didn't realise this could happen. It has taught me something and hopefully alot of other new owners will learn from your heartbreaking experience. Again I am very very sorry. Barb

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#91812 - 04/01/06 11:39 AM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I am also so terribly sorry about your baby! Something good is coming from your tragedy though. It is a reminder for all of us to be extra alert when it comes to checking our pouches and toys every single day!

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#91813 - 04/01/06 02:24 PM Re: Death by pouch... [Re: ]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm very sorry for your loss. That's heartbreaking!!

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