Sekwaf is now 4 mos old & has his penis out A LOT (way more than any boy I've ever had) - I try to put KY jelly on it whenever I notice it out for too long just because I have always been scared that it would dry out. Well today he had just one fork out & I was putting KY on it when the other fork popped out of the sheath - it looked really icky & swollen, kinda white-ish too. I took him to the vet (I just happened to already have an appointment for his neuter consult) - she said it really doesn't look like he's been chewing on it, just like he's been playing with it too much. The white was skin that had come off, but was still soft & attached in places - kind of like he had rubbed his penis raw on that one fork. She has asked me to stop using the KY & switch to an opthalmic triple antibiotic ointment 4 times a day to keep it moist. She said he may get a scab, but it shouldn't turn necrotic. She also said that the neuter should help curb this behavior.

Has anyone ever had this happen? I'm super worried about him - I really don't think he is SMing because he is with me a lot & I've never noticed any SM behavior, though he does lick himself a lot. His neuter has been scheduled for Monday.

He's just like a man isn't he? Mine are too little for me to have gone thru that yet but I'll keep my fingers crossed for yours.

It sure seems like one way or another he is going to have mommys undying devotion-little booger. I have no medical advice or experience w/this one-thank goodness. Hope the new ointment clears things up quickly and the neuter calms his odd desires. Hang in there Gina-2008 is almost over and you've got to have a calmer year concerning critter medical issues next year!!

I hope everything goes ok!

Gosh Gina really don't have any experience with this. Poppy one of my joeys always would have his penis out a lot but I never put KY on it just kind of watch it. He seemed to get over it. So it didn't become a problem.

Hope Sekwaf does ok! Just like a boy!

Arg - I've been putting on the ointment a bit more often because he STILL hasn't put it away & it dries up fast. I just went to put some more ointment on it & the tip of the one fork feels crunchy & is darker red than the other side. I don't know what to do - should I keep him away from the colony for the evening? Will they mess with it? Should I take him back to the vet in the morning since it seems to be getting worse? Monday just seems so far away right now...

Crunchy? that can not be good

I would keep putting in the ointment diligently. Is he still playing with it or trying to clean it?

I wouldn't put him in with the colony if it is still sticking out and noticeably different, I am afraid they may try to "help" him clean it.

He's not touching it at all - but he's been in my bra all day where I've been able to monitor him. I just don't know what he'll do once he's awake and active.

Hi Gina,
I am so sorry to hear this is going on with Sekwaf. I have no experience in this area but I hope the little one is ok.

Pat

Oh man.. I'm soo sorry! I hope he'll be ok!

Poor wittle man! I hope he gets to havin' everything back to normal soon!

I hope that it doesn't get out of control with him and get necrotic. Yes, the neutering should help to curb his little man urges.

Just makes me thankful I have little girls.Whew.

Hi Gina,

Sorry you are having problems.......................Got an ecollar handy??? I have a little experience with penis issues. Spencer messed with his all the time then one night started going after himself good. I would check every 1 to 2 hours all night or put a collar on him when you are not with him. Its amazing how something as simple as an ecollar will save a penis overgrooming males life.

Well, I spoke to Bourbon & Mary earlier. We were concerned that separating him may cause more undo stress. I have decided to separate Panda and Little instead, since they are the two most likely to mess with him.

Mary also told me what to put on it to help it retract & keep it moist through the night. It has retracted some, but the very tip is still exposed, so I will need to keep that from drying out.

I am going to call the vet first thing tomorrow & see if they can get him in before Monday for the neuter. Hopefully, there will be no amputation involved.

Hey Gina, Jen (xfilefan) gave me a call this morning & asked me to post for her since she can't get on a computer.
She said that "Anywhere else on a glider if you get white to clearish coloring it is not an issue. However on the penis white to clear white is pre-necrosis tissue, with a better chance of the tissue dying than not dying. Keep a very very close eye on him. If it is a hormonal problem, neutering is great, however they will probably want to take the pom. Jen continued to say that this was very similar to Riker's initial problems. Please keep a collar on hand just to be on the safe side."

