Can anyone tell me if Zookeepers is the same as or similar to Insectivore/Carnivore, or Mazuri Omnivore, or Insectivore/Fare I'm really having a difficult time trying to get all these things straight. Also, I made my first batch of PML and it's like water!!!!!!!!, even after being in the freezer for two days. Is there something that I'm missing? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" /> The ingrediants are Honey, Water, 2 eggs, and WHP. Is there supposed to be something to thicken it up with? Thank you

OK… if you PML is still like water,, yes something is wrong with it… assuming the other stuff in you freezer is still frozen…

As for Zookeepers… I think you know have me confused…lol..

Insectivore/Fare – Insectivore/Carnivore – I believe I have read that both of these are.. the same thing…

Mazuri Omnivore – not sure I have come across that one..

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" />
I think I need to start a indexed glossary… <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nixweiss.gif" alt="" />

Insectivore/Fare is the same as ZooKeepers Secret.

I feed the same PML mix that you listed the ingredients for. It freezes like sorbet, but not like water. It is not frozen solid but it is frozen. It's kinda like a slush.

Hope I made sense <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Correct me PLEASE.... if wrong....

Promise I will take note… <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

Yes they are the same thing but diffrent company. I also have made my first batch of the PML, yes it is very watery but remember we do not add all of those extras in this mix it is rather simple. You can add from what I was told the Xanthan Gum for thickening but im not sure as to the measurements. Talk with Debbie she is always willing to help. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumb.gif" alt="" />

Have you ever looked at the ingredients of Insectivore Fare? The name is a little misleading! Since you are doing diet research dig a little deeper. Look at each ingredient and do a search on their sources. Then ask yourself if you really want to feed this product to your gliders. This is a good practice for any commercial food item.
Charlie H

Zookeepers secret is actually insectivore fare.. it's just renamed before it's resold by some vendors. I have fed insectivore and have sold it for years and have never had any health issues with my gliders... i believe it is a find product to use with your suggies as long as it's used as part of a proven diet.

Look over this list of ingredients and tell me that in your heart you can say this is a list of fine products to feed a glider. I am not diet bashing but think the public should be aware of what they are feeding their gliders:

INGREDIENTS

Porcine By-Products, Fish Meal, Poultry By-Product Meal, Shrimp Meal, Wheat Flour, Dried Bakery Products, Crushed Roasted Peanuts, Dried Kelp, Fructose Sugar, Corn Syrup Solids, Water, Spirulina, Lactic Acid, Phosphoric Acid, Calcium Propionate (Preservative), Iodized Salt, Calcium Carbonate, Concentrated Carotene, Calcium Chloride, Propylene Glycol, Vitamin E Supplement, Taurine, Vitamin A Acetate with D-Activated Animal Sterol (source of vitamin D-3), Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Riboflavin, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Choline Chloride, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex (source of Vitamin K activity), Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamin Mononitrate, Ascorbic Acid, Sodium Selenite, Manganous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Ethylene Diamine Dihydriodide., Magnesium Sulfate, P-Amino benzoic Acid, Folic Acid, Sulfur, Biotin, Natural and Artificial Flavors.
Now with taurine added

The first four ingredients would stop me. Not to mention the crushed roasted peanuts and corn syrup solids. Did you ever wonder what Porcine By-Products or Poultry By-Product Meal are made from? Also I would like to know how these items can be stored safely without refrigeration. Could it be because preservatives are added?
Charlie H

As for the PML, my freezer is working alright. I'm glad to know that it is supposed to be like a slush. Is this supposed to be served as a "drink"? because after I take it out of the freezer it instantly turns to a watery mixture. Do I mix other items into it like the fruits/veggies? Can I thicken it with the Acacia Gum or the above mentioned - Xanthan Gum? As for the Zookeepers, thank-you Charlie for the ingrediants. Geezzzzzzz all this is sure confusing. I wonder if the manufacturers of these pre-made foods for Gliders have done thourgh research to determine that the additives/preservitives are safe for glider consumption. ie: Zookeepers, Briskies, Glider Grub, Cat food, Monkey Biscuts, etc. I've read so many conflicting reports on everything that's been developed, this isn't good, that isn't good, do this, don't do that, to much of this, to much of that, where will it end? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worried2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/needhug.gif" alt="" />

