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Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Srlb] #800408
06/29/09 01:46 PM
06/29/09 01:46 PM

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monluvspagen
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smile

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Srlb] #800436
06/29/09 02:55 PM
06/29/09 02:55 PM
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Posts: 734
Jupiter, Florida
SugaWhit Offline
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Interesting conversation and great information!

What is the confirmed consistant life span of albinos/cream's? Or is it only the albino's that suffer the lower lifespan? What about confirmed diseases and problems?
That would hinder my wanting them, as I like my pets healthy and happy.

This is all new to me with the colors in general, but I could see the line of thought as far as the health.

I think if the lines are bred well enough out and then carefully watched it would be like any other animal that you are breeding for a specific trait.

However, as I am not intimatly familar with the genetics that causes the Albino coloration, my opnion is based soley on my on past experiences with the horses.
Whit


Mom to (heaven help me!) Three pairs of wonderful Glider kids-
Nero :rtmo:
Cupid a :cream: & Ceres :rtmo: +1 boy oop
Warbuck :plat: & Lysia :rtmo: & Clarissa with Twins oop each!
http://palmbeachgliders.webs.com/
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: SugaWhit] #800442
06/29/09 03:04 PM
06/29/09 03:04 PM

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monluvspagen
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I do not think there is enough albinos or info on albinos to do any long term research on them which to me is a sign.

If there is not a lot of them, there is a reason for that. Like I said before, it is not natural for anything to be born albino...

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: ] #800444
06/29/09 03:05 PM
06/29/09 03:05 PM

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monluvspagen
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What is your experience with albino horses?

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: ] #800460
06/29/09 03:56 PM
06/29/09 03:56 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
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Originally Posted By: monluvspagen
What is your experience with albino horses?


There is no such thing as an albino horse.

In my research about the albino gene I remember reading that there are no albino horses(or, at least, they don't CALL them albinos...). The albino gene is recessive, which means that BOTH parents must have the gene. However, in horses, the "Albino" gene is not recessive and only one parent needs the gene. So, they are not considered albinos because of how the gene works. A "real" albino has a recessive gene.


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Guerita135] #800464
06/29/09 04:09 PM
06/29/09 04:09 PM

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monluvspagen
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Oh I was just asking because she said she had experiences with horses so I didn't know if she meant albino horses or horses in general... I know nothing about horses, so I was asking to see if it was relevant to this thread with the albino trait.

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: ] #800490
06/29/09 04:55 PM
06/29/09 04:55 PM
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 734
Jupiter, Florida
SugaWhit Offline
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Sorry, I should have clarified better. I have No experience with the Albino gene.
I do have extensive experience in the horses, and in that way, breeding for specific traits, color, etc.
That is what I was speaking of when I said

"I think if the lines are bred well enough out and then carefully watched it would be like any other animal that you are breeding for a specific trait."

I am not a fan of inbreeding in general, as I breed minis, and I have seen far to many deformed and ill foals.

I just think that the blanket statement that no one should attempt to breed for a specific color trait like Albino- When, as of yet, no one can tell me that they or the creams have shown poor health or disease, was a maybe a little unfair.

I am extremely interested in this topic, as I think the cream's are about the prettiest looking asides the Mosaics, and I would love to have one or a pair.

However, if poor health is the case, I do not wish to be a part of it, as first and foremost, I want healthy and happy animals.
It's the same reason I refuse to breed the super small minis. Many have had excellent luck, and Everyone wants the smallest of the small minis.
But I just can't stand the risk of horrible dystocias, dwarfs, and off bites. Also I show the minis, and the smallest just are not as competative out there.
However the general first time buyer for a mini wants a small one. It's about the health and happiness of the animal first and foremost.
Whit


Last edited by SugaWhit; 06/29/09 04:56 PM. Reason: I am unable to spell!

Mom to (heaven help me!) Three pairs of wonderful Glider kids-
Nero :rtmo:
Cupid a :cream: & Ceres :rtmo: +1 boy oop
Warbuck :plat: & Lysia :rtmo: & Clarissa with Twins oop each!
http://palmbeachgliders.webs.com/
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Guerita135] #800496
06/29/09 04:59 PM
06/29/09 04:59 PM
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 734
Jupiter, Florida
SugaWhit Offline
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Jupiter, Florida
Originally Posted By: Guerita135
Originally Posted By: monluvspagen
What is your experience with albino horses?


There is no such thing as an albino horse.

In my research about the albino gene I remember reading that there are no albino horses(or, at least, they don't CALL them albinos...). The albino gene is recessive, which means that BOTH parents must have the gene. However, in horses, the "Albino" gene is not recessive and only one parent needs the gene. So, they are not considered albinos because of how the gene works. A "real" albino has a recessive gene.


