GliderCENTRAL

Jaundice with blood in urine...

Posted By: sugarlope

Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/23/04 12:27 AM

I got a call this morning from a family that has two sons from one of my pair, I went with them to the vet so I will tell you all that I know--and am just looking for any more information/suggestions on his situation...

Ozzy is about a year old, and his family noticed that he had orangish colored urine last night when he woke up to play. It continued this morning, and I met them at the vet's office. As soon as I saw him and the urine sample they had collected I was very worried. The urine is RED, there is a significant amount of blood in it and when he popped his head out he was obviously jaundiced (nose, ears, and feet were very obviously yellow).
He is acting completely normal, still eating and drinking, playing and very active and alert (eyes bright and clear, ears up). The vet's concerns were either liver or kidney related (infection or disease), or a blood problem. She was concerned about drawing blood because said she didn't want to take blood if he wasn't producing very well, and it might cause him to become depressed and make recovery more difficult. She put him on .01 cc Amoxicillin, twice a day. They have also increased his fluid intake, starting last night, that she suggested they keep up because he was very slightly dehydrated last night. I also gave the vet a phone number that I found for Dr. Bradley, from Belton, MO (someone had posted and said she was knowledable and would do phone consultations) so she said she would contact her today.

Does anyone have any other suggestions, or...anything? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" /> I am very concerned.

Thanks~Gretchen
Posted By: Karin

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/23/04 01:03 AM

Did the vet do a fecal? That is usually the minimum of tests run to find a cause/solution. I have heard of giardia causing these symptoms...I hope the vet contacts Dr. Bradley soon!

Karin
Posted By: sugarlope

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/23/04 01:14 AM

I'm sorry--yes she did, I was trying to remember everything and apparently didn't-- she did rule out Giardia (that was one of my concerns also).
~Gretchen
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/23/04 01:52 AM

I hope he feels better soon! Keep us updated on how he is doing. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Judie

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/23/04 03:44 AM

Have your friend call her vet in the morning and ask if they were able to contact Bradley.

Make sure they push a lot of fluids into this sick fellow. Also, they need to monitor for any HLP symptoms...or seizure activity.

Sending prayers that this little one will do a complete turn around. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />

Usually, Baytril is med of choice as it is more of a broad spectrum....especially if a UTI is present. However, I have no idea as to what tests the vet did on this very very sick glider.

The urine could have been collected and sent in for a culture and not sure why the vet did not do one.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/23/04 02:17 PM

I'm sorry to hear about this little one. Are there any updates yet?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/24/04 08:44 PM

Just signed on to this forum today... so I can give you a personal update. Ozzie (the sick glider) belongs to my son. He responded well to antibiotics and as of last night had no visible blood in his urine. He is however still visibly jaundiced -- and now has diarrhea (I'm assuming from the antibiotics). I've left a message for the vet as I'm not sure when its time to worry about the continued jaundice. We'd been checking him every two hours, but today bumped it up to every four hours -- Ozzie had decided he liked all the attention he was getting and was wanting to play every time we checked in!

He's on 0.10cc amoxicillian and getting glider-ade everytime we check in...and has stayed active and alert through everything.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/24/04 09:17 PM

If the meds are giving him tummy trouble, try giving him about half a teaspoon or so (more if he wants) of yogurt with live cultures after every dose. It should help balance out the natural bacteria in his tummy and hopefully make him feel a little better. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Judie

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/26/04 08:24 AM

Meds sometimes cause diarreah. And when they do it is because they are messing up the flora in the tummy or intestine.

Suggest a call to your vet. Perhaps he may want to use a different antibiotic or perscribe some Ben-Bac to replenish his tummy with.

Most importantly monitor for Dehydrtion.

Please update thread on his contition. Sending prayers he will be well soon. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/26/04 04:19 PM

Talked with doctor -- said the jaundice can last up to a week so don't worry until Monday. She originally prescribed amoxicillian for 10 days, but since he has diarrhea, she said to stop it on Saturday.

He refused to take meds, glider-ade, treats or dinner last night. I got really worried. He also had no desire to play -- just wanted to sit peaking out of his bag while I held him. Made a Wally-World run to get Ensure, yogurt and juice at 11pm -- the stinker!! When I got back, Ozzy was eating and played on his wheel for a while.

I wonder if he likes all the attention he's getting <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/roflmao.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/26/04 05:28 PM

give the yoplait custard yogurt it has a high calcium ration and nothing artifical in it u dont want to use artifical sweetners it sounds like youur doing whats right.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/26/04 09:38 PM

sending <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> and prayers your way for a speedy recovery.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/29/04 08:22 PM

Ozzy's health continually improved over the weekend... back to normal food, schedule, and is gaining weight. Still tinged with yellow, but the vet said that as long as he's improving, she didn't need to see him again.

Yippie!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 03/29/04 08:34 PM

Glad to hear he is improving and doing so well <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> We will keep him in our thoughts that no more nasty vet vists are needed anytime soon! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Jaundice with blood in urine... - 05/06/04 09:39 PM

Wanted to post an update . . .

Last week Ozzie had blood in his urine again (and was jaundiced)! My son called me at work absolutely hysterical. We made an emergency run to the vet -- after examining him and finding that he had no abdominal tenderness or swollen kidneys (can you believe he held still that long!), she decided that we might have taken him off the antibiotics too soon. She put him back on the amoxicillin -- for 14 days this time. He gets 0.1 cc twice a day. Said to give him all the yogurt he wants each time he takes his meds to avoid the diarrhea. We also were told to push the fluids until he was off the antibiotics. For the first 24 hours we had to check him every three hours around the clock to make sure he was alert & OK.

The good news is that with two doses of the antibiotic, the blood was gone. And, he loves yogurt -- so that hasn't been an issue for him.

I asked the vet about the amoxicillin, since most of the posts I've seen about glider antibiotics were for Baytril. She said she'd been using it for about three years with good success with other gliders. She also said that she had never heard of gliders with this problem, so she was going to be asking an exotic animal specialist if he had any insight -- I'll let you know if she learns anything.

As for Ozzie, he is on his second week of antibiotics now, and you can't tell anything is wrong with him other than the fact that he is still a tad yellow. We've been lucky, because other than a slight energy dip each time he's gotten sick, he's never been extremely ill. Ozzie is our "social glider" so all the extra attention is making him wake earlier in the day so he'll get extra gliderade, treats and attention from his people!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 05:01 AM

My son's glider Ozzy has been sick on and off since March with blood in his urine and jaundice. He's been to a vet regularly. Today we took him to an exotic animal vet several hours from our home for a second opinion. Even though the blood is not visible, he still has blood in his urine and is still jaundiced. She did an ultrasound and it showed problems with his liver. She has recommended exploratory surgery -- and doesn't think he'll survive without it. She thinks he either has a liver problem, has injested something that is still lodged in his stomach, or is suffering from lead poisoning (although we have no idea how he would have gotten lead in his system).

My 15yo son (Ozzy & his brother Chip belong to him) is worried sick -- as am I.

If someone from the emergency vet fund could contact me I would appreciate it. I have tried to send info twice but was told there were server problems. We've spent over $500 to date and the upcoming surgery is expected to run a little over $400.

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 05:06 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" /> [:"magenta"]i am so sorry to hear about your ozzy. i hope things turn out well for him. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> [/]
Posted By: Critter Creations

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 05:33 AM

I am so sorry this is happening to poor Ozzy. I really hope they are able to make him better. I will relay the post to a person on the EVF, but I would keep trying to send the form in until it works for you or until someone contacts you. I will keep ozzy in my hopes and prayers.
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 05:47 AM

pray and i will pray for ozzy too. prayers work miracles
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 04:11 PM

Good Luck with Ozzy and please keep us posted.
Our prayers and thoughts are with you.
Posted By: Lucy

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 06:16 PM

I hope you'll keep us posted regarding this. I'm very curious what your vet will do if exploratory surgery is attempted. What is the goal of the exploration? What remedy can your vet do? It would be exciting if advances in surgery were able to repair liver damage in gliders. I've never heard anyone attempting this, though.

