My name is Otto. I live in Sweden. I've had sugar gliders for 7 years. I started with 2, Luna and Tindra. Luna happened to be pregnant. She gave birth during my purchase of her. I named the new girl Ori.
Now Ori has always been a firecracker, high octane speed devil. I love her. A bit of a nibbler. But going back 1.5 years, Tindra, after multiple siezures and becoming blind and was prone to accidents, didnt clean herself, damaged teath and couldnt have hard food. Very reluctantly and a bit too late I made the call to have her put down. It broke my heart. Fast forward to May of this year, Luna (mother) died in her sleep of I assume old age. She was well passed 15 years old. Never had any problems. Ori was alone, technically. I spend 3-5 hours with her every day after Luna died to fulfill her social needs (she was never realy social with her mother while climbing/playing. So I assumed some gliders are more or less social than others) Regardless, I didn't want to take on the responsibility of a new glider just to appease Ori. I would fill the gap.
This was fine for 2-3 months until last Sunday. She was a little slower than usual. And I noticed her breathing alot faster. She tilted her head up a few times and she was breathing with an open mouth. I did some research and suspected pneumonia or some airway infection. Took her to the vet on Monday and got prescribed anti-biotics and anti-inflammatory. She had a UTI when she was 1 year old and got the same anti-biotics and that cleared it up. She hasn't had a problem since.
Now I have to stress, Sugar gliders are a very nische, rare pet to have in sweden. They're legal, with some strict terrarium rules. But the rarity of them makes most vets around me less knowledgeable. They know the medicine to weight needs, but they don't know the animal or the stress levels they can tolerate and they don't know the finer details.
Moving on, after treating for 5 days with bactrim, Ori has stayed slow (barely any activity), rapid breathing, Squeaky/popping breathing , lethargic, uninterested in her staple food (good calcium to phosphorous ratio, 40-50% protien, She eats better than me, Learned most of the diet from everyone here) She's more clingy when i cuddle with a hand in the pouch, she wont let go if she's awake. On Tuesday i had her in my hand and massaging her face to lul her to sleep. White mucous gathered on her lower eye. I removed it with a wet cotton swab, she didn't mind too much, flinched a little.
Every morning this week she's been awake in different places and just looked around sitting still. She's nowhere near as active as she was normally. I cleaned out the whole terrarium from most things and completely sanitized everything.
She really needs to go back to the vet. Stronger antibiotics. Possible and x-ray to see what is going on. What did they all check on her? Here is a link to a list of veterinarians that will consult with other veterinarians. Consulting Veterinarians.
Kimberley Feathers-Sweetie, Mister Peanut & Big Mack Fur-Guinan, Mr. Spock, T'Mir, Cho, Toothless, Maverick & Maharet T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon TY, TJ, Light Fury, Madison & T'Pring Forever in my heart, Gizmo, Tucker, Khayman and the rest of my babies over the
They checked breathing. They didn't think they would get a good X-ray so they didn't want to do it. I have a new time booked for Thursday, but if things get worse of course I'm going to the ER. She seems a little more energetic this past hour. She jumped to me and climbed the terrarium pretty fast. But she still isn't that hungry. I'm hoping shes actually in recovery and isn't hungry due to inactivity. She was extremely cuddly and grooming in my hand a few minutes ago.
When I get back there I'm gonna ask for stronger antibiotics if she remains the same. I'm gonna go through this list. I'm gonna ask my vet to consult the list too. Thank you very much for this link!
Gonna keep this thread updated for the foreseeable future.
I agree with Feather to get her on stronger antibiotics.
In the meantime, what diet do you have her on, or are you just calculating the calcium to phosphorus ratio (2:1).
Protein levels need to be brought down to only 18 -21%. Can cause liver damage.
Is she pooping OK? May need to take a sample to vet.
I would make sure she's not dehydrated (tent test) by lifting the skin at the back of her neck with thumb and forefinger. Let it go. If it doesn't drop fair rapid she is dehydrated. Honey water in a syringe. Make sure she's eating high moisture fruits and vegetables like watermelon, cantalope, cucumbers for hydration. Full fat (nothing low fat) yogurt will help with calcium and some electrolytes. I'm sure in your country the is a juice for babies that has electrolytes as well. We call it pediailite here. She is a bit thin.
Make sure to keep candles, incense, any strong cleaners, and air fresheners away from her area. Make sure to use only unscented laundry soap and no dryer sheets in her laundry.
