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Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! #410904
11/04/07 10:08 PM
11/04/07 10:08 PM

N
NickieDo
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NickieDo
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N



Ok, I have my first pair of Suggies coming home on the 15th The lady told me that she is feeding them cat food plus lots of fruits.

I know that thats not a sufficient diet, and so I have been doing research on diets, but i just simply do not know which one to try. Also The female has 2 joeys IP so i'm needing suggestions on switching them over to a healthier diet.



Here are my questions

1. what do you feed and why?

2. what are the pros/cons to each diet?

3. how do I need to transition them from what they are eating now to the new diet?

4. Once OOP, will the joeys need a special diet?

Thanks in advance, the choices and information online have made my head spin!

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410912
11/04/07 10:26 PM
11/04/07 10:26 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,420
Twin Cities, MN
cinnamonstix Offline
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cinnamonstix  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,420
Twin Cities, MN
1. what do you feed and why?

What I feed can be found here:
http://www.sugarglider.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=402151&fpart=1
I have a joey from GliderLove here...that was how I was introduced to the diet

2. what are the pros/cons to each diet?

I like it because it is all natural and the gliders get a variety and all their natural vitamins from their food sources. Due to the variety...mine eat wonderful. My rescues put on weight and look healthy and great on this diet.

Con:you may spend a descent amount of time each night preparing it...I have NO problem with this...and the gliders love their dinner...but be prepared to spend a little time preparing each night...or if you buy fresh fruit and clean, cut and freeze...it is time consuming...but I feel worth it. I also feed home dried fruits and veggies as snacks...they are GREAT and so healthy.

3. how do I need to transition them from what they are eating now to the new diet?

Generally you want to wean them...being as they rae eating cat food...BAD...do not give them cat food again...shame on the previous owner. Give them what they are used to friut-wise...but start with getting protein and veggies into them too. They are VERY good for them...and whatever diet you do choose...there will be veggies and protein included one way or another as these are essential things for the gliders well being...so I would say...get them and get them started fresh right away...

4. Once OOP, will the joeys need a special diet?

Before the babies even come out...start supplementing the mom with Wombaroo Milk...it is good for her and the joeys...and being on this POOR diet...you will need to get this milk for her and the babies...ASAP is never TOO soon...lol

Joeys will nurse for some time and then start tasting the foods you offer mom and dad...and shouls start eating...that should be weaned and ready to move on at 8-10 weeks oop. When you are comfortable and you KNOW they can survive on their own.

***do you plan to keep or find new homes for the joeys? If you plan to keep them and home them with mom and dad...be ready to neuter any males in the cage to prevent inbreeding...this included dad and ANY sons born.


~GWEN~
Crazy Hubby Dru
Tortoise: Vork
Cats: Scooby, Swiper, Zero, Dinah & Sykes
Suggies: Meeko, Willow & Nemo; Rei, Rafiki & Rajah; Opal, Lily & Link; Tael, Tatl & Navi; Kristoff Krabbs & Crabby Patty
:rbridge: Fern, Cjarsa, Syfka, Icarus, Ivy, Howie & Gracie

www.cinnamonstix-n-sugar.com
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410913
11/04/07 10:28 PM
11/04/07 10:28 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,212
Garland, TX
Mel2mdl Offline
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Mel2mdl  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,212
Garland, TX
Wow - two posts and already hitting the hot topics~way to go! grin
Originally Posted By: NickieDo

Here are my questions

1. what do you feed and why?


I have used two diets - BML and HPW. I switched to HPW diet because I liked the choices in fruit and veggies and because of my then 5 gliders, only two really liked BML

Originally Posted By: NickieDo

2. what are the pros/cons to each diet?


Pros to BML - easy to make, no guess work (all the fruits and veggies are pre-selected), can get ingredients at almost any WalMart and pet store.

Cons to BML - Smell, not all gliders like it.

Pros to HPW - very easy to make, uses small amounts of expensive ingredients (HPW powder and bee pollen) so is fairly cheap, tastes really good - most suggies love it.

Cons to HPW - have to watch the veggies for Ca:P ratios, has a lot of honey in it, you may eat more than your suggies! roflmao

Originally Posted By: NickieDo

3. how do I need to transition them from what they are eating now to the new diet?


If they are on a bad diet, just switch. They will probably clear their plates for awhile. I would recommend BML as it has brought sick gliders back to health and has most of what they need to get healthy. You can switch to a different diet later.

Originally Posted By: NickieDo

4. Once OOP, will the joeys need a special diet?


I really don't know this one - all my boys have been neutered. BUT, nursing mom's require more protein. On the HPW diet, up the powder to half a cup instead of a fourth. I think there is a joey recipe for BML.