It seems that many gliders either die of liver problems, or liver deterioration shows up in a lot of glider deaths. I wish we knew more about why this is happening. Some things we DO know -- aflatoxins cause abnormalities in the liver, for instance -- but it seems as though many gliders die before their time with liver abnormalities. On the other hand, some gliders have lived quite awhile with liver problems. Gladys was jaundiced for over a year before she died of multiple organ failure.

This is a tough decision on your part. I wish you luck, and hope that you make the best decisions for your family and Ozzy. Please tell us more and keep us posted about Ozzy's progress.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 09:56 PM

This was the first time we met the vet that recommended surgery. After some time to think, I do have lots more questions.

The purpose of the exploratory surgery would be two-fold. First to get a liver biopsy -- his ultrasound showed a large "thickening" of the liver. Secondly, his symptoms are apparently consistent with lead poisoning -- although she wasn't able to get enough blood to run tests on that. Her concern is that Ozzy has injested something that remains in his stomach that is still leaching lead into his system. So during surgery she would be checking the stomach for foreign bodies. Nothing specific showed up on the xray.

Ozzy is acting normal... so surgery seems extreme. However, I don't want him to be so sick that the risks of surgery outweigh the benefits. At this time she said he had a 20% chance of not making it through the surgery. The blood that still shows in his urine using the "dipstick" is not visible to the naked eye.

My other concern is that each time we put him on antibiotics his symptoms appear to resolve. So where is the infection? And how does the infection relate to his jaundice, blood in urine and liver issues?

Any input would be appreciated... This is all very new to us.

Lynn <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/needhug.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 10:26 PM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" /> [:"magenta"]i am sorry, but i really do not have the answers to your questions. hopefully somone will be along soon who can help you. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> [/]
Posted By: Lucy

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/13/04 11:55 PM

Those are puzzling symptoms, and I can see why the veterinarian is considering surgery - it doesn't seem typical. It's strange that the symptoms would go away with every round of antibiotics. Keep us posted --
Posted By: Judie

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/14/04 06:36 AM

Has the vet run multi tests....blood draws as well as C&S on this glider? I myself would he hesitant about surgery and would only consider exploratory surgery as a last option. Myself...I would seek another openion if this vet has not done the proper blood tests.

I send you best wishes as to whatever your decision. Please keep us updated on this little glider.
Posted By: Charlie H

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/14/04 10:18 AM

Sorry, but I just would not allow the surgery. There has to be a better way of determining what is wrong with the glider. I never like to see a glider suffer but to do exploratory surgery seems extreme for people and especially for a glider. If your present vet is frustrated and out of options, I would consult another vet before allowing the operation. Either way is going to be expensive. This is just a layman's opinion.
Charlie H
Posted By: Critter Creations

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/14/04 02:52 PM

I think I feel the same way as Charlie and Judie do. If I was to do it I would have to be out of every option available. Please know that we are here to support you no matter what decision you make and we would love to hear updates on what is happening. You, your son, and Ozzy are in our thoughts and prayers.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/14/04 05:32 PM

It looks like your thoughts are running the same direction as mine. When you leave a doctor's office after being told surgery is needed, that's all you think about. But now, two days later, I have more questions than answers -- and I am definately postponing surgery until I'm sure its the best thing for Ozzy. My gut says that the surgery isn't a great idea.

So, here is where things stand right now. I've asked the Kansas City vet (this is the vet I got the second opinion from who recommended surgery) to send both me and my local vet a copy of Ozzy's records. I have an appointment with our local vet tomorrow evening to review everything. I'm putting together a list of questions for her. If I'm missing anything let me know:
1) I still don't understand how jaundice and UTI symptoms go together.
2) Can we run a urine culture & sensitivity so we know what we are treating?
3) If this is a liver issue, why is it responding partially to antibiotics?
5) If this is lead poisoning, is there a non-invasive way to treat for it?
6) Discuss diet/nutritional support/herbal/etc. that may assist his recovery (or at the very least, keep him comfortable).

Anything else? Thanks for the support -- these are very hard decisions... I think Ozzy is tired of all the poking and proding -- he crabs at me whenever I come close to him.

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/15/04 02:28 AM

I hope you find the answers you are looking for and don't have to resort to surgery! I'll be praying for little Ozzy!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: sugarlope

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/15/04 04:53 AM

hey Lynn--I thought of something else along the lines of the antibiotics...I don't know enough about it to know, but would lead poisoning respond to antibiotic treatment either? Sorry I didn't think to ask while you were there.

-gretchen
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 06/15/04 06:24 PM

What I've read online is that they treat people with lead poisoning with a form of calcium (calcium disodium edetate (EDTA)) and a form of penicillin (D-Penicillamine). I thought that was interesting since calcium issues are common to gliders.

I'll ask tonite when I see our regular vet.

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Decision (for now) - 06/16/04 01:26 AM

Just got back from our local vet -- I feel better... at least we have a plan of action.

First -- no surgery. The risks are too big... the potential good is too small... and realistically, the money is too much... and the risk of a negative impact on Ozzy's quality of life is too great.

Second -- for the moment we will work under the assumption that he has a bacterial infection that may have caused complications with the liver/kidneys (time will tell on that one). We will keep him on antibiotics for three weeks, wait a week and run a urinalysis/culture & sensitivity -- and go from there.

Third -- she recommended that we start researching and as much as possible start supplementing his diet with foods that are indigenous to his native environment. In her opinion, one possibility with all the liver issues gliders have is that an enzyme that is available in the wild -- is missing in a captive diet. She also gave me the number of a zoo in the region to call to talk with the dietician.

That's a brief synopsis of our conversation. We talked for 45 minutes and she charged us $10.00!

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Decision (for now) - 06/16/04 01:39 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" /> [:"magenta"]oh, that is so wonderful! you have such a great vet. i am also relieved that you decided not to do the surgery. please keep us updated on ozzy's progress. hope he is up and about in no time. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/multi.gif" alt="" />[/]
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Decision (for now) - 06/16/04 05:51 AM

i would go to a top notch exotic vet and get another opinion but no surgery. u can call my vet at 919 644 9166 dr dan johnson he saved my glider over a year ago from pnumonia and bacterial infection. maybe u need an antibiotic in shot form it goes right into the bloodstream
Posted By: KarenE

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Decision (for now) - 06/16/04 12:40 PM

[:"blue"]Lynn,
Thanks so much for updating us and that sounds like a great plan .... all for $10 <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dance.gif" alt="" /> How great is that <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" />

I hope that Little Ozzy continues to do well and hopefully at the end of his three weeks of medication the vet will be able to find/not find results in the tests. [/]
Posted By: princessmegi

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Decision (for now) - 06/16/04 04:26 PM

I am so happy to hear about your vet. They sound wonderful. I pray that Ozzy continues to get betterand that the meds help. If you find out something that is needed in our babies diets, please let us know.
Megi
Posted By: Critter Creations

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Decision (for now) - 06/16/04 06:28 PM

So glad to hear that Ozzy is doing well. I sure hope these antibiotics take care of the problem. I will kee him in my thoughts and prayers. Keep us updated on how he is doing. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Update - 06/30/04 09:59 PM

Ozzy is in his third week of antibiotics. His skin has pinked up -- he's his normal perky self. Someone at work ran a urinalysis for me. He has no blood in his urine, no white blood cells, still has a small amount of bilirubin. So far, things are going well. He'll be off antibiotics on Friday then we'll have an anxious three to four weeks while we wait to see if the blood in his urine and jaundice return.