Don't know if Europe has a equivalent to Dawn dish soap, but washing her bedding by hand and wiping cage down is highly recommended.
There is an eye drop for the mucus in her eye the vet can prescribe. Not sure if it can be administered with stronger antibiotics though.
Have you changed anything in your home in the last year? * New soaps - cleaners? * Been sprayed for pests or bugs? * Have you recently had a mold issue of any kind?
Please don't be offended, we're only trying to help.
Please keep us posted.
I know I forgot something, I'll post later if I remember.
Keep her warm and dry. Put extra blankies in her pouch so she can snuggle. Place the cage out of any drafts or fans. When they're sick they can't hold their body temperature well.
The diet she's on is one I've made myself with varying quantities of all ingredients. Sometimes I mix up proteins or carbs or vitamins for some variety. Celery (boiled) Carrot (boiled) Papaya Dill sweet potato (boiled) baby spinach (boiled) chicken thighs and breasts (boiled) Turkey (boiled) eggs (boiled) ginger (sparingly as an anti-oxidant) Blackberry (when papaya has been hard to come by) variations of other berries except blueberry (I read of a case where the pesticide in some batches are way too strong) apples pears watermellon honeymellon bee pollen (ground) honey oranges (moderation)
I know to keep acidity and sugars down as well as soften oxalic acid crystals for their teeth and kidneys.
For teeth health I've dehydrated banana, apples, and mix in oatmeal with the staple mix, sunflower seeds in moderation, as well as mealworms in (moderation for canceling out calcium)
Its only recently i upped the protein due to a prior vet visit. So I'll cut that down.
Her last 3 bowel movements have been alot smaller than normal. The last normal one I noticed was a week ago on saturday. The one from yesterday was darker than normal, but today it was normal but small in quantity, I'm guessing due to inactivity/sickness?? I'm giving her the favorite soft foods to get her to eat as much as I can like avocado, dried papaya, honey. I'll take your advice on the yoghurt tomorrow, I'm about to give her raw egg/honey mix if she still isn't eating enough. A prior vet recommended it. (side note, she did defecate on the vet visit on monday and I asked if they wanted to keep it as a sample. They said no)
The most recent change I have was from 2 weeks ago, I bought fragrance sticks to keep in my room, Which is about 15-20 feet from the terrarium in the next room. Putting a lid on it now. 5 weeks ago i cleaned the shower drains with some sodium hydroxide to get rid of hair. I opened up the whole house to ventilate. I'm now worried it was enough to cause her lung damage. But wouldn't these symptoms show themselves a lot sooner/immediately? (regardless, if worse comes to worst I will pay for an autopsy and share)
When cleaning out the terrarium on Wednesday I noticed a white mold like substance on the roof of a cork bark tunnel. Of which I had many, but only found it in one that I rarely ever saw her near. I took them all out. Later read that some white mold can hurt/kill small animals, but its not too dangerous depending on what kind. I kept a sample.
I didnt notice any mucus today when massaging her face.
I have cleaned her pouch with pet safe soap I got from the vet store. Not too recently though as they actually don't like changes in scent. But I'll clean it tomorrow as its late now and takes a few hours to dry.
Thank you for taking your time. I'll be spending all day tomorrow with her and monitoring.
I would remove the scent sticks from the room, since she has difficulty breathing.
As far as the hydrochloride to clean drains - she's been sick longer than you think. They hide it well.
As far as changing what you wash her things in: Once they're dry, you can tuck them next to your skin and rub so she has a familiar scent from you on it.
I would soak her toys and bedding when washing in white vinegar first. It's a wonderful cleaner that will remove urine smell, kills mold and antibacterial.
Please remove the spinach from her diet. Although it has so many good vitamins, it has too much iron.
The staple I make for mine I scramble the eggs with some water to keep it from sticking to the pan so much(just another way to prepare. Mine prefer scrambled :-) .)
As far as bowel movements, if she has cut down on what she eats, they can be smaller. Make sure to watch when she goes to make sure she's not straining or makes noises while trying to pass the poop (some gliders always make some noise). Or compacted when it comes out (lots of little poops squished together).
Don't forget to check her a few times a day for dehydration.
What type of water source do you use?
A shallow water dish? - remove and clean daily
A water silo? (Needs to be cleaned every 2-3 days as they will spoil the water).
A water bottle? - make sure to have a second source because they can stop working. Give it a tap on the mouth piece daily to make sure it's wet) When using a water bottle, have a second (back up) source available.
