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Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Sherri] #1079355
03/01/11 04:50 PM
03/01/11 04:50 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Laurens_Babies Offline
Glider Addict
Laurens_Babies  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Originally Posted By: Sherri
I really don't see the comparison at all between pet food and human food.

I love my gliders just as much as anyone else here but really????.... Trying to compare our glider food to baby formula?

I love you Lauren and I really do respect your opinions and experience with gliders but I do have to disagree with this comparison.

I understand is an extreme example but I feel the same way about what I put in my pets food dishes then what I put in mine and my future children this of course is my choice but I don't see why we can't be as careful with our pet food as we are with our own. Just one chicks opinon.


~Lauren

Lauren's Animal Kingdom
*Website is down temporarily should be back up by November!*
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Laurens_Babies] #1079367
03/01/11 05:04 PM
03/01/11 05:04 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 211
La Crosse, WI
Jos Offline
Glider Explorer
Jos  Offline
Glider Explorer

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 211
La Crosse, WI
I've been following this thread for awhile, and I've noticed a few key items in this conversation that I find a bit ... disconcerting.

First. Some of the people who are against this being sold now aren't against it for what it is, but for who MAY or MAY NOT have funded the testing for it. IMO, and don't get me wrong I don't agree with mill brokers, mill breeders, etc etc etc, we should be more concerned on whether or not the diet is appropriate for our gliders more then whether or not a mill broker helped fund it's testing. IF, and that's a big if, it was funded by a broker, and they end up using it as their diet of choice because it IS a better diet... wouldn't that be a step in a POSITIVE direction? Not something to shun?

Second. I do a lot of thinking before I give my babies any food, so I do understand people concerned with certain chemicals IN said food. My pomeranian only gets Blue Buffalo Small breed formula for example, NOTHING else will do. So I can understand how people would be up in arms about certain aspects of this diet, therefore would it not be more constructive to just not buy it until you are satisfied with it instead of going on about how you'd never feed it to your gliders? I understand you're all passionate about your gliders, I am too, I monitor what they get for food very carefully because I would be heartbroken if they got sick. I just find it more .... appropriate I guess is the best word to just keep to what your gliders are doing well on instead of going on and on, beating a dead horse so to say about why you don't like it?

It just seems silly to me to keep carrying on when you could instead just keep on whatever diet YOU are comfortable with, and wait to see more on this one.


Mom to

Ivory (husky mix)6/2006 - 12/23/2009 RIP babygirl
Punk (Pomeranian)
:wfb: Jazz, Rock, & Roll, Trance and Rave (oop 7-15-2011)!
:leu: My sweet little Swing
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Jos] #1079371
03/01/11 05:11 PM
03/01/11 05:11 PM
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 43,248
LittleRock, AR USA
KarenE Offline
Owner
KarenE  Offline
Owner

Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 43,248
LittleRock, AR USA
Originally Posted By: Jos

First. Some of the people who are against this being sold now aren't against it for what it is, but for who MAY or MAY NOT have funded the testing for it. IMO, and don't get me wrong I don't agree with mill brokers, mill breeders, etc etc etc, we should be more concerned on whether or not the diet is appropriate for our gliders more then whether or not a mill broker helped fund it's testing. IF, and that's a big if, it was funded by a broker, and they end up using it as their diet of choice because it IS a better diet... wouldn't that be a step in a POSITIVE direction? Not something to shun?


You are absolutely correct, Jos. Many in this community have been waiting and watching since July 2010 for the smallest sign of change. It would seem such a breakthrough would be shouted from the rooftops.

It would certainly go a long way.


Your Sugar Glider Resource Center
Sugar Glider Help


Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079379
03/01/11 05:33 PM
03/01/11 05:33 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 29
missouri
shadow_ Offline
In Pouch
shadow_  Offline
In Pouch