Lynn
Posted By: Critter Creations

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Update - 06/30/04 10:06 PM

SO glad to hear that the antibiotics are doing their job. I will keep him in my thoughts and prayers in hopes that once the antibiotics are done everything goes fine. Thanks so much for keeping us updated on him.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Update - 07/01/04 12:35 AM

I thought about the antibiotic treatment...what my thoughts on this iare is this:
antibiotics kill certain bacteria in the stomach/intestines, so whatever causes the toxicity that causes the other symptoms of blood in urine, enlarged liver, etc, could be slowedto almost a halt, cause certain bacteria are no longe rpresent to help with digestion issues. That's why they recomend freindly bacteri to be reintroduedto our system to help bring our digestion back on track.
So my guess would be that something you are feeding or something the glider comes in touch with that is ingested, could be toxic ? That would then mean that the glider would sooner or later possibly be deprived of other nutritional components, as the antibiotics are slowing down whatever is entering the body...
I don't think it has that much to do with the diet we give, or esle we'd see this sort of problem a lot more often maybe? I don't disagree with a more native diet, but that's going to be very hard to accomplish.

I'd like to ask your vet that question, maybe you can.

Tanja
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Update - 07/01/04 03:04 AM

I've gone over the cage, etc. Nothing obvious. Also, his brother is totally healthy -- and they're together always. So not sure what it is. We are supplementing him with acidophilus so hopefully have kept his intestinal flora up. So... if it is a toxin, its a subtle one... or something that he's suseptible to, but his brother isn't. Any ideas?

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Update - 07/01/04 03:38 AM

Hmm the only thing i can think of is that he's possibly more susceptible, or that he has some sort of virus or bacteria, that creates atoxin in his system, but doesn't get eradicated by the antibiotics used, or somehow comes back ?
I readsomething on that a while back, but i can;t for the life of me remember right now if it was a virus or a bacteria, and what sort of toxin it released... if i remember i'll let you know.

Tanja
Posted By: Lucy

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery -- Decision (for now) - 07/01/04 04:35 AM

Your vet sounds wonderful -- thoughtful and knowledgeable! I like the observations about diet -- there are a number of people these days who theorize that liver problems in gliders may in part be related by something they're not getting here that they get in their natural environment.

And it sounds like the fact the fact that the antibiotics are working may mean that you've found the source of the problem. I'll keep my fingers crossed that this is the case!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- I spoke too soon - 07/04/04 02:16 AM

I was so optimistic three days ago... pink nose and everything seemed fine. Yesterday was Ozzy's last day of antibiotics. When we took his and Chips dinner in, I looked at him and he'd turned jaundiced again. Very yellow. I don't want to admit it. But it looks like we have along-term problem that antibiotics won't fix. I'm so sad. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/upset.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Lucy

Re: Ozzy -- I spoke too soon - 07/04/04 02:30 AM

I'm sorry! I know you'll be worried about him, but the best thing you can do is watch him for other signs of health and illness, and watch his diet (limit protein, etc). I would definitely ask your vet about milk thistle, too. Ozzy (and you) will be in my prayers!
Posted By: cyndiekb

Re: Ozzy -- I spoke too soon - 07/04/04 02:31 AM

I'm sorry you two are having to go thru this. Keeping you both in my thoughts and prayers.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- I spoke too soon - 07/04/04 06:43 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> to each of you! Hopefully something will turn up. With the jaundice, I wonder about liver problems. I'll be keeping you all in my prayers, please give Ozzy a hug from me!
Chey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Critter Creations

Re: Ozzy -- I spoke too soon - 07/04/04 09:19 PM

I will definately hold him in my thoughts and prayers in hopes that things get better.
Posted By: Anonymous

Ozzy -- an update - 07/09/04 04:45 AM

We did a urinalysis today -- six days off the antibiotics. Blood is back in his urine... bilirubin still there too. No white blood cells, so can't do a culture and sensitivity. The vet decided it was too risky to wait for white blood cells to appear and has put him back on antibiotics. Ozzy is acting fine, still jaundiced, no visible blood.

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- an update - 07/09/04 04:55 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" /> [:"magenta"]aw, poor ozzy. i wish he was doing better. but it could be worse. at least the antibiotix seem to help. [/]
Posted By: Bourbon

Re: Ozzy -- an update - 07/09/04 03:44 PM

be very careful with the anti-biotics, the over use/overdose of some meds will also cause the jaundice with blood in the urine,
Posted By: Anonymous

Ozzy -- Friday - 07/09/04 11:17 PM

I too am worried about antibiotics. However I'm not sure what other options we have right now short of cutting him open to try to figure out what's wrong. Ozzy is bright yellow this evening -- in the creases of his ears and nose... and of course his paws and nails also. Loose stools from the antibiotics, so will be pushing yogurt and gliderade tonite... looks to be a long weekend. I'll see if I can find someone with a digital camera to post a picture.

Lynn <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worried2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 01:40 AM

Here are the pictures of Ozzy...

Lynn

Attached picture 251271-CurledUp.jpg
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 01:41 AM

Second picture

Lynn

Attached picture 251272-Nose.jpg
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 01:43 AM

Third

Attached picture 251273-Peekingout.jpg
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 01:45 AM

Last one

Lynn

Attached picture 251274-SideView.jpg
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 04:03 AM

awwww that poor baby!! He is so cute but he is so jaundice <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Have they said anything about increasing the vitd for him. I would automatically think of having some kind of time in bright room!! small amounts of time of course but some kind of uv. something...poor little guy.
Posted By: Critter Creations

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 04:18 AM

The poor little guy. He is so adorable though even with his yellow little hands, nose, and ears. I really hope something can be figured out. I feel so bad for him. I will continue to keep him in my thoughts and prayers.
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 04:41 AM

surgery isnt the answer in my opinion. u can call my vet in the morn. at 919 844 9166 and ask for dr. dan. he saved my glider over a yr ago. he used a shot antibiotic that kills any type of bacteria or infecton as mine had pnumonia and bacterial infection. it was amakacin penicillin and sterile saline all combined in one shot given twice daily the amount was 1 1/2cc sterile saline amakacin 4mg/kg and reg. penicillin 30 000 iu/kg devided in to body weight of glider. and i gave it 3 wks. but my ruby was almost gone. she was gasping for air breathing with her mouth open. and in oxygen. this was pure experimental since dr dan used it in rabbits and that was our only hope. it might just do the trick for u.
Posted By: Lucy

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 05:30 AM

You know, Lynne, that it's hard for me to look at Ozzy and not think about Gladys. What strikes me about these pictures, though, is that he looks alert and healthy, apart from the jaundice. I hope that is an encouragement to you -- Gladys really didn't look well from the time she developed the problem.

I so hope it's a matter of something that can be cleared up with antibiotics. Not all liver problems are equal, and I'm sure keeping my fingers crossed. Thanks for forwarding the labs. You're doing a valuable service by letting us learn from Ozzy along with you. Thank you --
Posted By: Judie

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 05:52 AM

Question.... What about having the vet sedate the glider and do a blood draw then send it in to do a Culture & Sensitivity. If this is a blood borne illness...perhaps this will find the nasty bug causing all of his problems. However to do this...the glider needs to be off the anitbiotics for five to seven days or so.