Thank you Chris - I don't have experience in this area, but my "mommy instict" tells me that this fork needs to come off.

I was up all night with him making sure it stayed moist. Every 6hrs he got the prep-h, and in between I was using the neosporin/ky about every hour or two.

About 11pm last night it popped out about an inch and has not retracted at all since then The one fork that was injured is still a bit crusty at the tip & the tip has also darkened up quite a bit - it is not black, but it is very dark purple-ish red.

I called the vet when they opened this morning, but Dr. Jones isn't in today - they said she'll be in at 8:30 tomorrow morning. So I guess my only option is to keep doing what I'm doing until then. If he needs to have the one fork amputated, then I'll have her do a consult with Mary's vet, Dr. Fronefield.

I think it is starting to bother him a bit because he lets out a short hiss when I apply the ointment. He has also started trying to groom the area. He is not actually going for his penis, just grooming around it.

I am considering separating him tonight because Monster has been very interested in it after I apply the ointment. I don't know if its the right thing to do or not, but I don't want any further damage being done. He will be in my bra today (as soon as he settles down a bit).

Gina,
I went through something similar with one of Shelle's gliders, Jynx.

He did end up having the penis amputation. Do not let them cut past the fork. Dr. Bradley said (with Jynx) that the shaft portion before the fork is pretty intricate and should not be amputated unless ABSOLUTELY necessary. With him getting neutered, he won't notice any change in himself with the fork being gone. That portion of the penis is for mating purposes.

He should also be on some oral antibiotics as well as the topical. (like the opthamalic ointment idea as it is made for very delicate tissue) Also, pain meds since he is starting to act like he is hurting (the hissing while you apply the ointment).

The dark red tissue indicates severe irritation/possible infection. You will definately be able to tell the difference if it does turn necrotic.

Jynx did not "bother" himself for the first 24 hours and then all of a sudden (while I was holding him) tried to go after himself. Keep an ecollar at hand and use if if you have to. Dr. Fromfeld is great. Also, Dr. Bradley will do phone consult with your vet if needed. She did great with Jynx and he healed up fine and has had no more issues.

Wow, Gina! I'm just catching up with everything...and all the advice I could give you (the KY, Prep H, and calling MaryH, Bourbon or Dancing) you've already done. Dark purple in a warped way is a GOOD sign that there's still blood circulating to that area...although it's probably irritated as all get out, hence the hissing. (betcha any kind of ointment or even KY stings!)

It also sounds like separation is becoming a must-do, since Monster wants to try & "help out".

I'll be praying REAL HARD for you & him that things at worst "plateau" out and DON'T get worse!

Prep-h is great if swelling is why it is out. If not or if the tissue is raw (meaning it could be absorbed and cause further irritation) you might want to discontinue.

Like I told Chris, I wasn't sure if he was on orals or not-if not he needs them asap.

Dark red anywhere else, similar to the whitish/clear-wouldn't be the concern it is here. Again, it's a pre necrotic state. SM can start suddenly and without warning if the pain threshold is breached-one second fine and the next his teeth are out instead of his tongue when he goes for it. Personally I would use a collar, simply because the single bite I saw Riker land on his happened with him in my lap and I was looking at him when he did it-unfortunately they are quicker than we are. Also, if he does lick at it-the abrasion of the tongue can cause further entry opportunity for unfriendly bacteria.

Since this seems to be a puberty onset issue (Riker's was), and if they can't come up with a UTI, which is one of the rarer forms of SM but does happen, I'd also recommend pom OFF neuter and a collar until healed. Here's why:

In cases where hormones are not an issue, leaving the pom is the safest way to neuter-since no glue or stitches need be used. However, the scrotal sac (pom), similar to the female uterus, DOES produce a small amount of hormone. That is why pom on gliders frequently will still sport a small or occasional bald spot that comes/goes.

