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Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420072
04/14/19 10:37 PM
04/14/19 10:37 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Hutch Offline OP
Glider Slave
Hutch  Offline OP
Glider Slave

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
My little (ahems) had still been bickering quite a bit lately... again! Since moving here, whenever I think they've gotten past whatever their issue is, it picks back up. I'm confident it is Arthur + whomever he's irritated at the moment, but they've become much better about stopping & looking innocent by the time I've made it to the cage.

It concerns me as I worry about it going beyond bickering & noise, but I'm not sure what to do about it. The last vet visit didn't find a problem with any of them. I've thought about separating Arthur for a longer period than just overnight, but they all act distressed when I take him out for more than a few hours.

Since Arthur still hisses when doing his business, the vet offered to try different antibiotics than we've used in the past for a little longer time period, even though the tests don't really show an infection. As he put it 'something is causing the hissing' and maybe that is making him such an, umm.... let's go with jerk.

I don't know at this point. I'd hate for both of us to go through the process of dosing him for two full weeks if it does nothing besides make both of us miserable.


- Hutch

:plat: Arthur :wfb: Gwynevere :bb: Merlin :grey: Morgana

The epic saga begins here!
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Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420075
04/15/19 09:06 AM
04/15/19 09:06 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
Ladymagyver Offline
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Ladymagyver  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
Have you tried diluted cranapple juice yet?


Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Be patient,
and
Trust your journey....




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

Stewie :rtmo:
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420083
04/15/19 05:43 PM
04/15/19 05:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,316
Wisconsin
Feather Offline
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Feather  Offline
Administrator

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,316
Wisconsin
Ask your veterinarian about the Covenia injection. It is a long acting antibiotic. Then he will only be [censored] off for one day.


Kimberley
Feathers-Sweetie, Sklyar Blue, Mister Peanut, Big Mack & Ibo
Fur-Guinan, Mr. Spock, T'Mir, Micheal, Stevie, Cho & Maharet :bb: T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon :wfb: TY, TJ, Khayman & T'Pring :rtmo: O'Ryan :leu:
Forever in my heart, Gizmo, Tucker and the rest of my babies over the :rbridge:

Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420142
04/21/19 10:12 PM
04/21/19 10:12 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Hutch Offline OP
Glider Slave
Hutch  Offline OP
Glider Slave

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Spoiler: Arthur has become food-aggressive.

It took me a while to figure that out. I've heard frequent bickering mid-evening, which is after they've been up & about for a while. Many of the other fuzzbutts have already been nibbling their way through dinner by the time it picked up. I've been so busy with homework +housework +yardword... lots of 'work' hehe... that I wasn't able to just drop what I was doing. So, by the time I did look, they were no longer bickering. There have also been several times when I've NOT put the dish down before they wake (for whatever reason that night) & they've all face-dived into the dish together without complaint.

This evening I was determined to find out what's been going on since late winter. They followed their normal routine of waking, messing, a little wheel, then seeing what has been served tonight. The last few steps get repeated quite a bit. Eventually, Arthur worked his way down, ate some while others still nibbled away, then stood back hissing & eyeballing everyone else. Then it happened: he started jumping at the any of the others that came near the bottom of the cage, chasing them away, & crabbing the whole time. Yelled at him & he retreated to a corner, grabbing a bite of food as he hopped by. With a sinking feeling, I sat back to watch again. About 15 minutes later, Arthur resumed his post, tail twitching & mouth a-hissin', eyeballing his cagemates again. Once one came near, he went after them AGAIN.

This time I removed him. He's in the spare cage, with their second wheel, a little more of the dinner, & a bottle of water. Of course, I'm also frustrated at this new behavior. I'm kinda hoping it's medical (I'm going to talk to the vet about a Covenia injection as you suggested Kimberley) since that would be an easier 'fix' than undoing whatever caused this behavioral change.

I'm also debating on how long to leave Arthur separated. I think tonight he'll remain all on his own & maybe return him to the others after EVERYONE has had a chance to eat. Him coming out out the pouch only when he feels like it makes it hard to try & feed him separately; well, short of pulling him from the pouch when I go to feed them, anyways.

As crazy as everything has been, I feel like I've been neglecting them (playtime wise). I can't help but wonder if this is a sign of that, maybe Arthur being frustrated & venting. Then again, it has been a long time since seemed into our playtime. I don't know. Like I said, frustrated with this latest development.