Anyway, just a thought. You could run this by the vet and get his opinion.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 06:19 AM

Lynn,

It is very difficult from a distance to know what is happening. Luckily your veterinarian gets to examine and test Ozzie, and is in the best position to help. A couple of thoughts that may help understanding:

Jaundice is too much bilirubin in the blood. The liver clears bilirubin from the blood stream, and attaches a chemical to help excrete it. This combined (conjugated) product is a dark colored bile pigment, which travels down the bile ducts and is squirted into the bowel for clearance. That's why normal toidy is dark, and liver-sick toidy can be kind of pale or chalky. When something in this process has gone wrong, jaundice develops.

Having jaundice can come from increased production of bilirubin or bile pigment overload, or decreased clearance.

Increased production:
1. Hemolytic anemia (Breakdown of red blood cells). A blood count will show if he is anemic (has a low red cell count). Was the "blood in the urine" red cells under the microscope, or a positive dipstick? Knowing that would help.
2. Decreased microsomal conjugating of bilirubin. This means that the liver hooks another chemical to the bilirubin molecule to help get rid of it. If that isn't happening, the bili level can climb and cause jaundice. Normally elevated bilirubin is measured as conjugated or unconjugated. That can help solve the puzzle if they drew blood.

Decreased elimination:
1. Inherited errors of the above process, such as defective enzymes that don't work well. I don't remember reading how old he is, but the older he is, the less likely this becomes. Getting so yellow so fast would be expected in younger joeys.
2. Leaky liver cells letting the jaundice back into the blood instead of excreting it. Some meds can do such a thing. You didn't say what meds he was being given.
3. Obstruction of outflow of bile to the bowel. Cancer blocking the duct, a stone in the duct can block passage, or problems leading to narrowing or poor flow. These are the surgically treatable causes.

Once one of these causes gets going, it can inflame the whole liver, which can lead to some of the other causes and create mixed reasons for worsening jaundice. Then it gets harder to figure out the original cause.

Importantly, infection can inflame the liver and cause all kinds of trouble. An abscess could also cause obstruction to outflow or inflammation of the liver. Most abscesses cannot be effectively treated with antibiotics. Antibiotics might quiet down an infection, but usually they cannot completely remove an abscess and thus the problem can recur after stopping the med. It could also be that the particular antibiotic being used is not the best one for a specific infection, so the med might slow it down, but not completely fix him. Have you tried different ones?

Lastly, parasites and viruses can also cause liver inflammation, or hepatitis. Poisons can also do this. Heavy metal poisonings such as the lead you mentioned could be one of many such culprits. Bacterial toxins such as aflatoxin can inflame livers. Obviously, there is a very long list of possible causes.

In your case, the observation that blood was in the urine and that antibiotics seemed to help both the urine blood and the jaundice are very interesting clues. Inborn errors wouldn't get better with bug juice (antibiotics). Neither would heavy metal poisonings, viral and parasitic infections, outflow obstructions, aflatoxin issues or duct malformation. The other observation that his cage mate is not similarly showing signs seems to make poisonings and diet issues seem less likely.

I can't help thinking of infection given the story you have related. The surgical reasons are farther down the list, but not excluded. Some of them couldn't be helped after opening him up. That being said, if he has an abscess, his only hope of curing it is to open and drain it.

I don't know if this helps you with a difficult decision, but I hope so. Such dilemmas are never easy. Given some gliders' tendencies to self mutilate, surgery seems even more scary than normal. Good luck, and we're all here for help.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 09:20 AM

Poor baby. Poor you!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 11:46 AM

OMGoodness. I have never seen anything quite like that. Is Ozzy feeling better today? I sure hope something can be found with the surgery so you can get on the road to recovery with some medicine. Please keep us posted. Poor Poor Ozzy. My thoughts and prayers are with him.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 04:33 PM

Good Morning,
Well, we made it through the night. It may be wishful thinking, but Ozzy appears to be a tiny bit less yellow this morning. I got up every three hours last night and gave him gliderade diluted with pedialyte / some yogurt / his meds this morning, etc.

Peggy, someone at work also suggested ultraviolet light. I may go to town later today and pick up a grow light.

Lucy, You're right about Ozzy not looking sick -- behavior wise, I can tell -- he is Mr. Inquisitive and our social-butterfly. Today he's very crabby and is content to sleep and to be left alone. Last night when we were taking the pictures, he kept going back to the pouch, but still was watching everything, when healthy he would have been grabbing the camera and exploring it.

Judie, Ozzy is back on antibiotics (for 2 weeks) -- once we get through this crisis I think we'll probably go ahead and do the cultures. My vet wasn't willing to wait several more days before putting him on antibiotics due to the severity of the jaundice.

Schlep, the blood in his urine was red blood cells (microscopic exam). He is 15 mos OOP so elimination issues are probably not the problem.

Monday, I'll take another urine sample in. I'll scan the results to add to his medical records. His records are available for anyone who would like a copy -- email or PM me.

Currently he is on Clavamox (antibiotic)and Pet-Tinnic (for anemia). He also gets milk thistle extract twice daily. Right now he is also getting yogurt and/or gliderade (with Pedialyte added). His breeder suggested that I give him Kaopectate to help his diarrhea (dip tip of pinkie into it and let him lick it off -- one dose only). We were concerned about the diarrhea getting out of control, and Ozzy not being strong enough to handle it.

Thanks for everyone's concern. I'll keep you posted.

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 07/10/04 06:04 PM

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
is suffering from lead poisoning (although we have no idea how he would have gotten lead in his system).



<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Fluoride causes lead absorption. Fluoride can be found in city water and also in bottled water in even higher concentrations.


http://www.gardening.cornell.edu/factsheets/misc/cgandlead.html

http://www.healthy.net/scr/article.asp?PageType=article&ID=1816

Food. Lead is contained in many foods, especially in those grown near industrial areas or busy cities or roadways. Grains, legumes, commercial and garden fruit, and most meat products pick up some lead. Liver and lunch meats are usually higher. Liverwurst and other sausages may contain more lead than other foods. Roadside vegetation, such as herbs, fruits, and vegetables, has higher concentrations of lead than vegetation growing in more secluded areas. Measurements of lead in trees growing along roads show much more than was present in the 1930s. Bonemeal, a source of calcium and magnesium, is usually made from cattle bones and may contain high amounts of lead. Dolomite, an earth rock source of calcium and magnesium, is usually lower in lead. Pet foods may also be high.
Pesticides. Many pesticides and insecticides contain some lead, mainly as the lead-arsenate base.

http://www.converge.org.nz/pirm/eatrisk.htm

http://www.nrdc.org/health/pesticides/hcarson.asp
About Rachel Carson;Silent Spring
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy -- Jaundice Pics - 07/10/04 06:11 PM

Have you looked into the possiblity of the milk thistle causing a toxicity? Maybe he is getting too much or has been getting it for too long.

I wish we had more, this little guys is a love and so patient to be going through all this. He remains in my prayers. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Bourbon

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 07/10/04 10:20 PM

she and I did talk about the pesticides, however while looking over her past posts, I see that she had a concern with the ant hotels??? that she had placed out a couple of months ago..I am wondering if that couldn't have been an issue??? so many possiblities with liver problems..
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 07/10/04 10:48 PM

Bug and I are keeping Ozzy in our thoughts......I'll also ask my vet if she has any clues......she handles oodles of exotics although she hasn't seen many gliders.....hopefully the answer is out there and someone will find it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Needs Surgery - 07/10/04 10:58 PM

Just wanted to say that Ozzy is in my prayers. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" /> I've been following his story with lots of hope for the wee one, and for his slave <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Jaundice - 07/11/04 03:11 PM

Well, we made it one more day. Ozzy was so still at one point yesterday while I was holding him that I thought we were loosing him. I didn't check on him through he night because he seemed so tired, but this morning, he was eating and drinking on his own (and drank enough to stay hydrated) and even jumped from my lap to the cage this morning when he wanted to go back to bed. His brother Chip, is sticking real close to him and is grooming him. Wish I was independently wealthy and could stay home with him this week.

