OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP

Posted By: SugarBlossoms

OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 01:29 AM

Lady has 2 girls OOP today!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Both mommy and daddy have been out playing for well over an hour now! No one is in the pouch watching for them. They aren't crying but isn't ONE of the parents supposed to be in the pouch with the babies????! I'm SO worried! Thanks!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 01:39 AM

When my Alistair and Amy's joeys came OOP, they left the joeys in the pouch alone for hours at a time (they were their first joeys, and Amy was quite young). I was really concerned too, but the babies are over 4 weeks OOP and are doing fine. Alistair actually stays in the pouch with the babies more now that they're older than he did when they were younger!

I'm not saying you shouldn't be concerned at all, but don't be TOO terrified. Watch the babies for signs of rejection - not gaining weight, bite marks on the nose, climbing to the top of the pouch, etc. But JUST because the parents are not with them every second doesn't mean they're being rejected.

Good luck with the little ones!!!
Posted By: SugarBlossoms

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 01:55 AM

Thanks <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> This is new to me and soooo so scary! She runs and checks on them everytime they make a sound which is ALOT but doesn't go inside the pouch often. She's playing in the wheel and daddy is running all over. LOL
Posted By: krysKritters

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 02:00 AM

My pair has (their 2nd set of) twins that were OOP 5/26 and they have been leaving the babies alone for a few hours here and there. They keep a close eye on the pouch when they are out and come running in the joeys make any noise. I don't think it is cause for concern. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" />

Like Kristy said- watch for signs of rejection, <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/agree.gif" alt="" /> but I am sure every mom and dad need a little time to themselves. Good Luck! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: SugarBlossoms

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 06:31 AM

We lost the first little girl <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> We checked on them and all were in the pouch but only one was eating. Joy was on the other side of the pouch "asleep". I can't believe how much this is hurting, she's buried next to the Iris's under a tree. After waiting all this time and so much Joy, to have this happen is too much heartbreak. I could never be a breeder.

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 12:30 PM

[:"#666666"] Mae <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />,
I'm so sorry for the loss of your little girl <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />
You are such a wonderful Suggie mom...and I know how much you love them <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/upset.gif" alt="" />
I'm with you on not being able to be a breeder...parting with them would be hard enough...& I give all the good breeders their props for being able to do it...'cause without them, alot of us would not be able to ever experience having any <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />
Best of luck with them...and I'll be praying for you and the well being of your little ones! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 12:37 PM

I'm so sorry you lost your little girl. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Maybe mom only had enough milk for one, but I can't imagine how much you must be hurting! I know the anticipation that comes with waiting for these little ones, so losing them must be so hard. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />

Just be sure to watch your other little girl closely - hopefully she'll grow up strong & healthy!
Posted By: sugarglidersuz

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 12:41 PM

[:"green"]I'm so sorry that little Joy passed away <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />. Keep a close eye on the surviving joey to make sure that it gets enough to eat & stays warm enough. The problem with the parents leaving the joeys completely alone is that they get too cold. You will need to keep extra blankies in the pouch for such times. Also, if the parents leave the joey alone for more than 10-15 minutes, take it out & make sure it is still warm. If not, warm a blankie up (heat in the microwave for 15-20 seconds and don't get too hot), then wrap the joey in it to get it warm. Once warm, place the joey back with the parents. Place it directly on the father's back so he will carry it back to the nest & take care of it. You may need to do this a few times for him to get the idea that he's supposed to take care of the joey while Mom's out having her R&R...
Please keep us posted on how the other little one does...
Posted By: minkasmom

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 12:46 PM

I'm so sorry for your loss!

Do keep an eye on the little one you have & make sure that mom is nursing every 2-3 hours. You may have to go so far as to keep mom "confined" in a bonding pouch so she'll be FORCED to nurse the baby OR even supplement mom's feedings yourself. I've been blessed several times over with babies and have never had to do this myself, but this is what you may need to do. It's entirely possible mom doesn't have enough milk.....there are many on the board who've been there, and I hope one of them will see this post & help you out.

I know all too well the sorrow of losing a suggie. I have 2 special flowers in my back yard next to where Tinkerbell & Wendy Darling were laid to rest. Only time can heal that wound, but their memories live deep in my heart.