As far as I know you are correct. I have never seen an albino horse- we have colors that look similar, but they never have the red eyes and therefore Not albinos.
My other question is lab rats. (Which I do have experience with sadly)
All my lab rats that I ever had to work with were albinos. They were healthy, happy, and long lived animals. The only tumors and diseases I saw were human caused. But perhaps that is a just my own small awareness. I did not breed for those traits, I was just handling the animals.
Whit


Mom to (heaven help me!) Three pairs of wonderful Glider kids-
Nero :rtmo:
Cupid a :cream: & Ceres :rtmo: +1 boy oop
Warbuck :plat: & Lysia :rtmo: & Clarissa with Twins oop each!
http://palmbeachgliders.webs.com/
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: SugaWhit] #800499
06/29/09 05:04 PM
06/29/09 05:04 PM

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monluvspagen
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Ok thanks! I understand. The way I see it is in the wild, the albinos are pretty much never seen, either because it doesn't happen, OR they are killed. I beleive about everyone on this site agrees that imbreeding is not good if it can be stopped lol always promoting that males be neutered. smile As I said before, I do not think there has been enough research on the Albinos due to the fact there is not many at all. Most research needs to be done on a large number to even be close to valid.

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: ] #800501
06/29/09 05:07 PM
06/29/09 05:07 PM

M
monluvspagen
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monluvspagen
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I do not know about rats, or even how they became albino because they started experimenting on them sooo long ago. But even normal pet rats die from tumors so who knows with them. I know for a fact the albino mice/rats would not live in the wild very long though because it would stand out. Rats have been through so much and have been around a lot longer than marsupials so I have no clue. That is interesting, I was thinking about that myself.

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: ] #800548
06/29/09 07:06 PM
06/29/09 07:06 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 841
Houston, Texas
gliderboy4life Offline
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The creme-inos seem to be very healthy. The first ones born are now about 7 years old and are still producing and healthy.

As for Albinos, the ones I have seem are very healthy and strong animals(from appearance). I do know that there can be other issues. Until one passes away and a necropsy is done, we can't say to much. I do not know if the few that have passed had a necropsy done or not.


Tyler Cleckley
www.GliderBoyGliders.com
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: gliderboy4life] #800621
06/29/09 10:22 PM
06/29/09 10:22 PM

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monluvspagen
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monluvspagen
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Well I will stick to the natural stuff. I hope one day we will know the answers behind these rare beautiful albinos.

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: ] #800704
06/30/09 05:45 AM
06/30/09 05:45 AM

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Leyna
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People keep saying albinos are unnatural, which I don't understand. The albino coloration is considered a mutation, but it is a naturally occurring mutation and appears in almost every species. Also, mutation is not a bad word. All mutation means is that there is a change in the information... Heck, blue eyes in human was a mutation at one point in time.

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: ] #800727
06/30/09 07:52 AM
06/30/09 07:52 AM
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Posts: 4,061
Mesa, AZ
konotashi Offline
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I think people are saying it's unnatural because albinos normally tend to have health issues, and there's no way that they would survive in the wild, but if you think about it, neither would leus and probably many mosaics.

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: konotashi] #839642
09/17/09 03:58 PM
09/17/09 03:58 PM
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Posts: 1,855
Orlando, FL
Tish84 Offline
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Does anyone here own an albino? Just out of curiousity.

I agree with those here about the eyes which is why I got a leu. Although lately I've been interested in creaminos. I hear they have ruby and not red eyes.


TISH

Lana (Siberian Husky)
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Bunny
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Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Tish84] #839654
09/17/09 04:06 PM
09/17/09 04:06 PM
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Posts: 3,753
Florida
LabNGliderMom Offline
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LabNGliderMom  Offline
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there are pics of all the color variations on the SPIN site, Tish, if you want to see them all...

http://www.spin4suggies.com/Color_Variation_Description.html


Julie
Hubby: George
Kids: Ayla & Michael
Grandsons: Trysten, Dayton, KJ & Nathyn
The Zoo: Midnight, Severe & Nala - Claude, Pixie, Tippy & Chili - Scout & Soluna, Theo & Deegie

http://hammockhavenpetsplus.com


Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Srlb] #839666
09/17/09 04:21 PM
09/17/09 04:21 PM

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rwilson
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Kris this makes me miss Galileo.

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: LabNGliderMom] #839891
09/17/09 09:40 PM
09/17/09 09:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 841
Houston, Texas
gliderboy4life Offline
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Houston, Texas
Originally Posted By: LabNGliderMom
there are pics of all the color variations on the SPIN site, Tish, if you want to see them all...

http://www.spin4suggies.com/Color_Variation_Description.html



That's my little girl, the Albino!!!!!


Tyler Cleckley
www.GliderBoyGliders.com
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: gliderboy4life] #839895
09/17/09 09:47 PM
09/17/09 09:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 207
Louisiana
Iceguru Offline
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albinism

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Albinism

Please people read don't spout ...... for lack of a better word randomness


I know, but I still
Believe in ignorance as my best defense
So go on, wreck me
Funny how I carry on, and not be taken over
Will not roll over on anyone,
cuz anyone would stand up on my side
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Iceguru] #839911
09/17/09 10:04 PM
09/17/09 10:04 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 13,748
Vincennes, IN, USA
suggiemom1980 Offline
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I'd rather read "spouting" on here than try to understand wilkipedia. I prefer plain English. That other stuff goes over my poor befuzzled head! LOL


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Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: suggiemom1980] #839923
09/17/09 10:33 PM
09/17/09 10:33 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,855
Orlando, FL
Tish84 Offline
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Orlando, FL
Wow, their eyes do look a lot more red and piercing.