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Jaundice - 07/11/04 03:49 PM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Lynn, prayers for you and Ozzy, as well as your son and Ozzy's brother!
Chey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Pockets

Re: Ozzy Jaundice - 07/11/04 03:59 PM

Lynn many many <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
From my <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" />'s to yours!
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Ozzy Jaundice - 07/11/04 04:27 PM

Good Thoughts and Prayers are coming your way for both you and Ozzy. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Jaundice - 07/11/04 05:01 PM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" /> [:"magenta"] keep us updated. will keep my fingers and toes crossed for ya! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" />[/]
Posted By: Carrie T

Re: Ozzy Jaundice - 07/11/04 05:03 PM

After talking with Lynn, there is another common denominator here and that is the use of Front line on our cats. My heart and prayers go out to you Lynn <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Jaundice--Liver vs. Kidney - 07/11/04 07:07 PM

I've recently talked with two people who've had gliders die with jaundice as the visible symptom. Both had necropsies done. And both said there was more damage to the kidneys than the liver and that other organs were involved. I know this question may not solve Ozzy's issues, but what if what we need to be doing is looking to support / repair the kidneys and identifying what could be damaging them? What if the liver issues are secondary to kidney issues? Are there other instances where this is documented? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" />

Just a thought (or maybe a shower brainstorm)... feel free to move this to a new thread if it would be better explored there.

Lynn
Posted By: Charlie H

Re: Ozzy Jaundice--Liver vs. Kidney - 07/11/04 08:49 PM

Lynn, that is exactly what my theory is. Look for the underlying cause of the liver damage. It is my opinion that the primary problem lies in the urinary tract and/or kidneys. Maybe even bladder infection. Once this is corrected the glider should stabilize and the liver problem can be dealt with.

In dealing with mutilators I have noticed a similar scenario. Everyone seems to focus on the mutilation damage and to loose sight of what caused the glider to start mutilating. In Ozzy's case everyone seems to be focusing on the damaged liver and forgetting the blood that keeps appearing in the urine.
Charlie H
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Jaundice--Liver vs. Kidney - 07/12/04 01:51 AM

another bit of advise i know works as it was a big part in saving my miracle glider ruby from pnumonia she was practicly dead. no longer eating and drinking. another med. that saved her was laying hands on her daily and praying for her to be healed. i truly believe thats another reason shes still with me almost 2 yrs since her sickness. a good vet, alot of prayer, and alot of BML diet. i still pray for her today. since she still has scar tissue on her lungs that was damaged from being deathly sick. and i see that slowly getting better as months go by. its amazing. i just read an article by a dr. last night. they injected 10 mice with cancer cells they were suppose to die within 25 days. since it was a deadly form of cancer. now, they prayed for an hour each week for these 10 mice. they all got well. then there was another 10 injected with the same thing. they were not prayed for and they died. my advise is. if you pray for ozzy you might just get what your asking for. miracles do happen. ruby my glider is one of them. and yours can be too.
Posted By: Anonymous

Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 03:51 AM

Ozzy has been going downhill all day. He has vomited twice this evening. Is there anything we can do, or is it a matter of staying close and keeping him warm and loved?

Lynn

Edited to add:
Originally Posted By: ZacksMom from 7/12/04
Thanks for everyone's good wishes. I didn't think Ozzy would live through the night. He was refusing liquids, food, just wanted to gaze at us, didn't sleep, crawled instead of walking. He tried to separate (hide in the tube in the bottom of the cage) from his brother, but his brother would have nothing of it.

At around midnight I offered him pieces of an extremely ripe cherry, which he ate -- Yea! Soon he took guava nectar. Later, I offered him a piece of the inside of a dried fig, he grabbed it and chowed down. Started drinking regularly too. I got up every hour and a half during the night -- figs and guava nectar was all he wanted. By morning, he got up by himself to say hello.

The vet visit -- urine bilirubin through the roof. Protein in his urine and RBC levels rising. Not as many red blood cells were microscopically visible as she expected -- she thinks the cells were probably breaking down before they reached the urine. No tenderness with abdominal palpatation.

He is off the Clavamox (that easily could have been making him sicker). But the Pet-Tinnic (iron and B vitamins) was increased to twice a day. Vet said that the reason his jaundice was so florescent was probably due to anemia -- without having pink skin underneath the yellow became much more pronounced.

She suspects that he has a hematologic problem -- a problem of either the blood or bone marrow, probably a blood-borne parasite or bacteria or possibly cancer. Right now we'll wait and see. She doesn't feel comfortable drawing blood right now because of the anemia -- and the fact it will be hard to get enough blood to run complete panels. (Interesting fact, 7% of a glider's weight is approx. how many mL (cc?) of blood the glider has. It is safe to draw approx 7% of the blood volume without compromising a glider's health.) Her lab must have at least 0.4 mL to run blood panels. She is going to contact a bacteriologist to see if she were to provide several drops (by cutting his nail), if they could find anything. As she said, she has theories, but can't prove any of them without risking Ozzy's health further.

Re: aflatoxins -- two vets have ruled it out, said his symptoms alltogether "weren't right" for it.
Re: improvement after antibiotics -- when he was on amoxicillin only, the visible blood (no urinalysis done) and the jaundice cleared up. When on Baytril the blood (including blood in urinalysis)cleared up, but not the jaundice. Blood in urine (urinalysis) returned six days after ending Baytril. Florescent jaundice began after 2 doses of Clavamox.
Curiosity question: I know figs are very high in calcium (thanks Pockets) -- does he just like figs, or is there something else if figs he needed for recovery?

By no means is he out of the woods. But he is stable for the moment. Thanks again for your thoughts and prayers.

Lynn
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 04:21 AM

is there anyway u can get the antbiotic shot i told u about its worth a try. just make sure hes doesnt dehydrate if he does u have to sub q him. in the meantime give him lots of luv and prayer.
Posted By: Lucy

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 04:22 AM

Lynn, this breaks my heart. I'd so been hoping the antibiotics would do the trick.

You could take him in to an emergency vet tonight, and they might or might not be able to do anything. If he's having trouble breathing, they could help, perhaps. But you may be looking at multiple organ failure. If that's the case, you have to decide how much you want to fight to possibly prolong his life a little. It's a hard and excruciating choice.

I hope that he turns the corner for the better as the night progresses. At worst, you can keep him comfortable tonight, and just love on him. Either way, I'm sure you have the support of everyone here.

My thoughts and prayers are with you.
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 04:47 AM

Oh Lynn, I am soo sorry. Please as you are giving him his lovins to please put in an extra squeeze, rub, and kiss on his little head from me.
This just breaks my heart to hear he had to endure even more. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 05:21 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> to you all, I wish I could be there in person to give them.
Chey <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Xfilefan

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 05:26 AM

Reading the last thread, and then this one, I am wondering if one of the new meds might be causing his vomiting? I know some antibiotics can cause this in gliders who are sensitive, Baytril among them. We've had a couple that reacted this way to meds. Has he had the Clavamox before? Or the one for anemia (can't recall the name you gave)? It's also possible he could have developed a sensitivity if his liver/kidneys aren't filtering things out properly and there's a buildup. I know there are some sites that list veterinary antibiotics, their effects, eliminations from the body, tissue retention of the drug, etc. but I can't find my link. Just a thought as to why he may be throwing up all of a sudden. This little one has been through a lot. Our prayers are with him and you.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 06:40 AM

Well, Clavamox is well known for causing vomiting. The anemia med is a vitamin with iron to help build red blood cells. There hasn't been enough time to have vitamin levels build up and cause any toxicity, but stomach upset and vomiting is certainly within the realm of possibility for either med. More likely is that this is end-stage liver disease.