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 29
missouri
just wanted to say that dont like it dont use it isnt a good excuse. dont like the way that (PPP) Perfect Pocket Pets sells and treats their gliders then dont buy from them, dont like this other person's diet even though it has some things wrong then dont use it, dont like the wheel in that person's picture well its not your wheel and your gliders cage so you shouldnt worry about it, see a picture of a glider and a cat together in a picture and the person say my cat and glider love to play with each other, we would probably start telling them the dangers of doing that but its not your glider so not your problem. wasnt there also a certain crazy discussion about a certain intro method that people didnt like, well they didnt have to use it but it was discussed anyways because they were worried about new people trying it.
we do all of this for not only that person but to warn new people who see or read it that that is not a good idea. we want to protect and help as many gliders as we can that is why most people are active on forums to learn and help others.
i really do hope this diet turns out to be good but as long as nobody is being hateful then it should be ok to discuss this diet like we do for every other diet, its not hurting anything to keep discussing it. if you are done discussing it you dont have to read or post (lol dont take that last sentence seriously but that excuse can be used for anything)


2 sugar glider brothers named Rune and Vash
sugar glider and a Halloween addict :D
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: shadow_] #1079387
03/01/11 05:47 PM
03/01/11 05:47 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 211
La Crosse, WI
Jos Offline
Glider Explorer
Jos  Offline
Glider Explorer

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 211
La Crosse, WI
No where did I say don't discuss it. Please take what I said for what is written, not what you assume I mean.

If you have problems with ingredients, that's fine, talk about it. That's not a problem.

HOWEVER, any step (PPP) Perfect Pocket Pets makes towards improving the lives of the gliders they sell is a GOOD thing. Being against a glider diet SIMPLY because it was funded by them with the hopeful intent of making the glider's lives better isn't A-ok with me. I *want* them to better the lives of the gliders they sell, I want them to do things for the good of the gliders and not just for top dollar.

Please try not to misunderstand what I mean... I'm not saying IGNORE it, but beating a dead horse as to why you will NEVER use it... that's just as awkward and unhelpful as ignoring a problem.

As an edit: The #1 most effective way to put someone out of business is to not buy from them. So not buying from (PPP) Perfect Pocket Pets *IS* a good way to stop them. We just need more education available to these impulse buyers

Last edited by Jos; 03/01/11 06:02 PM.

Mom to

Ivory (husky mix)6/2006 - 12/23/2009 RIP babygirl
Punk (Pomeranian)
:wfb: Jazz, Rock, & Roll, Trance and Rave (oop 7-15-2011)!
:leu: My sweet little Swing
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079398
03/01/11 06:27 PM
03/01/11 06:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,748
New Jersey
JillMarie Offline
Serious Glideritis
JillMarie  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,748
New Jersey
Karen, Jos, Lauren thumb


:grey: Bosom Buddy Creations:grey:
^website link wink

Remember that God Loves You!
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079405
03/01/11 06:35 PM
03/01/11 06:35 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 124
Lake Worth, Florida
SerenityKris Offline
Joey Member
SerenityKris  Offline
Joey Member

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 124
Lake Worth, Florida
I've been following these posts for a few days now. I don't post here often, but I have been posting a bit more lately.

I started reading this board because I felt it was a positive place for information on how to best care for my sugar gliders.

Sure, there are differences of opinion, but in general I get a feeling that people here really care about one another and about gliders.

I have no idea of the history and behind-the-scenes of what might have happened in the past, but this has seemed, almost from the beginning, as though people are just out to attack other people.

There are people out here, like me, who are so disheartened with the atmosphere of this string of posts that they are just... over it. They might not speak up, because they're sitting at their screen in disbelief at the level of mean, and bashing that's going on here. That's what I've been doing for days.

I've only had gliders for 2 years. I rely on the combined experience of everyone here to help me decide what's best for my gliders. That's VERY hard to do when reading this post gives me the feeling that this new diet isn't being looked at objectively. It's being attacked vehemently by people who seem to have some sort of problem with Peggy. It's also sending me to OTHER boards for objective information because I don't feel it is found here.

It's something to think about...

In my opinion, ANYONE willing to spend the funds and the time to research Gliders in ANY way is doing us ALL a service. More importantly - it's doing OUR GLIDERS a service. TOO little is known about these guys, and vets rely too much on what WE tell them when we go to appointments. It's sad that we have to educate THEM! The more information that's out there the BETTER! Let's face it, gliders are getting more popular. They're easier to find, and more and more will be finding their way into homes in coming years through legitimate breeders, rescues, and even mill-breeders.

I really hope that people can start putting personal problems aside and look at things objectively. If not for yourselves, but for people like me, who actually do rely on this board to be informative.