I want to congratulate you on recognizing a poor diet and knowing you need to switch. You may want to go to Suz's website to look at how to handle rejected joeys as that can happen with moms who are under stress. Good luck and hope you have wonderful gliders soon!


Molly, son & husband:

Chairman Meow
Oscar & Thomas
Sam, Diego, Delilah, Delia :wfb:
Nevada, Noel
Marcel, Dakota, Latte
Dexter, Didi, Almond, Joy and Fitz
:grey:
Karl,Lenny,Jynxie,Chamille, Kee & Mr. Beans in my heart forever.
Teaching teenagers-part joy, part guerilla warfare! :rbridge:
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410917
11/04/07 10:39 PM
11/04/07 10:39 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
S
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
sugarlope  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
S

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
This is a great link explaining most of the common diets and where they came from/why they came about (although HPW is not on the list, but you can do a search here for more info on that diet and any of the others that interest you). You just have to look into the cost/time/availability of ingredients where you are/etc. between the diets and choose the one that you are the most comfortable with. While there are a lot of choices, it sounds like you already have a good grasp on what is recommended and what is not, and even if everyone agreed that one particular diet was better (which will probably never happen, btw roflmao ) if. your glider doesn't eat it, then it isn't the best diet for you and you have to re-adjust (most of us have run into this from time to time). You'll make the right decision. thumb

3) There are many suggestions on how you could transition diets, but generally when going from a poorer diet to a better diet, you just want to get them on it (particularly when IP joeys are involved) so I would probably just do a straight switch.

4) The joeys will watch and learn from their parents and eat whatever they do as they get closer to weaning. There is no reason to change the diet. Some people cut smaller chunks of fruits/vegs, but the joeys can bite it off also, so that isn't really necessary, but again personal preference.



~Gretchen

If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: sugarlope] #410925
11/04/07 10:51 PM
11/04/07 10:51 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,970
Spring, Texas
Trigger Offline
Glider Addict
Trigger  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,970
Spring, Texas
I have a rescue that was on a terrible diet dry kibble mixture and occasional grapes. He has been on Judies BML for 3 weeks now and has started to fill out, coat much better... he is starting to look like the pics of all the beautiful healthy gliders I've seen on here. The BML diets seem to really have it all covered and it is SO easy. I love it.


-(`v)-MO MONEY!-(`v)-
kids Chance, Dylan, John, & Kayla
Skittles, Snupi, Snuki, Lucy, Shanu, Caspian, Ivy, Kalysta, Kaliya, Santee, Cheyenne, Apache, Comanche, Twirpy, Meribelle, Santeria, Shyamalan, Sebastian, Zoey, Naira & Katsu
www.jensfuzzyfriends.com
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: sugarlope] #410933
11/04/07 11:00 PM
11/04/07 11:00 PM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



My main concern is the IP joeys since the mother is not on a very good diet.

what exactly is the HPW?

I was thinking about the BML diet, but then started reading more, and some people are very against it...as well as other diets so it left me wondering what i should do.

To answer a previous question... if I keep the joeys the males will be fixed, as well as daddy.

where can I get the wombaroo milk? (I'm getting all of my supplies...and trying to choose and perpare a diet before they come home...I just want to be prepared)

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410938
11/04/07 11:08 PM
11/04/07 11:08 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,420
Twin Cities, MN
cinnamonstix Offline
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cinnamonstix  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,420
Twin Cities, MN
Actually I am not sure if Wombaroo is available...you can get brisky's from here:
http://www.suzsugargliders.com/forsalenectars.htm

as for deciding what you should do...it is all up to you...and really, only You can make the decision on what to feed...we can all give you the opinions on our diets, and past ones we may have used...but opinions will vary per person...just do what you feel is right and best for you and your gliders...none will be a bad choice...

Glad to hear you will be fixing you boys...you rae going to have a big happy family/colony...CONGRATS!!!


~GWEN~
Crazy Hubby Dru
Tortoise: Vork
Cats: Scooby, Swiper, Zero, Dinah & Sykes
Suggies: Meeko, Willow & Nemo; Rei, Rafiki & Rajah; Opal, Lily & Link; Tael, Tatl & Navi; Kristoff Krabbs & Crabby Patty
:rbridge: Fern, Cjarsa, Syfka, Icarus, Ivy, Howie & Gracie

www.cinnamonstix-n-sugar.com
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410948
11/04/07 11:16 PM
11/04/07 11:16 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
S
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
sugarlope  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
S

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
Ok, I said link - here it is: http://www.sugargliders.org/modules.php?name=Content&pa=list_pages_categories&cid=1

As I said, with joeys IP, I would do an immediate switch on diets to get her on something good. If you go to the top of the forum, there is a search button. You can search for HPW there (there are several posts about it on the board, but my computer/online is not cooperating tonight - sorry).