CharlieH questioned in the other thread about the kidney being the source of the problem. That is a good thought, but also seems unlikely. There just aren't many kidney issues that lead to jaundice. Even pyelonephritis (kidney infection) leading to overwhelming sepsis wouldn't present this way. And one would have a much sicker critter. However, liver issues could readily explain jaundice and blood in the urine. The liver makes the clotting factors that stop bleeding, and as liver illness progresses, bleeding ensues due to inability to clot normally. At the micro level, small amounts of blood can get in the urine if clotting is not working well. That degree of jaundice usually goes with hepatitis (liver infection), biliary tract obstruction, or most frequently a primary liver ailment.

This is so sad, and not likely to have a happy ending. I hope Ozzy doesn't suffer, and that Zack can get through this.
Posted By: Charlie H

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 11:56 AM

Something that may have been overlooked is the possibality of aflatoxin infection.

The patients experienced high fever, rapid progressive jaundice, edema of the limbs, pain, vomiting, and swollen livers.

Ozzy could have a low level of contamination from aflatoxins as he seems to be exibiting most of the above symptoms. At low levels of intake an animal does not necessarily die right away and some recover.
Charlie H
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 12:37 PM

I don't have any experience in this but I want you to know I'm praying for you and Ozzy. I just want to add that you are doing a wonderful job and it's so nice to see how much you care for him. Too often I hear of owners having a sick glider and every reason to not see a vet. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" /> to you for all your doing. I pray that God will comfort you and your son and heal your precious Ozzy. He's a very blessed little guy to have you.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 03:02 PM

A quick update then more details tonite. Ozzy made it through the night. Began eating and drinking at about midnight. Ate a few cherry pieces, chowed down on dried figs (go figure) and drank water or mango nectar. Was getting up on his own this morning. Must go earn some money. Details on vet visit tonite.

Lynn
Posted By: Karin

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 03:31 PM

Thank you for the quick update Lynn, much appreciated since we all are in this with you so to speak <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />. Sounds like Ozzy had a good night <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" />, which is a positive! You are doing a wonderful job with him <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />.

Karin
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 03:45 PM

Aflatoxin is a good thought. It was brought up early in the first post, but seemed less likely given the complete absence of signs in his cage mate, and that antibiotics seemed to help. Perhaps the perception that antibiotics helped was overstated, as no objective measure of "improved" was noted.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/12/04 11:43 PM

Thanks for everyone's good wishes. I didn't think Ozzy would live through the night. He was refusing liquids, food, just wanted to gaze at us, didn't sleep, crawled instead of walking. He tried to separate (hide in the tube in the bottom of the cage) from his brother, but his brother would have nothing of it.

At around midnight I offered him pieces of an extremely ripe cherry, which he ate -- Yea! Soon he took guava nectar. Later, I offered him a piece of the inside of a dried fig, he grabbed it and chowed down. Started drinking regularly too. I got up every hour and a half during the night -- figs and guava nectar was all he wanted. By morning, he got up by himself to say hello.

The vet visit -- urine bilirubin through the roof. Protein in his urine and RBC levels rising. Not as many red blood cells were microscopically visible as she expected -- she thinks the cells were probably breaking down before they reached the urine. No tenderness with abdominal palpatation.

He is off the Clavamox (that easily could have been making him sicker). But the Pet-Tinnic (iron and B vitamins) was increased to twice a day. Vet said that the reason his jaundice was so florescent was probably due to anemia -- without having pink skin underneath the yellow became much more pronounced.

She suspects that he has a hematologic problem -- a problem of either the blood or bone marrow, probably a blood-borne parasite or bacteria or possibly cancer. Right now we'll wait and see. She doesn't feel comfortable drawing blood right now because of the anemia -- and the fact it will be hard to get enough blood to run complete panels. (Interesting fact, 7% of a glider's weight is approx. how many mL (cc?) of blood the glider has. It is safe to draw approx 7% of the blood volume without compromising a glider's health.) Her lab must have at least 0.4 mL to run blood panels. She is going to contact a bacteriologist to see if she were to provide several drops (by cutting his nail), if they could find anything. As she said, she has theories, but can't prove any of them without risking Ozzy's health further.

Re: aflatoxins -- two vets have ruled it out, said his symptoms alltogether "weren't right" for it.
Re: improvement after antibiotics -- when he was on amoxicillin only, the visible blood (no urinalysis done) and the jaundice cleared up. When on Baytril the blood (including blood in urinalysis)cleared up, but not the jaundice. Blood in urine (urinalysis) returned six days after ending Baytril. Florescent jaundice began after 2 doses of Clavamox.
Curiosity question: I know figs are very high in calcium (thanks Pockets) -- does he just like figs, or is there something else if figs he needed for recovery?

By no means is he out of the woods. But he is stable for the moment. Thanks again for your thoughts and prayers.

Lynn
Posted By: Charlie H

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 12:20 AM

Keep up the good work Lynn. This has me puzzled along with all the others. I know how helpless it makes you feel when you want to help them and do not know what to do. There are so many possibalities that it becomes very frustrating. We just have to keep trying to find an answer and hoping for the best.
Charlie H
Posted By: Carrie T

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 12:24 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> Thats all I can offer to you and Zack but it is so very heartfelt <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 12:36 AM

omg - I can't believe I missed reading a/b poor little Ozzy!
I'm amazed at the steps you're taking to ensure his health as much as possible... yay for you - working at a vet's has shown me how heartless some people are towards their pets <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/upset.gif" alt="" />
my prayers and thoughts are w/ you and Ozzy; hoping for a full recovery!
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 01:58 AM

try raisins high in iron. also fresh papaya is good. if he got a bacteria of some kind. i would advise the antibiotic shot i used . that i told u about earlier in a post. i dont know what diet he is on. but i suggest bml even if u have to force it down. 3ccs 3 times daily. and give him fresh watermelon its good for the kidneys and stoneyfield farms yogurt which is organic to resore the flora the meds destroy.
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 03:44 AM

If there is a possiblity of it being cancer...isnt that why they put Lord Darcy on the Ensure in the first place?

Curiosity...have you spoken with Donna about this at all to see if any of the problems were similar to what she had with Darcy?
Just a thought. You are doing GREAT with Ozzy. If nothing else, he has to know how much you love him. I applaud ALL your efforts. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 03:50 AM

The vet wants to hold off on additional medications for a little bit, so for right now an antibiotic injection isn't an option. And, to be honest, right now we're deciding whether additional medication will be more stress to his system than he can handle.

He's getting organic yogurt, watermelon, papaya, had watermelon 2 days ago. He's on an iron supplement so I'm pretty careful about additional hi-iron food. Ozzy and Chip have been on a modified Suncoast diet since they were babes. Ozzy is still on his fig kick -- its funny, Chip isn't interested in them at all.

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 04:01 AM

No, I haven't talked with Donna about the cancer issues, what's her ID? I'd be interested in visiting with her.

Right now Ozzy is refusing Ensure (its what we used to put his meds in), but that will probably change. Believe me, we tried everything this weekend -- he just wouldn't eat or drink, lost 8 grams.

Lynn
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 04:26 AM

i have darcys vets number 607 754 3933 can u try the bml diet its made a difference in my gliders. when ruby was sick i force fed bml 3 ccs 3 times daily maybe u can try it.
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 04:32 AM

Donna name on here is saharanfox, I see that her vets # has already been listed. Which type of Ensure are you trying? Mine would have nothing to do with any of it at first except the Wild Berry High Protein, once they got used to that one, they will drink any of them now. And they are doing wonderful on it also.