Kris
Mom to 4 gliders: :wfb: Bugsy :grey: Bijou :grey: Mr. B :grey: Brooklyn
3 dogs: :dog: Trixie the pomeranian, Daisy the cocker spaniel dachsund mix, and Louie the English Bulldog mix

http://bijousgrotto.weebly.com/
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079435
03/01/11 07:33 PM
03/01/11 07:33 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 29
missouri
shadow_ Offline
In Pouch
shadow_  Offline
In Pouch

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 29
missouri
im sorry jos that was not meant for you or really anyone in particular.
i would love it if one day this food could be found on shelves in pet stores right next to the pellets. hopefully people will go for that instead. and then maybe that would be the first step for the person to get into the glider community and learn stuff they didnt know before. i still think fresh/frozen is better but thats just because i have always wanted to be able to make my pets food and not do boring pellets like with hamsters.not comparing this to pellets and i know they would still get fruit and veggies.
im always helping and chatting with new owners so it helps to have sources of info and discussions i can link them to if they have questions.


2 sugar glider brothers named Rune and Vash
sugar glider and a Halloween addict :D
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079449
03/01/11 07:55 PM
03/01/11 07:55 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 423
Florida
T
Teresa56 Offline
Glider Lover
Teresa56  Offline
Glider Lover
T

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 423
Florida
SerenityKris you said it very nicely and I feel very much like you do. I have only had gliders for 4 months and to be honest what I see on this board is opinions because that is the only thing people think they have. It would be different if we only replied to a thread that we had actually experienced what the subject was about.Example- Dont tell me one wheel is better than another unless you had a glider who got their tail caught in the one you had.Anything outside of experience is just opinions or "I heards". I really feel like this has become a witch hunt --- how sad!
If only closed minds came with closed mouths.


Mom to JayP
Owned by 2 :kitty:

Slave to 2 colonies
Colony #1= Trio
Skeeter :grey: and MissHarmony :wfb: and Miss Sanora :wfb:

Colony # 2 pair
Flora :rtmo: and her huney Freddy :grey:

Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: gliderdad79] #1079450
03/01/11 07:55 PM
03/01/11 07:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,753
Florida
LabNGliderMom Offline
Glider Addict
LabNGliderMom  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,753
Florida
Originally Posted By: gliderdad79
Julie, I have stated many times I am not bashing Peggy, the diet or anything else and I hope this may be the answer that bridges the gap so how is that not being mature??

YOU may continue to put your head in the sand and do what you have been told thats your choice, do not sit here and tell people they have to do the same nor tell them they are being immature especially if they are not being immature. You are the last person to be calling anyone immature!

I am not and have not bashed the diet or any person(s) involved and have stated it many times now.


Eddie, I did not at any time call you immature - I was actually agreeing with your earlier post that feeding or not feeding this is a choice. That is all that was intended by my addressing you. If you took it any other way it was not intended to be that way.

I hardly ever come here anymore - and this automatic assumption that I am calling you immature, as well as your vehement (and uncalled for IMO) reaction are why I generally avoid GC as much as I can in favor of forums where my personality (and thereby usually my intent and tone) are more easily understood by people who are not judging me by past mistakes, differences of opinion, or misunderstandings.

Once again - the inability to detect intent, inflection, and tone on an internet forum rears it's ugly head. shakehead

Originally Posted By: Laurens_Babies
I just think its still too early to be selling it without further knowledge being given.


No one thinks you are bashing the diet - however whether or not she gives out the info someone wants has no bearing on whether or not she has the info herself... that is what I have been asking everyone to keep in mind - Peggy has been involved with gliders for many years and I have no reason to believe she would do anything to intentionally or unintentionally harm sugar gliders for any reason.

And of course, you are entitled to your opinion that it is too early to put the product on the market - just as it is someone else's choice to purchase and feed it. smile


Julie
Hubby: George
Kids: Ayla & Michael
Grandsons: Trysten, Dayton, KJ & Nathyn
The Zoo: Midnight, Severe & Nala - Claude, Pixie, Tippy & Chili - Scout & Soluna, Theo & Deegie

http://hammockhavenpetsplus.com


Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: LabNGliderMom] #1079465
03/01/11 08:40 PM
03/01/11 08:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15,514
Long Island, NY
gliderdad79 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
gliderdad79  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15,514
Long Island, NY
Originally Posted By: LabNGliderMom

Eddie, I did not at any time call you immature - I was actually agreeing with your earlier post that feeding or not feeding this is a choice. That is all that was intended by my addressing you. If you took it any other way it was not intended to be that way.