There are several members that sell Wombaroo, or you can search the internet for 'Wombaroo High Protein" and come up with some pages/businesses that sell it. Sorry I can't help more than suggesting searches right now. Good luck!


~Gretchen

If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: cinnamonstix] #410955
11/04/07 11:21 PM
11/04/07 11:21 PM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



Since they are used to eating cat food, would it be easier to switch them to a pellet diet such as happy glider, plus offering veggies/fruits etc?

Or a straight switch to BML?

with BML will I need glideraid?

I hate that i'm such a noob lol but I figured y'all are seasoned enough to offer some wonderful advice.

where can i find more on the HPW diet?

Thanks again, I'm hopefully going to get all this confusion sorted out!

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: sugarlope] #410958
11/04/07 11:22 PM
11/04/07 11:22 PM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



so the wombaroo high protein is the same as wombaroo milk?

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: sugarlope] #410959
11/04/07 11:23 PM
11/04/07 11:23 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
S
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
sugarlope  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
S

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
Yes, Wombaroo is available (there are several places that sell it online). Brisky nectar is a very different product. The Wombaroo is an Australian made High Protein supplement, the nectar is just a nectar supplement like gliderade.


~Gretchen

If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: sugarlope] #410960
11/04/07 11:25 PM
11/04/07 11:25 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
S
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
sugarlope  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
S

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
No, there is Wombaroo milk replacer and Wombaroo High Protein Supplement. They are both made by the same company, but for different purposes. You was the HPS for the HPW diet.


~Gretchen

If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: sugarlope] #410964
11/04/07 11:31 PM
11/04/07 11:31 PM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



Ok...i searched for wombaroo milk and found this... http://www.sugar-gliders.com/wombaroo.htm

does anyone know anything about this?

is the new one ok to use? Is there a comparable product?

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410965
11/04/07 11:34 PM
11/04/07 11:34 PM

L
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
L



That is the product you would need for the HPW diet. Here is another place you can buy it. I use Judie's BML but I have ordered other products from them and they are good to deal with:
http://www.exoticnutrition.com/Glider-Supplements.htm

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410968
11/04/07 11:36 PM
11/04/07 11:36 PM

L
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
L



Actually, I am not so sure you found the right one. It needs to say "high protein wombaroo supplement".

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410975
11/04/07 11:46 PM
11/04/07 11:46 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
S
sugarlope Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
sugarlope  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
S

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 19,742
in my happy place
Angel is right, it needs to say High Protein Supplement. The HPS is not a milk or milk replacer, and there is nothing comparable to Wombaroo HPS. Search for 'Wombaroo High Protein supplement' and you will get several hits, but it is different than Wombaroo milk. Exotic Nutrition (the link in Angel's post) sells both the milk and HPS, make sure you are getting the correct one.


~Gretchen

If we never loved, then maybe we would never feel pain. Love anyway. It's worth it.
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410978
11/04/07 11:50 PM
11/04/07 11:50 PM

L
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
L



This is the HPW diet:
http://www.gliderdad79.com/hpw.php
This is the diet I use and have successfully for several months:
http://www.toandfrogliders.com/FileHierarchy/InfoPouch/NewJoeyOwners/SupplyLinks/BML.htm

You do not have to use glideraide, it is just a great way to supplement, and they absolutely love it!!! I give it 3 times a week. You can get all ingredients except the rep-cal and herpivite at your local walmart. The other two you can get at most pet stores.

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: sugarlope] #410995
11/05/07 12:00 AM
11/05/07 12:00 AM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



I think I may either do the HPW or the BML for now, I'm leaning a little closer to the HPW.

Dang, I never knew that I'd have such a hard decision to make even before they are home lol But i know the little guys are worth it, especially once they are here, healthier and happier!

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #410999
11/05/07 12:05 AM
11/05/07 12:05 AM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



Ok, so after more reading on that link, it says that gliders switching from catfood may have a hard time adjusting to eating chicken etc. and suggests a pelleted food.

In my situation, should I also include a pellet food like happy glider?

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #411006
11/05/07 12:24 AM
11/05/07 12:24 AM

L
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
L



I am not sure in your particular case, but most of the time it is only if the diet specifies. You might be surprised at how quickly they will take to the new diet. Most diets have some amount of honey and they like sweet.

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #411013
11/05/07 12:33 AM
11/05/07 12:33 AM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



Ok, I think I have decided on the HPW diet, so now i just need to buy my ingredients smile

THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH!!!!!


wow, y'all are seriously a big help & i'll be able to sleep tonight lol

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #411137
11/05/07 10:55 AM
11/05/07 10:55 AM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,089
Central Connecticut
BCChins Offline
Glider Addict
BCChins  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,089
Central Connecticut
http://www.critterlove.com/site/
sells all the ing. you need to make HPW.