I am hoping that between you speaking with Donna and your vet speaking with her vet, maybe something can be discovered.
Prayers going out to both you and Ozzy.
Posted By: Lucy

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 02:55 PM

Lynn, I'm not sure, but I think Donna (saharanfox) is only online on Saturdays right now. I know someone has her phone number. You might try at USGN for that. I think she visits there more than here.

The loss of weight is as much a concern to me as anything right now. How about obvious favorites? Corn, avacados, etc? Ensure would have been my choice, too, given his need for nourishment, but if he won't eat it, let's keep finding things he will eat. With Gladys, we tried so many things when she first got sick -- and had some success with different things on different days until she turned the corner. We also used high quality canned cat food, at Dr. Dierenfeld's suggestion. Ozzy's got to have some nutrients going into him.

With the loss of weight and the risk of dehydration (always a concern with that kind of weight loss), I would also suggest asking your vet about supplementing calcium (neocalglucon or other liquid calcium) and having supplies for sub-q injections if it becomes necessary. I know Gretchen can help with that, but dehydration can quickly become the worst enemy.

I know how hard this is on you and Zack, and it's clear Ozzy's really fighting as hard as he can. I really pray he turns the corner soon --
Posted By: Critter Creations

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/13/04 08:21 PM

So sorry I wasn't on yesterday to see this post. I am so sorry that Ozzy isn't doing any better and getting worse. I just wanted to say that he is in my thoughts and prayers every day and night. My heart really goes out to you all. Please continue to keep us updated as we are all so worried about him. Please know we are all here for you and Ozzy.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/14/04 02:23 AM

Good day for Ozzy today (and for us too!) Zack woke him this afternoon to give gliderade and Ozzy had the energy to jump back to his cage. The extra nutrient issue was easily solved -- went to a drug store to find the different flavors of Ensure (he's been boycotting the generic strawberry) -- picked up Wild Berry and Vanilla. Tried the vanilla first and he liked it! That's good because I can get generic at Wally-World! He's still on a fig kick (FYI, the figs are health food store figs with no additives, etc). And the best news is that he's been perky and awake this evening and his nose is slightly pink in places! Past experience says this won't last, but we'll enjoy it while we can.

His vet is still trying to locate someone who can look at an extremely small volume of his blood for blood-borne bacteria and/or parasites and also someone who can run blood chemistry, etc on a smaller sample than she can do.

I plan to have his urine run again on Thursday. Will give an update then.

Lynn <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/14/04 02:36 AM

can u give him bml judies version with the jar of sweet potaoe in it if he dont eat eat the other way. my gliders didnt do well on the darcys diet. even if u have to force feed him. or try some boiled chicken breast.
Posted By: Carrie T

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/14/04 03:10 AM

Lynn, I'm so happy things have gone so well today <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/14/04 03:38 AM

WOOOHOOOO!!! Such wonderful news and I am soooo glad he is liking the Ensure!! It pulled Darcy out of a bad state.

Have you been able to get in touch with Donna (Saharnfox) as of yet or her vet?
Mine just LOVE the ensure and they are totally striving on it!
I think other both the BML and the Darcy Diet have been helpful to many gliders!

YOU GO OZZY BOY <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/multi.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/agree.gif" alt="" />...Keep up the good work!! We are all pulling for ya buddy! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" /> (and what a glider mommy you have <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />)
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/15/04 03:58 AM

He's put on 7 ounces since Sunday. Still jaundiced but acting very normal.

Lynn
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/15/04 04:38 AM

keep up the good work. maybe u can give him a little carrot apple juice its very healthy if u have a juice extractor. i give it to mine once a wk.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/17/04 04:25 PM

Any news on Ozzy?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/17/04 04:33 PM

Yeah how is little Ozzy doing? Is he improving still?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/17/04 06:18 PM

Ozzy has stabilized -- is acting normal, but is still jaundiced. He's back to being social and enjoying being with people. He is off the antibiotic, and is only taking Pet-Tinnic (iron + B vitamins) and milk thistle. Physically, Ozzy is a little "hunched over" so I know he isn't feeling wonderful and his energy isn't quite what it used to be.

He's no longer florescent yellow, but still obviously jaundiced. I'll try to get pictures taken today so we have a comparison. His weight is fluctuating between 78-89 grams (I've never weighed daily before so I don't know what is a normal daily fluctuation.) This is well within his normal weight range. No visible blood in his urine, although Monday's urinalysis showed blood (RBC) were still present.

I think he is having trouble with constipation right now. He had severe diarrhea last weekend when he was on the antibiotics. Now his stools are either really loose or he's acting like he needs to go but can't. I think I'm going to cut his iron supplement in half for a couple of days and see if that helps him to get consistent.

His vet is still looking for someone who can run blood work on an extremely small sample. Since he is a smaller glider anyway, he doesn't have much blood to give and the vet is also concerned about taxing his body more. Our plan was to have his urine checked this week, but he wouldn't be cooperative and pee on cue -- so we will try to get a urinalysis done on Monday.

That's all for now. We are definately out of crisis mode, but are continuing to deal with chronic issues. Until the cause of the jaundice and blood in the urine are identified and treated, he won't be out of the woods.

Thanks for checking in. It is so helpful to know people are there who care. As always, ideas and suggestions are appreciated. Ozzy is such a fighter, that I want to fight as hard as he is.

I'm hoping to arrange a "play date" for Chip. He is so bonded to Ozzy that he spends a lot of time in the pouch with Ozzy -- I suspect he needs to get out and socialize a bit -- so is there anyone in Missouri who would like us to come over and play?

That's all for now -- Lynn
Posted By: Carrie T

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/17/04 06:33 PM

Oh Lynn, I'd love to set a play date but we are 5 hours away from you. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> I'm so glad to hear Ozzy is doing okay. I wish it were better but we will take what we can get, Right ? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yelclap.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/18/04 04:19 PM

Yesterday evening we realized Ozzy was getting "winded" easily. After moving around he had to stop and catch his breath. Needed to rest after drinking, etc. His jaundice also is brighter. Zack stayed up last night giving him extra fluids. He didn't seem quite as bad this morning, but its hard to tell.

As far as a play date goes -- Carrie & I decided that meeting half-way would work. That's somewhere in the St. Louis area -- so, who wants to play some weekend?

Lynn
Posted By: the gliders angel

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/18/04 07:32 PM

if it were my glider i would take the drive to judies vet who is experienced with gliders i think its dr. bradley. she must know quite a lot about gliders and getting him well it would be worth the trip if your far away. its still within your state so it couldnt be more than a few hrs drive.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/18/04 09:12 PM

He has seen the vet you're referring to -- She wasn't able to draw enough blood for a blood panel, and wasn't able to get enough defination on the ultrasound to tell what was going on for sure. She wasn't sure what was causing Ozzy's problems and recommended exploratory surgery to try to find out what was wrong. Although surgery may have been the logical next step from her perspective, we decided not to have it done for a multitude of reasons.

I wouldn't mind seeing another vet -- but unless the vet has the capability to do blood work on an extremely small amount of blood, I'm not sure the trip would be worth it. Also, with Ozzy's liver so obviously compromised, I am hesitant to add any additional stress to the liver unless absolutely necessary (meaning, I don't want him to have to filter the anesthesia toxins that would be required to draw blood, and would prefer to keep him off as much medication as possible). I guess what I'm trying to say is that if the diagnostics and/or cure is going to seriously compromise his health, then why are we doing it?

Ozzy is a smaller glider (80g) and because of that he has less blood available to draw than a larger glider. When you had his compromised health into the equation that means even less is available. So, at this stage of the game, we are left with urine as a possible diagnostic tool.