Julie, I am sorry. When you grouped that all into one with the Eddie starting the sentence It appeared to me that you were directing it all at me in that paragraph. I can make excuses but I wont, I will simply say I am sorry that I read it that way and commented how I did. I will edit/remove it if you would like me to, I don't wana do it myself so it don't look like I am covering it up.

Again, I was wrong in thinking that was directed at me and for commenting as I did. I am sorry.


Eddie

In the Tropics somewhere between the port of indecision and southeast of disorder!

"Great people talk about ideas. Average people talk about things. Small people talk about other people."

One day your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure its worth watching!
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079478
03/01/11 09:03 PM
03/01/11 09:03 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,269
WI
Glide_Bye_Lily Offline
Glider Guardian
Glide_Bye_Lily  Offline
Glider Guardian

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,269
WI
I've been staying way out of this but I need to bring this to attention.

Has anybody actually sat down and taken a look at the ingredients in BOTH before whining about the ingredients? HPW Plus has more ingredients in it than the original WHPS but they have many ingredients in common.

Same ingredients:
Whey protein, soy protein, ground cereal grains, dextrose, maltodextrin, Lysine, methionine, vegetable oils, Omega 3 fatty acids (flaxseed oil), niacinomide (nicotinomide), biotin, folic acid, calcium (does not specify sources in WHPS), vitamin E, vitamin A, Vitamin B12, vitamin C (ascorbic acid), Vitamin K(Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex), copper(Copper Sulfate), Vitamin B2 (riboflavin), Vitamin B6 (pyridoxine hydrichloride), zinc, vitamin D3, vitamin B1 (thiamine mononitrate), Iron (ferrous sulfate), selenium (sodium selenite), pantothenic acid (calcium pantothenate)

Ingredients in HPW plus NOT in WHPS:
calcium carbonate, dicalcium phosphate, silicon dioxide, natural and artificial flavors, Calcium Iodate( to prevent iodine deficiency)

Ingredients in WHPS NOT in HPW plus:
iodine.

It actually bothers me a little more that WHPS does not specify the chemical compounds that produce the vitamins and minerals. They just list them. WHPS also does not specify if their vegetable oil contains BHT/BHA (not saying it DOES, but it makes you wonder since they are preservatives and the powder needs to be preserved somehow).

Last edited by Glide_Bye_Lily; 03/01/11 09:14 PM.

Allie
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079490
03/01/11 09:19 PM
03/01/11 09:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,796
Wisconsin
Feather Offline
Administrator
Feather  Offline
Administrator

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,796
Wisconsin
Thank you for posting that Allie!

Wow is all I can say, I am interested in this powder that Peggy has come up with. I am very interested in seeing the study results once they are published.

It all comes down to this, it is for the good of the glider.


Kimberley
Feathers-Sweetie, Mister Peanut & Big Mack
Fur-Guinan, Mr. Spock, T'Mir, Cho, Toothless, Maverick & Maharet :bb: T'Pol, Elizabeth & Curzon :wfb: TY, TJ, Light Fury, Madison & T'Pring :rtmo:
Forever in my heart, Gizmo, Tucker, Khayman and the rest of my babies over the :rbridge:

Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079554
03/01/11 11:16 PM
03/01/11 11:16 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,264
Northeast U.S.
angelic4296 Offline
Glider Addict
angelic4296  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,264
Northeast U.S.
Lauren, you said it exactly right.."if you don't want it, don't buy it"....EXACTLY....all a matter of personal choice and again, what you are personally comfortable with in terms of feeding your gliders. (End of my speaking directly to Lauren, the rest of this is just general).

Peggy will never claim to know or be or sell anything that isn't true, and my opinion, anything that isn't safe, beneficial, and healthy for gliders. I really don't think that just because that's my view on it, it means I, or anyone else, is "sticking my/their head in the sand." I know diets are not in my area of expertise. I do my research, read, read, read, talk with others who are feeding or created the diet, and go from there, making the most educated and careful decision for my gliders along the way. Just because I don't demand to have every single MINUTE question answered does not mean my head is in the sand, and anyone who says that or implies it silly.