Bottled water is preferred, but not distilled (all minerals are removed and they don't absorb into body without the natural minerals).
I've thrown the sticks in the trash. If an eventual autopsy reveals lung scarring, I'll know It was completely my fault. I do keep blankets, cut up shirts I've kept under my hoodie for half an hour in her pouch. Good call on the vineger. But I've removed all toys for now completely. Theres only a handful of hiding spots also. Cutting spinach
She isnt hissing or straining to poop. She went about 25 minutes ago. 2 small pebble sized.
I use tap water. Always have. The tap water in sweden is extremely clean and the building is pretty new. Theres very small traces of chlorine. Its pet safe for animals of all sizes. I use a water bottle that i clean and have replaced a few times. I noticed about 6 years ago small black dots form at the bottom near the pipe. Supposedly algae. But I just throw them out when i cant get them clean anymore. I used to have 2 but at some point i just had the 1. I make sure it works before and after work.
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Have you checked her for hydration by doing the tent test?
How is she today?
Does she have a safe wheel to run on?
Is she eating her food?
Do you happen to have any canned pumpkin or fresh that you can cook up? It's good for their digestive system and can help with either diarrhea or constipation.
You have referred to her cage as a terrarium. Can you explain what it looks like / made of? I want to make sure I understand. I remember that you said your country has strict rules for keeping gliders. Can you tell us the basics of the rules?
She had a safe wheel to run on, plastic see through (not mesh) that i cleaned every other day. I've taken that out as well for now.
She's been more tired today.
I've been with her all day. Mostly she just naps in hand. I cleaned both her pouches with viniger and the pet safe soap. She prefers my hand or sits on my shoulder. I don't know how active she is being at night. I found her awake this morning. she did groom herself a bit today which is a relieving sign. She's asleep in her pouch now after gently placing her back in. Its past midnight here and i need to sleep.
She hasn't been very hydrated today, skin is slow to retract, but its not stiff. She doesnt want to drink plain or honey water all that much. She's had a few bites and licks. But not much.
She did not like me forcing the medication on her today and she bit me. Not enough to draw blood but harder than she's ever done, I'm not sure if its due to exhaustion or restraint that she couldn't draw blood.
In Sweden sugar gliders require a strict 2 x 2 x 2.2 meter large inclosure. I have mine in the living room. Its made of pine beams and pvc covered netting much like these. https://exotiskadjur.ifokus.se/discussion/1094563/sugar-gliders-i---bur-och-utrymme (I know pine resin is considered toxic and airway irritable but for 7 years there hasnt been an issue related to breathing till now + many owners here say its safe because its a hard wood they dont want to chew on. I tried building an inclosure out of bamboo at first, It was impossible to make it inescapable.)
She had a small bowel movement today, same as yesterday. It was softer than normal almost paste like. I imagine from giving her easy to eat soft/liquidy food.
I'll shoot up my visit to the vet to monday instead of thursday. I'll demand an X-ray, and if they dont find anything I'll ask for stronger anti-biotics. I've done all I can I feel for now.
All I can say is wow! Huge cage! Does she stay near the floor now? Probably doesn't have the energy to climb. Thank you for the example. Here we would call that a walk in cage or small aviary. When you were saying a terrarium, all I could think of was a large converted fish aquarium. I feel much better now.
When giving meds, will she take a treat afterwards? Sometimes that helps. Mine get an almond or mealworm depending on the glider. It also helps with the bad taste from meds.
If you're using a syringe to give meds, she may associate it with the honey water. But she needs something.
I am still a bit concerned about her fluid intake. The vet can administer sub-q fluids. .
Feather and I live in the US, midwest. So that's about 6-8 hours time difference.
You may want to get her some Yogurt, no artificial sweeteners. It will help with her gut, the antibiotics are probably giving her the soft stools.
Kimberley Feathers-Sweetie, Mister Peanut & Big Mack Fur-Guinan, Mr. Spock, T'Mir, Cho, Toothless, Maverick & Maharet T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon TY, TJ, Light Fury, Madison & T'Pring Forever in my heart, Gizmo, Tucker, Khayman and the rest of my babies over the
I got her some yogurt today. She enjoyed it and filled her belly (I've always been reluctant to give them more than a few drops of lactose) she's still pretty weak and doesn't want to eat solids. She's also drinking enough so that I'm not panicking, skin still contracts, but pretty slow. At least she's not starving. I'm gonna mash some avocado and apple and banana sprinkled with some ground down dried papaya for the night.