My vet has the phone numbers for all the vets that were recommended by people on this board. I don't know if she is calling them for consultation, but I do know she is doing ongoing research. Unfortunately, even among the several thousand who are on this board, I've not been contacted by anyone who has dealt with the same issues that Ozzy has.

I pray a valid treatment option will be found for Ozzy -- either that or a miracle to cure him. But, realistically that may not happen. But, he's still fighting, so that means we are too.

Lynn
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/18/04 09:16 PM

My thoughts and prayers are with your little Ozzy. I hope he gets the help he needs and continues to fight, he is already a super strong fighter.

Hang in there Ozzy....your loving mommy is doing everything she can do for you little guy.

I will continue to pray for him.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy Vomiting -- What now? - 07/18/04 11:11 PM

[:"magenta"]i am so sorry you, zack, and ozzy have to go thru this. it must be like a living nightmare. i sure hope you can get ozzy better soon! [/]
Posted By: Anonymous

Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 02:08 AM

This evening, Ozzy gave up his fight. Around 6pm this evening we went to give him some gliderade. He was acting "different" and was seeming to have trouble controlling his claws (he was sticking to everything). He also was very agitated. I took him to his cage pouch to see if that would calm him. As he went to his food dish I could tell he was having a hard time using his legs. He ate a little, drank water. He then went to the bottom of the cage, munched on figs and ran a little in his wheel. Zack picked him up and Ozzy began to have what appeared to be seizures. He would bite Zack with each one then lay quietly for a while. We wrapped him in fleece and held him close, stroking him. In about ten minutes, and after several more seizures he was gone.

Lynn
Posted By: Carrie T

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 02:11 AM

I'm so sorry. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 02:13 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />I am so so sorry <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />

I was truly hoping this little guy would make it. He seemed like such a fighter. At least now he is in peace and no longer feeling any pain. I am very sorry for your loss <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />.
Posted By: Lucy

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 02:16 AM

Lynn, I am so sorry. I wish there were words that described how much we all grieve with you and Zack. Ozzy fought hard, and I'm glad you were able to be with him when he died.

If you get a necropsy and have a histopathology, I hope you'll share that with us. There's so much we can learn from Ozzy.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 02:22 AM

Im sorry for the loss of your glider. Im sure if he could comprehend all that you did for him, he would be truly gratefull. You will be in my prayers. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 02:23 AM

Yes, I too am glad we were with him. And I am really glad that this happened on a Sunday when I could be home with Zack.

Zack has decided to have a necropsy. He said that he hoped they could find what was going on so that other gliders didn't have to die like this. The vet said they could do a "cosmetic" necropsy so that Zack could bury him later.

Yes, I will share the results. Hopefully they will find something specific.

Lynn
Posted By: Srlb

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 03:02 AM

Oh Lynn.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> I am so sorry for your loss.

You have been a true role model for all of us. Know that we mourn along with you at this time. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: cyndiekb

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 03:11 AM

I just can't stop crying. I was with you thru every post pulling for you all. I can't even comprehend how you must be feeling. All I can say is I am truly sorry.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 03:21 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" />
Oh I am so very sorry to hear about Ozzy. I know he is with the others that crossed over to the rainbow bridge now and is waiting till he meats you & Zack again some day. He put up quite a fight and was a strong glider with a big heart which has touched us all. I will keep you and Zack in my thoughts and prayers. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 03:56 AM

I am so, so sorry for your loss. You and little Ozzy really had a tough time. You both fought so hard. He is now at peace and doesn't have to fight any more. Sending thoughts and hugs your way to ease the pain. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Judie

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 04:04 AM

Ozzy was so full of life and thus had a difficult time exiting. However, now he is at peace on the other side of the Rainbow Bridge. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frostyangel.gif" alt="" />

May time help heal your broken hearts. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 04:17 AM

You, Zack and especially Ozzy put up a brave fight.....he's at peace now <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/gliderangel.gif" alt="" />......our thoughts are with you guys....... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 04:33 AM

I am so sorry to hear Ozzy has passed on. Ya'll are in my <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" /> and prayers.
Posted By: Karin

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 04:37 AM

Lynn, I am so very sorry Ozzy lost his fight, but what a good try he gave his all. We are all very sad with you right now <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />.

Karin
Posted By: Merlin

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 05:01 AM

Lynn, I am very sorry about Ozzy. Did you put him back in the cage with Zack so Zack could say goodbye? Merlin
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 05:21 AM

Yes, we gave Chip (Zack's my son) several opportunities to be with Ozzy. Each time, he'd sniff him and go back to sleep. When we put Chip in his cage for dinner tonite, it was really odd. Chip started marking his scent along the areas where Ozzy was when he was last alive. We've put a stuffed toy in their sleeping pouch, and have left the pouch that Chip and Ozzy shared in the cage. Hopefully, that will be some comfort in the coming days. I was expecting Chip to be barking tonite -- He usually barks when he can't find Ozzy, but so far everything is quiet.

Lynn
Posted By: Pockets

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 05:24 AM

I am so sorry Lynn
Certainly wish I could of been more help to Ozzy
So glad you were with him - many <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 06:02 PM

That is so sad. I hope you and your son are ok and Chip as well. I am so sorry that he lost the fight. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Critter Creations

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 07:07 PM

Seeing this post just tore my heart out. I am so sorry for yours and zack's loss. Please know we are all here for you both. You are some of the best glider parents I know and have been through a lot with Ozzy and I'm just so happy you were both able to be there at the end. Ozzy knew how much he was loved and he lived a happy life with you both. He is at peace now and no longer has to fight against this illness. I'm sure you will all meet again some day. The pain of losing a loved one is really hard to go through and please know you will both be in my thoughts and prayers.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/19/04 07:09 PM

Oh Lynn I'm so sorry that you lost such a valiant fight. I think the best thing is that Ozzy knew you and Zack were there for him and that you loved him. Ultimately it is better that he let go if living only meant suffering. Huge hugs for you and Zack..I hope in time you both feel much better <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/20/04 12:12 AM

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/gliderangel.gif" alt="" /> [:"magenta"]i am so sorry to hear about ozzy. at least he wasn't alone. i am very proud of your zack! he is doing a wonderful thing by having a necropsy done. please let us know the results. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> [/]
Posted By: Charlie H

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/20/04 12:08 PM

Lynn, I am sorry Ozzy didn't make it. You and Zack did all you could.
Charlie H
Posted By: hushpuppy

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/20/04 12:18 PM

I'm sorry to hear about Ozzy, I know you did everything possible for him. You will be in my prayers.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/20/04 12:55 PM

so sorry for your loss. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/20/04 03:17 PM

I'm so sorry you lost ozzy.!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: KarenE

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/20/04 08:41 PM

[:"blue"]Words are so inadequate at times like this, but I know Ozzie was glad to be with the ones he loved at the end. I too have lost a glider after a long illness and it seemed to be easier for her that she was with me.

I will now move Ozzie's story of courage and strength to Real Stories. [/]
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/21/04 04:45 AM

things like this shouldn't happen. . . i am so very sory.
--kat
Posted By: Xfilefan

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/22/04 06:38 AM

I'm so sorry to hear about Ozzy. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crying.gif" alt="" /> He was a determined little fighter. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: BMXgirl

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/22/04 09:54 AM

Im so terribly sorry about Ozzy... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
He was a strong and brave little guy. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />
I know he knew he was loved and must have known what good care you took of him. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Im so sorry.
May your heart heal in time, and the sadness be replaced with all beautiful memories. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/heartpump.gif" alt="" />
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Ozzy didn't make it - 07/22/04 12:12 PM

I'm so sorry about Ozzy.. I can't even imagine.. time will heal... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hug2.gif" alt="" /> ... you will never forget..
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