If you are following Delaney's diet, which Booth & Ness approve of, it is suggested to use 50% insectivore/carnivore type of diet along with 50% Leadbeater's mixture. This can consist of many different items - I choose mostly boiled chicken & very select lean deli meats,along with select bisquits, etc. I do offer Insectivore-Fare but my <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" />'s do not like it!

Everything else is considered as treats & only 5-10% of my <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" />'s diet

Yes the PML is a bit liquidy or slushy & I feed it in a dish, not a bowl. It also needs to be in freezer for several hours - Personally I would not add to the mixture but others certainly can do as they like.

Charlie there was no so-called Dr. Leadbeater of the sugar glider world, so I hardly think he could or would endorse BML of any type!
Mr Leadbeater was a working person & had nothing at all to do with <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/littleglider.gif" alt="" /> diets! Mis-information runs amuck on websites!

Pockets you need to dig a little deeper into the background of Leadbeater. He was a naturalist from England. Not only is the Leadbeater possum named for him but also a couple of Australian cockatoos. He introduced the Leadbeaters Cockatoos to the London zoo in 1834. Quiet an accomplishment for a labouror! There were some laborers that migrated to Australia but that was several years later. And other people with the Leadbeater name were well known because of their religious writtings.

I still wouldn't offer food to my gliders that contains the listed ingredients as porcine or poultry by-products.
Charlie H

someone is always going to find something wrong with ANY food for any creature (humans and non humans alike).... my gliders are happy and healthy using insectivore as part of their diet for just about four years ... i am well capable of reading ingredients as an educated human being and dont' think this is the first time I've read them... I am well aware of what I am feeding my sugar gliders.

This was about the name of zookeepers not the ingredients so maybe we should get back on topic

As for the PML, mine is a slushy too so you have nothing to worry about <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I offer the PML mix in a shallow bowl, seperate from anything else. They love it just the way it is and I've never felt the need to mix anything with it.

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/roflmao.gif" alt="" />
Charlie I don't think I need to look a bit deeper for more information -


Leadbeater's possum was first discribed from two animals from the banks of the Bass River near Westernport, south-eastern Victoria in July 1867 by Sir Frederick McCoy Professor of Biology at the University of Melbourne & Director of the National Museum of Victoria.

McCoy gave the possums the specific name leadbeateri in honour of John Leadbeater (1831-88),the taxidermist at the Museum of Victoria who was responsible for the preparation of the specimens from which the species was described. Leadbeater, who came from a family of taxidermists, transplanted the family business from England to Australia, where he continued the tradition.
The possum was not the only animal in Leadbeater's honour, the Pink or Major Mitchell Cockatoo bears the scientific name Cacatua leadbeateri

Please excuse my confusion but is PML different from BML or is it a typo?

It is a different mixture & is the closest I can come to the original Leadbeater's mixture, which was created by Des Hackett.
If you go to the diet links you can view it!

(Thank you Eddie) <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/agree.gif" alt="" />

Back to my original question in regards to the PML, once the PML is out of the freezer is it supposed to go from a "slush" to a "watery form"? within just a few minutes.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/worried2.gif" alt="" /> thank you

yes it will melt... just like ice melts.. and since the pml doesn't get as solid as ice it melts faster <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thank you for your answers. One last question, what is the safest time period on keeping the PML out for them to eat.
ie: how long can it stay out unrefrigerated? My biggest concern is "spoilage" I have been keeping (in the past) their BML out for them to eat on during the day because at night they don't seem to want to eat anything except nibble on their veggies and only a few selections of fruit they are picky with their fruit, so I try and get them to eat their main staple during the daytime as licky treats, but since the PML is so liquidy I don't know if this will be alright for them. Thanks again