She made a slightly bigger, normal bowel movement today so thats reassuring.
I've prepared another bed for her closer to the ground with a second bottle of water, but I've noticed she still prefers to be high up.
I noticed my hands have become dry and flaky, Either from holding her while she sleeps for hours or from all the cleaning. I suspect mostly the latter.
I'm gonna call the vet tomorrow as soon as they open.
I wish I had more to contribute for the vet visit other than the list of US vet consultants that Feather had a link to. You can click on the blue words and it will take you to the link.
Its with a heavy, and broken heart I update you all on Ori's passing. I haven't cried this much since Tindra passed in February 2023.
I called the vet clinic this morning and got a time with the exo / small animal specialist today at 14:40 (02:40 PM)
I took 2 hours off work + my lunch to go back home and get Ori and take the 1 hour drive to the vet. I found her sleeping inside one of the toys I'd left in yesterday. A hollow string ball with holes all around. She eagerly got out onto my hand. She was reluctant to get in the pouch and carrier.
During the drive she's looking up at the sky and treeline outside and eventually trying to go back to sleep on the bumpy road.
We get there, I check in, and Ori is hiding at the back of the carrier behind her pouch and looking over it towards the front. Like she's peaking from behind a hill.
I'm directed to the exotic / small animal part of the building and we wait. vet/secretary and an apprentice come in and take some info on the past week. I tell everything and we wait on the specialist.
This vet was clearly more experienced than the ER vet i met last Monday. I told her everything I wanted, the x-ray, stronger anti-biotics. She told me if the stuff she's already on isnt helping and shes only getting worse, shes in mortal danger already. She could maybe get an ultrasound, but according to her she's seen this in many small animals before. All she needed was some time to inspect Ori without her thrashing, and she knew how to handle her. She notices the lower abdominal breathing, particularly, heavy breaths filling the lower lungs, and manages to thoroughly listen to Ori's breathing and gives me the bad news. Her lungs are filled with liquid/puss from infection. That it was only a matter of time and 1 bad episode. If I had noticed anything earlier this story might've ended differently. The cause of the infection is still unknown. And the vet told me there's no way to be sure. Probably just trying to console me in-case it was my fault. Regardless. I wanted to keep her remains after the cremation, and an autopsy would complicate that process. All I can share is a cautionary tale + my experiences. (at a later date)
I couldn't keep the tears back while she explained what was best. I knew what was best because of Tindra. I'd tried to keep her alive because I didn't want to lose her. I cleaned her when she stopped grooming herself. I fed her by hand for months after the surgery. Then one day I really payed attention to her, and she was miserable, always wet and wasn't being groomed by her mother or sister. I pitied her so much it hurt. And I hated myself for being so selfish. So I didn't need convincing.
So they weighed Ori for the morphine dosage (she managed to gain 2 grams, Big thanks I think due to the yogurt) and left me alone with her so i could say my goodbyes. I got her to fall asleep pretty fast as it was the middle of the day, I gave her cheek rubs and head rubs while she lay curled up in my hand. She still looked dignified, if a bit scruffy. And I couldn't stop to clean up my messed up face.
Eventually it was time, they came and took her and they gave her enough morphine to put her to sleep. They came back in and gave her to me. She was disoriented and a little hectic, She got a few last bites in on me before falling asleep in my hands. I watched her breathing slow down and I felt she wasn't in pain anymore.
I payed the 500 dollar bill and was told they would call me when I could come and get her urn.
When all was done i kept sobbing on my way to my car with the empty carrier. It started to rain heavily as if on cue.
Its been 4 hours since then. And it took me a good hour to write all this.
I want to summarize my time with these adorable lovable creatures. And I will, after dismantling the terrarium this weekend. I won't be getting any more sugar gliders.
Thank you all for your concern and help and guidance these past 7 years (and these past 4 days especially). Without you knowing, I and probably many more have gone through these forums for help and learned alot.
I am very sorry for your loss. May you find comfort and peace in your memories of Ori.
Glide Free Little Ori
Kimberley Feathers-Sweetie, Mister Peanut & Big Mack Fur-Guinan, Mr. Spock, T'Mir, Cho, Toothless, Maverick & Maharet T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon TY, TJ, Light Fury, Madison & T'Pring Forever in my heart, Gizmo, Tucker, Khayman and the rest of my babies over the
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T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon 
TY, TJ, Light Fury, Madison & T'Pring 
I feel much better now. 
