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#973916 - 07/12/10 06:29 PM Intact males...can they get along?
sugarlope Offline
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Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 19735
Loc: in my happy place
I have seen a few threads recently discussing intact males living together. We all have our opinions and experiences with this one, so what do you think?

Can intact males live together peacefully? Under what circumstance(s) is that possible, if any? Do you have experiences from either side you would like to share?
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#973922 - 07/12/10 06:37 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
wildlifeangel Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 1414
Loc: Minneapolis, MN
I believe that if there is not a female in the household, they may get along fine. I have sold twin males for pet-only to people who have no other gliders, and they have gotten along just fine as they grow.

Also, with the rescue that I did last year, there was a cage with two intact males and a female... and they didn't have issues at my home (both neutered while in my care). I think it might be a personality thing, if you have two dominant males, or a more submissive male it makes a difference.

Personally, as a breeder, I will never have intact males together other than twin joeys that leave together.
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#973987 - 07/12/10 08:28 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: wildlifeangel]
gliderfan97
Unregistered


I purchased my two un-neutered, and, to this date, they get along fine! They are two years old, and both really nice, and neither one seems to think he is the dominant one. If they ever fight, I do have another cage for temporary housing until they get neutered, but for now, they are fine.

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#974247 - 07/13/10 09:09 AM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: ]
buttercup
Unregistered


Jay & Silent Bob are both un-neutered (4 yrs old brothers). They get along pretty well actually. The only time I ever hear crabbing from them is when they are in their pouch...my guess is one is moving around, adjusting, etc and wakes the other one up. I have 2 pouches in their cage, but they've never slept apart.

They share the same food bowl, water bottle, etc.

Would I try and introduce 2 un-neutered males? Probably not. But J & B have been together since birth, will never be with a female (I took them in at 2 yrs old), and are very comfortable and happy with each other.



Edited by buttercup (07/13/10 08:48 PM)
Edit Reason: added glider ages

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#974705 - 07/13/10 08:22 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: ]
Feather Online   sleep
Administrator

Registered: 01/19/08
Posts: 12160
Loc: Wisconsin
I am going to say no, I took in a rescue over a year ago. He was intact and had been living with his twin who was also an intact male. His twin had died and they brought him to me. He had over groomed his tail, his scent glands were huge and crusty. I am sure that his poor environment attributed to some of this.

I took him in and had him neutered two weeks later I noticed hair growing on his tail. I introduced him to another neutered male here in the house and they got along great. Sadly he crossed over the Rainbow bridge about a year later.

I would not house two unaltered males together.
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#981367 - 07/26/10 12:02 AM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: Feather]
tlc_in_chitown Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 03/11/09
Posts: 243
Loc: Illinois
I think you have a better chance of sibblings getting along or those together from a very young age. I also think each gliders personality plays a huge part. I had twin brothers together until they were 11 months and they started fighting over who was going to be dominant. When they balled up, after one brother grabbed his brothers ears and rubbed his scent gland (head) under the other ones chin, I knew it was time to intervene. I had a trio of boys together (twin males and another male of same age) until they 8-9 months OOP and things got chippy with one trying to dominate the other two. All of the above eventually were happily introduced to their girlies (some were neutered) and are no longer together. Someone adopted a pair of twin males from me and they are still together unaltered at over a year and half. These two had a very mellow and laid back personality. I made sure they understood that this could change at any time and what to watch for. I think once a male has been in a breeding situation, it changes them and would never try to intro older intact males. Anyone have any long timers living peacefully besides silent bob (love the name, lol)?

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#988777 - 08/09/10 01:50 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: tlc_in_chitown]
Briarthorn
Unregistered


I had two intact male gliders that after fives years I still could not put together. One would always try to dominate the other. I wonder if only intact males who've grow together can get along.

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#988805 - 08/09/10 03:34 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: ]
Sherri Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 11/02/06
Posts: 3826
Loc: Big Sandy TN
I have a father son pair that are both still intact and they get along great. They are in the same room as my other cages that do have females in them.

I personally would never have 2 intact males together especially housed with another female. But these 2 were father and son and the female had passed prior to me getting them. Now if the time comes that they start showing dominance behavior over the other than I will be getting them neutered.
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#988812 - 08/09/10 03:57 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: Sherri]
suggiemom1980 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 03/05/07
Posts: 13746
Loc: Vincennes, IN, USA
I had two brothers who were not neutered and they got along good for the first few months. Then the more dominant male started taking over the food, toys, wheel, etc. Had him neutered and they get along great now, with the more submissive male not neutered.

I had a father and son who were both neutered. I had to separate them when the son was about a yr old because the dad would attack him, when the mom was in heat.