This is the most work I have ever seen done on ANY diet, and people are STILL critical. It's funny, but I don't remember ANY diet that didn't even HAVE this kind of research to back it up receive this kind of flack. Who manufactured it? How was it funded? How was it packaged? What other diet have we ever asked these questions of and why the sudden interest now? When you look at it that way, you really can't help but see it as nitpicking and a personal thing.

If you aren't comfortable trying it, DON'T. But just because you want the answers to certain questions by NO MEANS obligates Peggy or the creator of any other diet to provide them.

You don't trust the diet as is now?? No problem (although, what extended funded scientific research has been done on the diet YOU'RE feeding????). You want more information before trying it? Eh, you may or may not get it. You want to wait and see what the results of the study are?? That's totally fine. You want to wait and see how other gliders do on first? Go for it.

This whole thing has been blown wayyyy out of proportion. I think everyone needs to take a step back and take a breath.

Last edited by angelic4296; 03/01/11 11:17 PM.

Jess

2 spoiled gliders, Gizzy (6/05) and Ruthie (?/05) <3

Please consider rescuing first!

Please remember to complete your surveys at http://www.sugargroup.org/ - help better the lives of gliders everywhere smile
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079559
03/01/11 11:24 PM
03/01/11 11:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 84
Wisconsin
W
wisconsinsugars Offline
Joey Member
wisconsinsugars  Offline
Joey Member
W

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 84
Wisconsin
clap totally agree !!!


www.wisconsinsugargliders.webs.com
*USDA licensed breeder*
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: LabNGliderMom] #1079581
03/02/11 12:03 AM
03/02/11 12:03 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Laurens_Babies Offline
Glider Addict
Laurens_Babies  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Originally Posted By: LabNGliderMom

Originally Posted By: Laurens_Babies
I just think its still too early to be selling it without further knowledge being given.


No one thinks you are bashing the diet - however whether or not she gives out the info someone wants has no bearing on whether or not she has the info herself... that is what I have been asking everyone to keep in mind - Peggy has been involved with gliders for many years and I have no reason to believe she would do anything to intentionally or unintentionally harm sugar gliders for any reason.

And of course, you are entitled to your opinion that it is too early to put the product on the market - just as it is someone else's choice to purchase and feed it. smile


I feel like some of this has been taken too personally I've had a really long night away from the house so I just want to comment on my "Agenda" I am wanting to play devils advocate I don't think we will come to an understanding AT ALL I just think for the sake of some who haven't been in this community for very long and are just figuring out what to feed.. Both opinions on this diet need to be said... I'm sorry but at the same time I'm not.. If I have to be bad guy so be it, but this needs to be discussed.. PUBLICLY This isn't about who I'm friends with who Peggy is friends with this is about what we are shoveling into our gliders mouths so please stop telling me if you don't like it don't feed it. We've established that. Thanks.


~Lauren

Lauren's Animal Kingdom
*Website is down temporarily should be back up by November!*
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079583
03/02/11 12:05 AM
03/02/11 12:05 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 343
Northern VA.
GliderGuyVA Offline
Glider Lover
GliderGuyVA  Offline
Glider Lover

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 343
Northern VA.
Speculation is rampant on here. Sit back and wait for the results. Once it all has been reveled then you can jump all over it.


Slave to:
My Wife
Four - Dogs
Two - Cat's
Four - Ferrets
Eight plus - Gliders
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: GliderGuyVA] #1079586
03/02/11 12:10 AM
03/02/11 12:10 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Laurens_Babies Offline
Glider Addict
Laurens_Babies  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Originally Posted By: GliderGuyVA
Speculation is rampant on here. Sit back and wait for the results. Once it all has been reveled then you can jump all over it.


Peggy has said she can't give a time frame she said a year might not be long enough to give.. At least that was her example.. Its being sold now


~Lauren

Lauren's Animal Kingdom
*Website is down temporarily should be back up by November!*
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079592
03/02/11 12:16 AM
03/02/11 12:16 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,264
Northeast U.S.
angelic4296 Offline
Glider Addict
angelic4296  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,264
Northeast U.S.
Well, if you want people to stop telling you, "if you don't like it, don't feed it" then questions about manufacturing, funding and packaging need to stop being repeated and pushed too...it ALL needs to stop. You said your concern is what we're "shoveling" into our gliders mouths....please direct me to the extended, at least year-long, funded, backed-by-nutrtionists-and-vets research that the diet YOU are feeding has gone through. Maybe I'm just not aware of it or haven't seen it yet published publicy? Did you ask questions about funding, packaging and manufacturing when you first considered the diet that you are presently feeding? I absolutely 100% doubt it. Why are you asking them now then of this particular diet? What's the difference?