Thoughts, suggestions, opinions are always welcomed. Glider prozac would not be refused tounge


- Hutch

:plat: Arthur :wfb: Gwynevere :bb: Merlin :grey: Morgana

The epic saga begins here!
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420150
04/22/19 07:36 AM
04/22/19 07:36 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
Ladymagyver Offline
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Ladymagyver  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
This is my least favorite issue... Since I am dealing with this too...

I know time out from the colony helps. Just watch Arthur for stress. It has to be at least a couple of days... If I had a 3rd adequate cage and wheel, I'd do this for a week...

I would like to come up with a feeding station device where each glider has their own locked door and their own combination lock... Once they go in and eat in peace, they can exit and play with their mates... wouldn't that be awesome?!?!? Lol! Ok, back to the real world...

Dot must visit all the dishes and find the choice foods first. And we go through this at least two or three different times a night after their nap. This makes me want to pull my hair out! Lol!

If I'm watching them eat, all is good. It's when I walk away things go a bit haywire... It does help when Dot is separated. I haven't done it for longer than 3 days. She has Stewie trained to just get out of her way... When Fiona was part of the mix, she waits in the pouch till Dot goes back to bed and is asleep, and then she sneaks out to eat. She's been conditioned to do this for so long, she still does it now... So, I'm not much help... Sorry...


Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Be patient,
and
Trust your journey....




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

Stewie :rtmo:
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420169
04/22/19 06:58 PM
04/22/19 06:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,316
Wisconsin
Feather Offline
Administrator
Feather  Offline
Administrator

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,316
Wisconsin
Hutch,

A simple fix for this would to give them at least three feeding stations located around the cage. He can't guard them all. Put them on different levels if you can.


Kimberley
Feathers-Sweetie, Sklyar Blue, Mister Peanut, Big Mack & Ibo
Fur-Guinan, Mr. Spock, T'Mir, Micheal, Stevie, Cho & Maharet :bb: T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon :wfb: TY, TJ, Khayman & T'Pring :rtmo: O'Ryan :leu:
Forever in my heart, Gizmo, Tucker and the rest of my babies over the :rbridge:

Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420171
04/22/19 11:32 PM
04/22/19 11:32 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Hutch Offline OP
Glider Slave
Hutch  Offline OP
Glider Slave

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
I left Arthur on his own all night. In the morning before heading to work, I took him back out of the travel cage & returned him to the main cage to sleep with the colony. He accepted me taking him out of the pouch with no fuss & very little resistance, so I'm guessing he was quite lonely. After a quick sniff all around, the colony went inside the pouch together to sleep away the day.

They had to wait for me to prepare their dinner. I was out in the garage until the sun was almost down (getting too dark to work). Had to move some packages in & do a quick wash-up. They were all up when I retrieved their dishes & Morgana leaped aboard for the ride. Sliced up an apple, placed in the cage, provided the tag-a-long with a treat before returning her, then laundry... all with an ear for the cage.

Nothing. More laundry, restocked refrigerator, & still nothing. A little homework... still peaceful.

Until just about 30 minutes ago. By the time I get to the cage, I can't see what was going on. Twice now & in spite of placing their dishes as far apart as I could. I'll listen a bit longer & if it occurs again, I'll separate him for another full night.


Dawn, I've been following your posts about Dot's food aggression. Part of what me concerned is that is hasn't been going on long; this is new behavior. Still, I saw an uncomfortable amount of similarities with your most recent problems & it has me wondering with there is an exterior reason versus yet another veterinary visit. Mind you, I still plan on getting Arthur seen (again), but I can't help but wonder frown


Kimberley, I'll look at adding a third. I'm frustrated since I've never needed this before. I frequently use two, but it isn't uncommon for me to use only one & I've never hard this issue. I'll have to break-out the side-hooks to hang them on different levels. Four levels, I guess, since the dry food is already on another level.


- Hutch

:plat: Arthur :wfb: Gwynevere :bb: Merlin :grey: Morgana

The epic saga begins here!
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420174
04/23/19 06:35 AM
04/23/19 06:35 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
Ladymagyver Offline
Moderator
Ladymagyver  Offline
Moderator

Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
When I have a moment today for research, I'm digging into the archives. If you remember Terry, she had Lulu, Skadoosh and Ollie. They had food aggression issues too. She ended up concealing each dish (3) from view of the other dishes. I believe it was Ollie who had issues with the other two. He also had an issue with the floor of the cage. It and all the toys on it were his.

Then I think he mellowed out about the floor....