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#1038810 - 12/10/10 12:45 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
jesse
Unregistered


we have four males all un-neutered none of them are twins or brothers and they all get along great! to boot they also have a female living amongst them and they all seem to be fine. I wondered if there was a alpha amongst them but they seem to be all socially on the same level

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#1039487 - 12/11/10 08:02 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
ssdreamsicles Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 05/10/07
Posts: 1871
Loc: kentucky
I think 2 males in one cage WITHOUT another female may get along. Just like with any critter u have some that will and some that will not. Now i do not think having a female in the mix is a good idea at all. Diff probs can happen. How do you know who bred her? You will never know this and can not give a proper linage on those joeys which can lead to inbreeding. Both males will try to breed her causing her way to much stress. Then u have fighting. This is bad and will happen at some point no matter how much they get along. If u want to keep the gliders in the same cage just neuter the non breeding males. There are many people who have had reverse trios with a neutered male work out. My Esme was from a colony of 5 with only 1 intact male and they do well.

Jesse,

I would highly recommend that you take the female out of the cage or get the males neutered. I do not mean to preach but if you have read my post about the pair i had brought to me in pretty bad shape. This little boy ended up having to have surgery to remove his eye and tear duct. Keeping more then one intact male in a cage with a female is a very bad idea. Not only do you risk fights but she is going to be over bred and not to mention u have no clue who the father would be to any joeys. This leads to inbreeding. I cant stress enough on getting at least 3 of the males neutered. I only want to save those gliders from what this pair just went thru.
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#1039499 - 12/11/10 08:14 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
Glide_Bye_Lily Offline
Glider Guardian

Registered: 04/21/09
Posts: 1268
Loc: WI
My friend has two intact males together. Not related in any way. They are her only gliders. They get along perfectly!
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#1039536 - 12/11/10 09:46 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
ssdreamsicles Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 05/10/07
Posts: 1871
Loc: kentucky
This is my thred i have going. This is what can happen if you have 2 intact males in with a female.
http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/..._pi#Post1036839
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#1039545 - 12/11/10 10:00 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
ssdreamsicles Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 05/10/07
Posts: 1871
Loc: kentucky



This is what can happen when more then one intact male is in a cage with a female.
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#1039552 - 12/11/10 10:14 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: ]
GliderNursery Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Registered: 09/14/07
Posts: 20049
Loc: North Central Ohio
Originally Posted By: jesse
we have four males all un-neutered none of them are twins or brothers and they all get along great! to boot they also have a female living amongst them and they all seem to be fine. I wondered if there was a alpha amongst them but they seem to be all socially on the same level


This is definitely NOT a good idea. I would neuter the males, or remove the female to prevent problems even though it seems you've been pretty lucky so far. This is not a chance I would ever consider taking. As Melissa noted, the breeding of this female alone is a huge problem. And I would hate that at any moment, they start fighting over the female. I couldn't imagine having to care for a glider like what is pictured above!

That is so sad, and completely preventable!!

My opinion is intact males can live together peacefully as long as there is no female with them. However, if they ever start to show dominance problems, I would have them neutered.
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#1039560 - 12/11/10 10:38 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
chattrbabe Offline
Glider Addict

Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 4108
Loc: Phoenix AZ
Originally Posted By: sugarlope
I have seen a few threads recently discussing intact males living together. We all have our opinions and experiences with this one, so what do you think?

Can intact males live together peacefully? Under what circumstance(s) is that possible, if any? Do you have experiences from either side you would like to share?



Doodle and Boomer were intact for a very long time. With females in the house and joeys, other gliders next door, they did just fine together. They are now pomless and the only issue I ever really have (now as a quad) is Doodle will poop in the food and juice dishes... shakehead roflmao


Edited by chattrbabe (12/11/10 10:39 PM)

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#1039688 - 12/12/10 11:35 AM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
Bozeman Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 08/04/09
Posts: 2346
Loc: South Africa
Also read my note on having more than one intact male housed together when there is a female glider around here.
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#1039699 - 12/12/10 11:52 AM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
oakley Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 07/22/05
Posts: 2305
Loc: Florida, USA
I'd like to say that I agree with a few others on this point. The only way for two intact males to get along is if there is no female in the equation. Even then, brothers would be your best bet.

I would NOT suggest having two intact males anywhere near a female, and of course, there's always the exception that makes the rule. But please be careful. I've even known some intact male/neutered male/female trios that have gone wrong.
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#1039741 - 12/12/10 01:35 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
Lisa21F Offline
Glider Explorer

Registered: 08/25/10
Posts: 192
Loc: Northern, NJ
This is kind of "on" topic but with a twist lol!

I have a 8 month old neutered male & a 4month old intact male that I will be doing intros with soon.

I was hoping that because one of them is neutered that everything will be fine & I will not need to go thru the expense & stress (mine) of neutering my new guy.