You'll be in my prayers.
Posted By: SugarBlossoms

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 06:44 PM

Thank you everyone so much. We lost the other little girl today. It seems mommy didn't know how to take care of them or something. They're back together again in glider heaven. We're hurting so bad right now it's unreal. We're feeling a heavy loss, nothing seems right without the "twins". <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I know it's not their fault but I feel upset at everything right now including them. (mommy and daddy) I wish there was a language between us and them to understand so we could help them better. Both little girls came OOP yesterday so beautiful and lively, full of energy and now both are gone. It doesn't make sense and it's not fair. Sorry for sounding whiney, I wouldn't wish this kind of pain on anyone. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: krysKritters

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/03/06 06:57 PM

I am sooooo sorry for your loss. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/gliderangel.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/04/06 01:28 AM

Oh, I'm so sorry about your loss. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Chrissy

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/04/06 02:05 AM

I am so sad for you and your babies <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
BIG <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/04/06 06:42 PM

I know this isnt much help, all of us sending our condlances out to you. We just had a joey a couple weeks ago and I love her so much...I cant believe it. I had a couple people who wanted her, but I dont think I could let her go. Are you planning on having another joey, or getting another little girl? I know it wont replace what you lost. I am soo sorry. If I can help in any way, please let me know. Gina (SugarsMama)
Posted By: Sheila

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/06/06 08:31 PM

I gave her some advice by email which I wanted to share which might be helpful to others in the future.
I make decisions and then kick myself afterwards, wishing I had gone ahead and pulled, subqued or whatever. Each time I learn and each time it is different. First of all how old is Lady?
Usually diet is not the issue as much as stress. I have seen two year old gliders, not reject, but get bald above the eyebrow when having babies and nursing. Normally, if you lose, one, you will lose the second. It is more than likely that there is nothing wrong with the baby, the mom is not producing the milk, usually do to stress. I have a Leu het that rejected her first 5 joeys when they were just 3-5 days in the pouch. I put a cage cover on her cage and put it at the end of the glider room. She had three single babies with no problems. The next set she had were one Leu and one het (first time she had three). She lost both of them. Now I am thinking is everytime she has two will she lose them. She didn't lose them until they were 8 days old. Normal rejections are between day three and five or at least signs of the rejection. The first sign of rejection is that both parents leave the joey to go out and play before they are a week old. A joey cannot maintain its body temperature before then because there is not enough fur. Within 5 min a joey can get cold and when the mother returns, it is too cold to eat. If you see this, then you know that it might happen. The second sign is a baby crying in the pouch and parents not going back to check on it. At that point, supplement the baby every 1.5 hours if it is less than a week old. After two days of doing this, you might be able feed every 2.5 hours. Sometimes the baby will continue sucking and increase the milk production because the sucking is still strong with you supplementing. Gradually the milk production increases and you can go every three hours and mom does the rest. If she re-breeds, in 16 days she will start producing a whole set of milk again for the new joey and sometimes at that point, she is relaxed enough to feed the first one that you are supplementing. At that point, you can taper off your feedings and let mom take over, but that point is a gradual tapering. The reason mom feeds at that point is because the baby is feeding every three hours at that point instead of round the clock sucking and she is not as stressed. I have seen this happen twice within the last year and it is awesome. A marsupial produces more than one kind of milk and a neonate requires a different type than a three to four week old oop joey. A mom can actually produce different types of milk at one time depending on the joeys she is feeding. Feeding the joey for the first few days is grueling, but worth it. I really like my method of handfeeding because it only takes 8 min to feed a joey. That 8 min includes fixing the food. A joey can be supplemented or totally fed on marsupial milk without anything else. I use to feed the baby BML, but only feed it around the fifth week now as the milk is sufficient and alot easier for them to digest and quicker to feed. I am sorry that you lost her joeys. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/06/06 10:19 PM

im sorry of ur loss im know now im lucky i caught my joey early enough she is fine and being hand rased but if i caught it any later i would of lost her.. wish u a bunch of luck if u decide to have more joeys and hope they turn out fine
Posted By: SugarBlossoms

Re: OOP Today/No Parents in pouch! HELP - 06/06/06 10:37 PM

Thank you everyone. It means so much to know other people care. I decided to let her have another and take Sheila's advice on about what to do. Both gliders have been grieving terribly and just got back together this morning. If we lose the next ones, we will get daddy neutered for sure. Once was too much already. (((HUGS))) to everyone and Thanks again. Thank you Sheila, you're an awesome lady to be able to do what you do. We need more like you!
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