Since Fiona is out of the big cage picture, Dot and Stewie still struggle with food aggression, just in a different way. As long as I'm present, all it well. Stewie can sit right next to her and eat. Dot will move to another dish and Stewie will follow, but keep his distance. When she's had enough, and goes back to her dish, he'll start in on his dish. I leave the room, and the bickering starts. But it's quick. I have yet to purchase a camera to observe what happens when I'm out of the room.... I'm still not sure of the most reasonable priced version with night vision. But I will have to get one soon.


Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Be patient,
and
Trust your journey....




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

Stewie :rtmo:
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420184
04/23/19 11:56 PM
04/23/19 11:56 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Hutch Offline OP
Glider Slave
Hutch  Offline OP
Glider Slave

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Dawn, they make inexpensive baby monitors (night-cam-types) that should meet your needs. My sister has one that wasn't much (I forget, but low enough I was impressed) that provided a good enough picture you should be able to watch gliders... well, being gliders. Or being little !!!!s. Such as Arthur.

About 30min after I hear the wheel start to thump go (& go & go & go), I hear the loud crabbing. When I look, Gwyn is in the wheel (no longer spinning) looking very still, Merlin is in the top corner looking down, & Morgana is 3/4 up the wall also looking down. Arthur is on the bottom, centered between three dishes, & eyeballing the other three. Yup, out he came & into the travel cage. Pulled some food to leave in the cage with him, moved the spare water bottle back, & he'll spend the night alone again.

I still think I'll return in him the morning to keep the colony huddled together during the day. The way they all act, when I return him before heading to work, makes me -believe- they're all happier that way. I do keep the cages close enough they can see & hear each other. I don't know if that helps, hurts, or is indifferent :-/

Hindsight being what it is, I should've made more effort to figure out what was going on or to catch them at it when I was noticing all the extra bickering. Still, even knowing about it, I feel my options are limited. Still looking for my cage hooks for their dishes that I used in my older cages (pretty sure I kept them) & am looking at other ways to reorganize their cage. Maybe create more blind spots between the dishes like Dawn was talking about.


- Hutch

:plat: Arthur :wfb: Gwynevere :bb: Merlin :grey: Morgana

The epic saga begins here!
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420186
04/24/19 08:56 AM
04/24/19 08:56 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
Ladymagyver Offline
Moderator
Ladymagyver  Offline
Moderator

Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
I did find one of the posts I was looking for:

http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/1385290/Searchpage/2/Main/140888/Words/%2BFood+%2Baggression/Search/true/re-the-ollie-lulu-skadoosh-diaries#Post1385290

When you search food aggression, I came up with about 18 pages listing posts and replies.

This one has pics that may help.

I'm comming to the conclusion I may need a bigger (taller) cage. I've been holding out till Stewie turned a year old. But he can still cover the entire cage, run on both the wheel and the treadmill, in less than 7.5 seconds... Then he'll do it again...

I do plan on reading through more food aggression posts to see what other suggestions, issues have been covered...


Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Be patient,
and
Trust your journey....




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

Stewie :rtmo:
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420188
04/25/19 02:10 AM
04/25/19 02:10 AM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Hutch Offline OP
Glider Slave
Hutch  Offline OP
Glider Slave

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Tonight Arthur was fine with the food dishes. Instead, he became protective of the pouch. Like, he wanted it all to himself. So, I let him have it... all to himself in his own cage. This is becoming so beyond frustrating, but it again leads me to believe it is internal, not a response to something external.

While I was moving him, each of the other three decided it would be a great time to go explore. Greedy Morgana was the easiest to gather since she went straight for where I store the treats. Gwyn was next, wishing to play follow the glider into the bedrooms before getting cornered. Once I offered my hand, she jumped up & went for my shoulder. I returned them to the cage before going after Merlin since I was confident as to how he would react.

I carefully placed a hand to each side of him where he'd stopped to watch me. Sure enough, after looking left then right, his anxiety seizures kicked in a couple of seconds later. A few violent twitches then he locked up. I scooped him up carefully (luckily he didn't have a death-grip on the carpet this time), put some treats under his head for once he recovered, then took Merlin to the bedroom with me. I sat there holding & petting him until he recovered. Then he ate the treats & I returned him.

It has been quieter since all that hurly-burly. I would like to put Arthur back in with them, but I'm trying to send a message. There is also a part of me that also feels I'm being unfair if he's sick or hurting (which is why I let him rejoin the colony in the morning), but I cannot/will not allow him to bully the other gliders.