What are your thoughts/opinions?
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#1039756 - 12/12/10 02:23 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
oakley Offline
Glider Slave

Registered: 07/22/05
Posts: 2305
Loc: Florida, USA
I think your best bet is to get the other male neutered as well. I wouldn't be worried if they were brothers and had been together their entire lives, but since they don't know each other, you might run into aggression issues with the intact male. Of course, you can always start the intro process (swapping pouches etc) and see how it goes, but getting the intact male neutered would be safer.
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#1042610 - 12/17/10 12:47 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
SariYappa Offline
Serious Glideritis

Registered: 05/11/08
Posts: 5997
Loc: Upstate, SC
My experience:

Sugar & Nibbles (both males) are my first gliders, and they were rescues. They lived together for at least a year before they got to me intact, and they lived with me after they got here, intact, for at least another year. Never had a problem.

Now when I did get them neutered, it wasn't until well after that, that I introduced my little girl Destiny into the picture. They are a happy trio. smile

(Lisa: I would have your second guy neutered, and it will cut down on the marking and the smell immensely thumb )
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#1049499 - 01/02/11 01:44 AM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
StarlightGliders
Unregistered


I brought in a rescue group of 11 gliders, 7 intact males and 4 females, all breeding age that all got along just fine. Because I never knew if they could have been related or not, the males were all neutered and they all found a home together (luckily!). Aside from this, I have had several males (all intact) live together with several females like a natural colony. Part of the success of this situation is due to the size of thier cage and availability of space to get away from one another I believe, but they always all slept together, ate together, and I've never had any issues what so ever. The down side to this, is that if there are joeys that come out of this group you'll never truly know who dad is (and sometimes mom I've heard, as one mom could have a joey and steal anothers and raise it as her own). So, from that perspective, multiple males in with females is not a good idea. But, multiple intact males as pets only works sometimes. I really believe it is a personality thing too. You may have a couple of boys that do fine together, and then you could have boys that get along for a while and then have issues, or ones that never get along. Better safe than sorry I'd say... neuter them.



Edit: I have heard of several people who have a neutered male in with a breeding pair that act as a 'nanny' to the joeys though. I personally don't see a problem with having a neutered male in with the breeding pair.


Edited by StarlightGliders (01/02/11 01:45 AM)
Edit Reason: Added *** line

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#1049529 - 01/02/11 05:58 AM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
Beezer
Unregistered


I've had two males together with no problems - now I only have Kiki - Junior passed n I really don't want another glider - so Kiki will be my last

Sue owned by

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#1050348 - 01/03/11 09:23 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
tlkngfethrs1 Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 10/15/08
Posts: 325
Loc: Fort Wayne, Indiana
I have two un neutered brothers living together, with several females living in the same room (separate cages)
and all is good.. I am however going to have one boy neutered as soon as I find a mate for the oldest brother.. to act as a "nanny" and the only reason I am going to do this is the family they came from, that was how they were raised..
they came from a colony of many.. mom, dad and other siblings and I think an uncle.
so this is what they both know.. and if any issues come up, I do have a plan B.
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#1059890 - 01/24/11 08:44 AM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: ssdreamsicles]
MJ111
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: ssdreamsicles
This is my thred i have going. This is what can happen if you have 2 intact males in with a female.
http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/..._pi#Post1036839


As per this thread, it described two intact males (father and son) and a female in the same cage and the consequences . . .

Can someone please answer this question for me:

At what age should the male offspring be seperated from the father and mother so this type of behavior does not happen?
I had read on this board that males reach sexual maturity at around 3-4 months OOP.

Thanks in advance.


Edited by MJ111 (01/24/11 08:45 AM)

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#1060177 - 01/24/11 07:47 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
JeremyandLexie Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 09/13/10
Posts: 350
Loc: New Hampshire
I have been told 12 weeks....

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#1060206 - 01/24/11 08:35 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: JeremyandLexie]
MJ111
Unregistered


Thanks for the info

I'm going to start a new thread because I have alot of other questions about seperating babies from their parents.

Thanks again. smile

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#1060541 - 01/25/11 02:17 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: ]
MJ111
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: MJ111
Thanks for the info

I'm going to start a new thread because I have alot of other questions about seperating babies from their parents.


http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/..._fr#Post1060539

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#1060544 - 01/25/11 02:20 PM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
Charlotteb
Unregistered


I had a piar that had a boy joey then had a female joey. not long after the female joey came out of the pouch I had to seperate the babies from mom and dad. mom and dad were not letting the babies eat and they lost weight. but after I seperated them the babies were fine and gained the weight back.

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#1151088 - 07/25/11 02:20 AM Re: Intact males...can they get along? [Re: sugarlope]
eshaw Offline
Glider Lover

Registered: 02/11/11
Posts: 593
Loc: Iowa
I know there are a lot of folks that are against this practice. Some will have a dire outcome while others get along just great. I think it all boils down to size, relationship and personalities. Sometimes it can work out, other times you're asking for heartache.

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