Jess

2 spoiled gliders, Gizzy (6/05) and Ruthie (?/05) <3

Please consider rescuing first!

Please remember to complete your surveys at http://www.sugargroup.org/ - help better the lives of gliders everywhere smile
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079598
03/02/11 12:30 AM
03/02/11 12:30 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Laurens_Babies Offline
Glider Addict
Laurens_Babies  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Jess I would be happy to tell you more about the diet I feed but the answer to all those questions is yes. The maker of my diet I discussed a long time with about my diet before I switch, yes I can track all of the products in mine. The maker made this diet more for her personal use it isn't a diet to manufacturer and sell its based pretty heavily in the belief easier isn't always better. Its not popular because it is pretty complicated and the maker did not ask to have it published on the website but yup when I asked her she cited all her sources for her research she did, she worked step by step with her vet and other's while creating it.

And please stop acting like I'm being all big and bad aggressive about this I've noticed you seem to take all this way too personally and to heart. I have no idea how many diet threads I've been through since 2007. Peggy posted very publicly about her diet selling it we've her the plus' and now your hearing my caution out to others about it. I believe it or not am not against these changes or really against this diet as a whole. Your asking me to "stop" but the truth is NO ONE is stopping the pro's the con's the inbetweens. Your certainly not standing down you've been in here being Peggy's mouth piece and if I'm not mistaken you've been bouncing around on GC LGG and GG for days defending this diet .. I'm not saying your wrong just pointing out I don't see you "stopping" anytime soon. I might have been a big strong in my opinions but I think they've been fair and objective. I haven't asked who is funding her or why she is naming her diet *HPW* plus cause I know how that talk would go. I'm asking valid question I have the right to ask.


~Lauren

Lauren's Animal Kingdom
*Website is down temporarily should be back up by November!*
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079602
03/02/11 12:37 AM
03/02/11 12:37 AM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 504
nc, usa
meri Offline
Glider Lover
meri  Offline
Glider Lover

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 504
nc, usa



Edited to say: All I can gather is that some people have put a lot into this and are passionate about it because of that. I posted thinking this was a normal thread where you could say "hey, I have decided to do this for me and my gliders for now" but I have removed that because it has gotten too personal and I don't want to offend anyone who has put a lot of time and money into this. I hope it all turns out great; I really do.

Last edited by meri; 03/02/11 03:27 AM.

wave Meri & :grey: :leu:
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: angelic4296] #1079608
03/02/11 12:49 AM
03/02/11 12:49 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15,514
Long Island, NY
gliderdad79 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
gliderdad79  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15,514
Long Island, NY
Originally Posted By: angelic4296
please direct me to the extended, at least year-long, funded, backed-by-nutrtionists-and-vets research that the diet YOU are feeding has gone through.


I stated earlier that there has been none done before and we feed our gliders on hopes we were doing the right thing. This diet is different cause one of it's biggest selling point is it's been stated it has been researched, with scientific data collected, etc. To me if those documents and statistics cannot be released yet, than this shouldn't be advertised that way.

I am not saying this against Peggy or anyone involved, please don't think I am, but if I am being sold a product that is backed by vets, has scientific data and research I would like to see such facts before I do so, not cause I should trust what I am being told.

If the data is not available who's to say its complete, or even ready for full blown availability on the market and should be out of testing phase. Again, I am not saying it isn't ready or it's bad, or not complete just that I shouldn't be told it is when no data is available and than told.

So I will ask you, were is the year-long, funded, backed-by-nutrtionists-and-vets research data for this one? If it is being advertised as such it should be available. Other wise it shouldn't be advertised in this manner till it is available.

You cant keep throwing around the show me all the extensive research for the other diets, if the extensive research for this one is not even available yet. Are we to just believe that the data and research was done with no concerns cause we are told so?

Past diets had no data or research, nor were the advertise as having any. This one has it so it's different, truthfully I am looking forward to seeing the data and research that was done as I am interested in that kind of stuff more so since it has not been done before. Hopefully I made sense here, it's late, lol.

Last edited by gliderdad79; 03/02/11 12:54 AM.