--------------------------------------

I don't feel it is an emergency & have 'work/life' to deal with, so earliest appoint is early-mid-ish May. Any of you who have gone through this feel that is too long of a time? I may have to burn some leave time & juggle a buch of hot items to have him seem sooner (while appointments last...)


- Hutch

:plat: Arthur :wfb: Gwynevere :bb: Merlin :grey: Morgana

The epic saga begins here!
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420189
04/25/19 12:23 PM
04/25/19 12:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 71
DFW, TX
X
Xeno Offline
Out of Pouch
Xeno  Offline
Out of Pouch
X

Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 71
DFW, TX
Do they not have a spare pouch? I keep two or three in my cage. While 90% of the time the gliders all sleep together in one occasionally one goes off to be alone or they split up into two groups of two to sleep.


Dobby :grey: Elric :wfb: Arwen :plat: Eilonwy :leu:
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420194
04/25/19 06:32 PM
04/25/19 06:32 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Hutch Offline OP
Glider Slave
Hutch  Offline OP
Glider Slave

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
They always have two or three sleeping pouches. My spoiled furballs are never shorted when it comes to options. One occasionally does splinter off to be on their own, but it is rare. They really like to choose a favorite & use it until I take it away. They've become very bad about switching to clean ones when I put them in, the lazy squatting buggers. They just don't want to move their 'stash.'

So, between being the current 'favorite' & where Arthur was, Morgana & Merlin were trying to join him (& not getting the message he was inappropriately trying to deliver). He even crabbed when I talked at them while seeing what was going on. Especially when he heard his name. He was being even worse than Merlin without his evening coffee.


- Hutch

:plat: Arthur :wfb: Gwynevere :bb: Merlin :grey: Morgana

The epic saga begins here!
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420202
04/28/19 12:50 AM
04/28/19 12:50 AM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Hutch Offline OP
Glider Slave
Hutch  Offline OP
Glider Slave

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
It has suddenly been quieter the last couple of nights; makes me very suspicious... Maybe the separations have helped, but I'm not going to hold my breath.


- Hutch

:plat: Arthur :wfb: Gwynevere :bb: Merlin :grey: Morgana

The epic saga begins here!
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420206
04/28/19 09:20 AM
04/28/19 09:20 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
Ladymagyver Offline
Moderator
Ladymagyver  Offline
Moderator

Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 3,541
SW Missouri
Yeah, I call it getting reaquainted. Figuring out where he fits in to the colony.

I did buy a wyse pancam (Amazon $36). I have it temporarily set up on a barstool in the bedroom. It's new to them and when it turns or I pan in on them it makes a noise a slight noise. It gets their attention. One morning I was having coffee and I heard Stewie barking. So I turned it on via an app on my phone and started talking to him. He quieted down, and went to bed with Dot. It may have creeped him out. Since setting up the camera, I haven't had any issues with them squabbling... I have yet to get an SD card so I can record... It's one of those things that is on my list, but don't read. shakehead. And, Walmarts photolab is in the front of the store and not near electronics, so in my rounds of shopping around, by the time I get to the front, I just head to a checkout line and want to get out of there... Next time, I'll pick it up on my way in! Lol!!! rofl


Dawn

https://www.facebook.com/uptilldawngliders/

Be patient,
and
Trust your journey....




Fiona :grey:
Dot :grey:

Stewie :rtmo:
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420212
04/28/19 12:02 PM
04/28/19 12:02 PM
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 71
DFW, TX
X
Xeno Offline
Out of Pouch
Xeno  Offline
Out of Pouch
X

Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 71
DFW, TX
Must be going around. Dobby has been crabbing a lot while in the pouch or house. Any time one of the other gliders crawls on the outside or makes noise he starts crabbing but is fine once they crawl in with him. Not sure what is up with him. He has been distant during playtime too. Not upset or angry, just aloof. Might just be a phase. He is still young.


Dobby :grey: Elric :wfb: Arwen :plat: Eilonwy :leu:
Re: Gliders of the Round Table 9 [Re: Hutch] #1420216
04/28/19 07:59 PM
04/28/19 07:59 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
Hutch Offline OP
Glider Slave
Hutch  Offline OP
Glider Slave

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,378
Belleville, IL
I believe Jupiter has been showing well in the sky the last month... maybe it has a negative affect on Sugar Gliders? Ha!

Just kidding... well, mostly o.0


- Hutch

:plat: Arthur :wfb: Gwynevere :bb: Merlin :grey: Morgana

The epic saga begins here!
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