In cases where hormones ARE an issue, as much as possible needs to be eliminated or chance of relapse goes up later-neutered or not. Yes, recovery is longer, and chance of post neuter SM is greater, since glue or a stitch needs to close the hole that now goes straight into the abdomen, but long term should be a better, less worrisome outcome. Most gliders neutered at puberty (as Riker was) with pom removed, will never show a bald spot at all. They'll look just like a girl except for the absence of the pouch. This doesn't mean something couldn't happen later on due to a painful UTI, etc, but not from a hormonal standpoint. Although I would think it possible, if suspected to be the cause, that the pom could be removed later, I don't know of a case it has been done, and would think it may as well be done at the outset if that's the potential issue.

I'll watch for updates as I can, and you can call me as well if needed-though you have a great amount of support already. to you and Sekwaf

Tons of hugs and hopes to Sekwaf. I have ALL boys, and Hammy is the ONLY one who touches his worm.

Gina - this happened to my little Pepe' in the early 90's and my vet did have to amputate - didn't bother him in the slightest - so don't be afraid if that is what has to be done - Hug's and prayer's to you and ALL your babies

Sue

Mommy to &
Owned by

I did have an SM that was passed to me, that did have a neuter but pom was left on, he still continued to go after it, after all other treatments we done, several months later his cycling started again, I had his pom removed, although empty, it made a huge difference, he never sm'd again..

yes he is on antibiotics, as for the bright red, I agree that it still shows signs of blood circulation, as it has been 3 days now, and I am not sure that it knows right now what it wants to do, last I heard it was no longer crusty, but it is still not turning black, seems the system is trying very hard to keep it alive, so for now it is in the wait and see stage to see what it is going to do, which way it wants to go.

Gina, just called, she will post more, when she gets home, the vet did talk to Dr Fronfield, and I know there is a follow up Sat. She does have a few e-collars, and she is ready and prepared to put them on.

Gina, hang in there. If you need to talk, you have my number.

As I said in my earlier post, I went through this with Jynx.

((((HUGS))))

It's the white that I'm most concerned with. With Riker, I'd describe it as translucent-that's the tissue that died. Waiting for update.

Hi guys - sorry I haven't updated, it has been crazy here

Well, I waited & called Dr. Jones on Wednesday morning to let her know that I wanted the neuter done early & that I wanted her to consult with Mary's vet about possible amputation - all of a sudden she says she "just dabbles in exotics" and refuses to look at him or even do the neuter as scheduled.

So I was, of course, totally freaked out - so I went up to Dr. Kate's office & begged her to call Mary's vet & try to help us...she did. We are following Dr. Fronefield's instructions (as follows):

He is currently taking: Gabapentin, Metronidazole, Enrofloxacin, & Metacam - he also has Silvadene cream for his penis, which I am having to apply about every 1.5 - 2hrs to keep it moist.

He is also in an ecollar 24/7 and thus, in a hospital cage.

He is just learning how to use the little bird feeder, but it is difficult for him, so I am handfeeding with a syringe as well. I haven't seen him use the water bottle, but I figure its ok because I had to mix his Priscilla's half & half with water & blend it so it would work in the feeder & syringe - so he should be getting plenty of water.

The Silvadene makes a big mess of his little butt, so I am cleaning it with a warm wet fleece blankie. He has figured out how to sleep in the hammock & I think he is actually getting some decent sleep now.

So far, I think we are doing ok. His penis is no longer crunchy or brown, it is soft and pink but it still won't retract all the way. The tips of both forks stick out about a half a centimeter (the damaged one sticks out a bit less). He is peeing and pooping normally, no diarrhea yet, but I fear that with all the stress & different meds, it will be here soon. The only thing I am worried about is that his cloaca seems to be larger than normal – like there’s a lump under it – I am wondering if when he retracts his penis, maybe the Silvadene cream gets pulled back into the cloaca & could be building up in there…is that stupid??? I really hope it’s nothing bad.

He has a check-up tomorrow with Dr. Kate at 11am, so I guess we will see. This sucks so bad – I don’t know how any of the rescue homes are able to care for more than one sick baby on a daily basis, you guys are rock stars