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How close is too close? #196439
01/06/07 01:17 PM
01/06/07 01:17 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,884
Wyoming
tbull Offline OP
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tbull  Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,884
Wyoming
When it comes to breeding, how close is too close? Will you get inbreeding problems with 1st or 2nd cousins? I saw the kinship chart (which is great) and it says it is line breeding and close line breeding.

Opinions please, OK or NO WAY!

2nd question: If I bred a 100% het with a 50% het what % would the normal colored joeys be until the 50% is proven?


T~
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Re: How close is too close? [Re: tbull] #196441
01/06/07 01:19 PM
01/06/07 01:19 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,295
Chicago, IL
FURBYnGIZMO Offline
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Posts: 3,295
Chicago, IL

Here is an awesome link to a chart posted a few days ago from another member clap
Kinship Chart
Not sure if this is the same chart you're talking about but it made things clear for me dunno




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Furby -- Kalila -- Deuce -- Gizmo

Furby :grey: Kalila :wfb: Deuce :leu:

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Re: How close is too close? [Re: tbull] #196443
01/06/07 01:24 PM
01/06/07 01:24 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,087
Manitowoc, WI
BeckiT Offline
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BeckiT  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,087
Manitowoc, WI
until that 50% is proven, I believe all the babies would be grey. As far as the line breeding, with leus/leu hets it's really hard to not line breed with such a small gene pool currently...

I'm sure one of the breeders who is experienced with leus/lue hets will be along soon to correct me if i'm wrong wink

Re: How close is too close? [Re: BeckiT] #196552
01/06/07 07:02 PM
01/06/07 07:02 PM

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I am not sure of the math but they would be some where between a 50% het and a less then a 66% het. Because
100% het x 100% het breeding make 66% hets
and a
100% het and normal make 50% hets

How many other relatives are related to the pair you are thinking of getting?

Re: How close is too close? [Re: ] #196569
01/06/07 07:41 PM
01/06/07 07:41 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 9,173
Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
Judie Offline
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Judie  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 9,173
Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
I have a 50% Possible Leu Het/WF Blonde that is totally unrelated to the above 100% Leu Het.

The father: Adam is a 2nd generation WF Blonde. The mother: Maggie is a 100% Leu Het from the Wild Caught gliders known as Mac (Platinum) and Cheese (BEW).

Pairing results of a 100% Leu Het with a Possible 50% Leu Het in their offspring... close to 60% of the offspring produced will be 100% Leu Hets. 40% will be nomal. This is why the price changes beween a 100% Ht, Possible 66% and a Possible 50%.

And the WF Blonde gene should express itself in 50% of the offspring produced wither 100% Hets or Grays.

Because the Leu Lines are still rather close.... some of the best breeding will be achieved when breeding 66% and 50% to the BEW. It introduces outside blood while still line breeding.

Hets are very valuable in a breeding program. Shame that most do not follow the theory when breeding for the BEW.


Last edited by Judie; 01/06/07 08:02 PM.
Re: How close is too close? [Re: Judie] #196603
01/06/07 09:19 PM
01/06/07 09:19 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 9,173
Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
Judie Offline
Serious Glideritis
Judie  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 9,173
Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
First three generations is what counts when line breeding. Anything after that is too far removed.

When line breeding... cousins, uncle and aunts are acceptable.

The Leu lines as of now appear to be sound. Genetic problems though as in all animals do not just come from close inbreeding. They can be introduced into a line from an unrelated animal. Thus it is most important to know your lineages of the animals one is breeding.


Re: How close is too close? [Re: Judie] #196615
01/06/07 09:47 PM
01/06/07 09:47 PM

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Personally, I have thought about that a lot. I think that 3rd cousins is about the closest you should go. I am sure you could do 2nd cousins and be fine as long as there is no other inbreeding in the lineage. I am no expert here...just my opinion.

Re: How close is too close? [Re: ] #196666
01/06/07 11:03 PM
01/06/07 11:03 PM

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I am no breeding expert but a genetics geek...if we are talking just about the leu gene, which is an autosomal recessive gene...

If you are crossing two gliders that are hets...if they both actually are leu hets then the probability is that 25% of your babies will be leus and 75% will be normal grays. That is if they are both actually leu hets...

If your other glider is not actually a leu het, then all of the babies would turn out as normal grays.


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