Good Luck and keep us posted on your new Gliders.

Welcome to GC


Have a Good Day
Brenda &
Mr. Magoo

Friendly Reminder please have an e-collar ready before you need it......
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: BCChins] #411162
11/05/07 11:46 AM
11/05/07 11:46 AM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



*Edited to say* the link to that store does not work.

Last edited by NickieDo; 11/05/07 11:48 AM.
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #411182
11/05/07 12:38 PM
11/05/07 12:38 PM

L
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
ltlrdangel
Unregistered
L



Here is someone else that sells the items you need. They are a member here, and I here they are very good to deal with:
http://www.toandfrogliders.com/

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #411346
11/05/07 04:43 PM
11/05/07 04:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,874
Eastern NC
melek007 Offline
Glider Addict
melek007  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,874
Eastern NC
Congrats on the gliders and picking a diet! clap thumb I also use the HPW diet; my crew likes it a lot, and it's a bit easier than the previous proven diet they were on (in case someone else has to feed them, I don't have to worry about them not getting the correct amounts of vitamins. I'm so overprotective when it comes to my babies! wink ).

While many of us say that the diets we use are easy, we have experience using them. If you have ANY questions, just ask. When I first started feeding my gliders, I wanted to make sure I had done it right (and I'm a bit of a perfectionist). A little too much effort (worry, actually) went into it in the beginning. You'll get used to glider nutrition soon enough, until then... take a deep breath and relax. thumb


I ordered the wombaroo supplement and bee pollen from To and Fro Gliders.

Last edited by melek007; 11/05/07 04:46 PM. Reason: added info

~ I miss my Alev, Nese & Levent ~
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: melek007] #411568
11/06/07 01:09 AM
11/06/07 01:09 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 9,910
Phoenix, AZ
KattyM Offline
Serious Glideritis
KattyM  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 9,910
Phoenix, AZ
For future reference, here are some sources for the HPW ingredients:

Critter Love sells bee pollen and HPW
Exotic Nutrition sells HPW, bee pollen, and gliderade
My Sweet Gliders sells the powder
Stakich, Inc. sells Australian pollen

I would PM Peggy to let her know her link isn't working.


Forever owned in my heart by my :grey: "Eight is Enough" colony:

:rbridge:
2002: Keiko (F) + 2003: Hiroshi (M) = 2004: joey Tomoki (M)
2009: Sammy (F), Charlie (F), Murray (M), Herbie (M)
2010: BJ (M)
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: KattyM] #411685
11/06/07 10:01 AM
11/06/07 10:01 AM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



Thanks!

Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #411947
11/06/07 05:01 PM
11/06/07 05:01 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 63
Devon
eccles Offline
Out of Pouch
eccles  Offline
Out of Pouch

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 63
Devon
There is nothing wrong with feeding high quality cat biscuit as part of a diet I have been doing it for my lot and they are all happy and healthy, obviously I work with the ratios and neutritions required quite strictly but I have cat biscuit as part of my diet and have no problems, Just becuase soemone feeds fruit veg and cat biscuit do not assume that they diet is going to be bad it may be great (not saying all people that feed cat food are great just saying dont assume they are all bad please)

I have heard good things about HPW as well good luck with your new diet


www.southwest-sugargliders.co.uk

For all your UK and EU sugar glider needs!
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: eccles] #412039
11/06/07 07:15 PM
11/06/07 07:15 PM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



I never said they were bad people :), I just personally do not think cat food would be good for a glider, since it can be hard on the kidneys of other non-feline animals.

I'm sure everyone has their own theories and opinions on each diet, which is why I posted on here asking for opinions. As I have been reading you could ask 100 people about each glider diet and get 100 different answers as to what/how they feed their gliders. This thread was not meant to spark debate, about HPW or any other diet. I'm just looking for some diet advice/suggestions/experience.

One a side note: I've heard horrible and wonderful things about Pit Bulls, which encouraged me to do my own research and making my own decision about rescuing one. smile

*edited to re-word*

Last edited by NickieDo; 11/06/07 07:17 PM.
Re: Diet Decisions, making my head spin! HELP! [Re: ] #412074
11/06/07 08:31 PM
11/06/07 08:31 PM

N
NickieDo
Unregistered
NickieDo
Unregistered
N



Ok...these little guys may be home as soon as this Friday YIKES!
So do you all think it would be ok to make one batch of BML and then switch them over to HPW? I don't know how long shipping will take and I can't order anything until I get my new debit card. frown

ideas? suggestions?

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