Eddie

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Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079616
03/02/11 01:00 AM
03/02/11 01:00 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Laurens_Babies Offline
Glider Addict
Laurens_Babies  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Lol Teehee Eddie maybe I'm just stupid type of tired but maybe all the Show Me stuff has gotten to me. I'm home grown Missouri Girl (the show me state)..SHOW ME!! I do appreciate all the work Peggy has done but really I would like to see it. In the very least can I see an diet analysis maybe its around somewhere. MY diets analysis is posted at the top of my diet page in my website. All this show me stuff is JUST SILLY !!! I ask where was it all made who regulates it. My answer, "Where is all the food in your pantry made", now they've got me thinking grabbing cans out of it bags of chips to track down the who's where's and why's.. Have way in the middle of it I'm jerking my head up going HEY WAIT A SEC!!! They distracted me. I asked a question I want an answer .. I've now been given as much as I've been given so I guess I'll make my conclusion tomorrow ... but just for future ref don't answer a question with a question its rude lol. and mean!! Darn so tired shouldn't even be online anymore


~Lauren

Lauren's Animal Kingdom
*Website is down temporarily should be back up by November!*
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079620
03/02/11 01:05 AM
03/02/11 01:05 AM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 504
nc, usa
meri Offline
Glider Lover
meri  Offline
Glider Lover

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 504
nc, usa
roflmao

Ok, Lauren, we needed that smile


wave Meri & :grey: :leu:
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079627
03/02/11 01:13 AM
03/02/11 01:13 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 343
Northern VA.
GliderGuyVA Offline
Glider Lover
GliderGuyVA  Offline
Glider Lover

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 343
Northern VA.
I find it funny how people "want to see the results" yet they are comfotable with products that have never been researched. Yet many of you feed your Gliders the HPW diet which was created by the same person that created the HPW plus/complete. Really? Is this all you can come up with? Oh wait I forgot, the VK issue as well. I highly doubt he has anything to do with this and if he does? Good for him for trying to help Gliders well being.

Like I said before, sit back, relax and wait. Do or don't buy it. It's your choice, but going on and on and beating a dead horse about it aint gonna help.

PS. If you want to see what Peggy is saying then go to LGG and check it out smile


Slave to:
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Four - Dogs
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Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079629
03/02/11 01:15 AM
03/02/11 01:15 AM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 29
missouri
shadow_ Offline
In Pouch
shadow_  Offline
In Pouch

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 29
missouri
thanks gliderdad i was thinking the same thing but it wouldnt have come out that well lol.


2 sugar glider brothers named Rune and Vash
sugar glider and a Halloween addict :D
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079632
03/02/11 01:23 AM
03/02/11 01:23 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
Laurens_Babies Offline
Glider Addict
Laurens_Babies  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,570
Kansas City, MO
These questions I'm asking Peggy I ask of ANY diet when I found a diet where my questions were answered there I went!


~Lauren

Lauren's Animal Kingdom
*Website is down temporarily should be back up by November!*
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Laurens_Babies] #1079653
03/02/11 02:49 AM
03/02/11 02:49 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,264
Northeast U.S.
angelic4296 Offline
Glider Addict
angelic4296  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,264
Northeast U.S.
Originally Posted By: Laurens_Babies
Jess I would be happy to tell you more about the diet I feed but the answer to all those questions is yes. The maker of my diet I discussed a long time with about my diet before I switch, yes I can track all of the products in mine. The maker made this diet more for her personal use it isn't a diet to manufacturer and sell its based pretty heavily in the belief easier isn't always better. Its not popular because it is pretty complicated and the maker did not ask to have it published on the website but yup when I asked her she cited all her sources for her research she did, she worked step by step with her vet and other's while creating it.
Then Lauren, I apologize to you on that point. For me, like I said, diets aren't my forte (for starters, I can barely do simple math like addition and subtraction, so calculating ratios and all that....it befuddles me ha). Maybe that's why I'm happy Peggy put this diet out. For starters, I trust the well-being of my gliders' nutritional needs in Peggy's hands any day of the week. If she says she has researched this and has had the help of nutritionists and vets, I believe her and trust that the sources she has chosen to use are experts in their fields. Maybe I'm lazy, but it makes it easy for me with a diet like this, knowing I don't have to worry about the Ca:P ratios; it's already built in for me.

And please stop acting like I'm being all big and bad aggressive about this I've noticed you seem to take all this way too personally and to heart. It was never my intention to imply that you were being "all big and bad aggressive." I simply think that some of what is being asked is a bit nitpicky. I have no idea how many diet threads I've been through since 2007. Peggy posted very publicly about her diet selling it we've her the plus' and now your hearing my caution out to others about it. I believe it or not am not against these changes or really against this diet as a whole. Your asking me to "stop" but the truth is NO ONE is stopping the pro's the con's the inbetweens. Your certainly not standing down you've been in here being Peggy's mouth piece and if I'm not mistaken you've been bouncing around on GC LGG and GG for days defending this diet .. I'm not saying your wrong just pointing out I don't see you "stopping" anytime soon. I think calling me Peggy's mouthpiece is a bit harsh and unfair. Peggy has never ever asked me to say one single word of what I've said in this thread - therefore, I'm not her mouthpiece. I've said everything I have on my own because I think this diet is being put under the microscope way too harshly. It seems people have 1,001 concerns about things that have never been asked of any other diet at all and I'm just a bit confused as to why that is. And you're right, I am defending this diet because I think it's one of the biggest advancements we've ever witnessed in terms of the dietary and nutritional needs of sugar gliders; this hasn't been done before. I might have been a big strong in my opinions but I think they've been fair and objective. I haven't asked who is funding her or why she is naming her diet *HPW* plus cause I know how that talk would go. I'm asking valid question I have the right to ask. I never said you were the one asking about funding at all. I know that question didn't come from you.


Lauren, it was never my intention to create tension or hostility between us. I've always respected you as a glider owner and knowledgable person when it comes to our babies. I'm just feeling like Peggy and her diet are being unfairly questioned and attacked in a few ways, and I'm having trouble understanding why. I guess I wish that in a perfect world that people would trust that Peggy as a GOOD and NOBLE person would never A) deceive people about her diet and it's contents and B) know that she would never put a product on the market that was in any way deterimental or bad for gliders. My heart is in this, you're right. I love Peggy and I love her dedication and all the good she has done for our community. I apologize if you felt attacked.


Jess

2 spoiled gliders, Gizzy (6/05) and Ruthie (?/05) <3

Please consider rescuing first!

Please remember to complete your surveys at http://www.sugargroup.org/ - help better the lives of gliders everywhere smile
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: Trigger] #1079654
03/02/11 02:51 AM
03/02/11 02:51 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,264
Northeast U.S.
angelic4296 Offline
Glider Addict
angelic4296  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,264
Northeast U.S.
Wow, totally off topic, but I'm amazed I actually got that red typing to work - I'm usually so bad at that hahaha....ok, back on topic....


Jess

2 spoiled gliders, Gizzy (6/05) and Ruthie (?/05) <3

Please consider rescuing first!

Please remember to complete your surveys at http://www.sugargroup.org/ - help better the lives of gliders everywhere smile
Re: HOLY CRACKERS AMERICAN HPW's [Re: gliderdad79] #1079666
03/02/11 03:49 AM
03/02/11 03:49 AM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,224
NC
GliderHappy81 Offline
Glider Addict
GliderHappy81  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,224
NC
Originally Posted By: gliderdad79

This diet is different cause one of it's biggest selling point is it's been stated it has been researched, with scientific data collected, etc. To me if those documents and statistics cannot be released yet, than this shouldn't be advertised that way.



Toothpaste is sold with "#1 Dentist recommended brand", "9 out of 10 dentist recommend(fill in product name here)", Medicine is sold with "Recommended by Doctors" etc, etc. Same thing with dog food, cat food, and so on.

Who are the Dentists that makes a product #1? How many Dentist does it take to do that anyway? Is there a list somewhere with all their names? Who are the 9 Dentists that recommend Crest toothpaste? Who is the one Dentist that doesn't? And why the heck doesn't he recommend it too? What is in toothpaste exactly? Does anyone bother look that up, or does it not matter because its not being sold by Peggy?

What about the Doctors? The vets? Where is the list with their names? The ingredients?

I really don't mean any disrespect but I have seen others say this same thing and it really doesn't make any since to me. Of course, I just recently learned what "vlog" is (I am so behind on these things these days. lol) so maybe its just age setting in. tounge I just think if people are going to be so picky about this, why are they not looking all this up with everything else?


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