TISH

Lana (Siberian Husky)
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Bunny
:bb: :leu: :wfb: :rtmo: :cream:
Lily Fawkes Kingsley Ice Regulus Romeo Mimkin Saturn Jupiter Taiyou Kat Julianna

Glide Free My little Lily And Ice (Miss you every day)


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Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Iceguru] #841053
09/20/09 05:01 AM
09/20/09 05:01 AM
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New Jersey
JillMarie Offline
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back to the albino topic....

I am interested in albino animals. Interesting to be sure.

I HAVE seen a horse with pink eyes when I was a preteen living in PA. He was owned by one of our neighboring farmers who was very old (the farmer), well....actually he said the horse was pretty old too. I have seen many horses with blue eyes as well. But this one was definately pink. the farmer had to be careful to not leave him in the sun too long as his ears would burn.

perhaps incredibly rare. But I did see one. time frame....hummmmmm, about 34 years ago, horse was over 15 years old...so perhaps through breeding over the last 100 years, the albino gene has been "bred out"? and this one was just a throwback? as an albino horse isnt "practical"?

does anyone on here have an albino glider?

albinoism in nature is rare, only because that animal would stand out. so whether a prey animal or predatory animal they would be at a disadvantage in the survival game. I have a story (in a magazine)about an albino hummingbird that whenever it came to the yard/feeder the other hummingbirds would gang up on it and chase it away. Now I know a bit about hummingbirds and they can be very territorial about their feeders. But we are talking about a yard with mutliple feeders that would have 5-15 birdies at a time at the feeders, and the only time they acted aggressive was when the albino was there. perhaps they knew he "stood out" to predators and was endangering them all? This is not the first time I have read of animals "shunning" albinos.


:grey: Bosom Buddy Creations:grey:
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Remember that God Loves You!
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: JillMarie] #841057
09/20/09 05:25 AM
09/20/09 05:25 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,855
Orlando, FL
Tish84 Offline
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Orlando, FL
That's so sad....(hummingbirds)
I would embrace him and feed him more than his mean counterparts.


TISH

Lana (Siberian Husky)
2 Turtles
Bunny
:bb: :leu: :wfb: :rtmo: :cream:
Lily Fawkes Kingsley Ice Regulus Romeo Mimkin Saturn Jupiter Taiyou Kat Julianna

Glide Free My little Lily And Ice (Miss you every day)


www.fancysuggies.com
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Guerita135] #841717
09/20/09 11:58 PM
09/20/09 11:58 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 9,173
Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
Judie Offline
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Judie  Offline
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Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
Nicole...

Is it possible that the gene for Cremino may be Simple Recessive-CoDominant to Albinoism?

I know it is possible for Hets to carry both genes (t- and t+) and also t- or t+ only. There is one Albino t- that is only producing Hets. His partner is a Cremino t+. This seems to indicate that this Albino t- does not carry the t+ gene and there are "no" Cremino colored offspring.

Now after rereading my post... I am confused. roflmao

Last edited by Judie; 09/21/09 12:17 AM.
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Judie] #843412
09/24/09 01:17 AM
09/24/09 01:17 AM

K
KristopherDeRose
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KristopherDeRose
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I will have an albino for sale soon

Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: ] #843424
09/24/09 01:49 AM
09/24/09 01:49 AM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 433
Iowa
Akane Offline
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Iowa
True albinos rarely survive. It's lethal in most animals. Pink eyed whites by many aren't considered true albinos and thus the reason they get called pinked eyed whites or pink eyed dilutes instead. Don't ask me why. I prefer not to get into such info because I don't like albinos. I've worked with and bred lots of animals from very small to very large and I actually took some genetics classes but mostly on horses and other large animals. The small animal genetics I researched myself. In my experience the closer you get to an albino the more health issues you have. The closest thing in horses would probably be perlinos and cremellos which are horses with 2 copies of the palomino or cream gene. These horses do sunburn easy and tend to have more sensitive skin and allergies. I knew one that couldn't be turned out to pasture because despite mowing and replanting frequently too many weeds grew that would irritate his nose and legs. He constantly had peeling scabs and rashes half way up his face and to just below his knees on every leg. He also couldn't stand fly spray. He'd start stomping, twitching, and dancing around whenever he got sprayed and then he'd develop lumps. It didn't matter what type was used. The owner could only use expensive herbal sprays. That's an extreme example but it's just one of many.

I'll accept minor alterations to color and some I love like mosaics, black beauties, and white tail tips but when you start getting really strong dilution genes or stacking several dilution genes together to get as light of animal as possible you nearly always in every species get more health problems. Personally I'd much rather people came up with more brown and dark colors instead. Can we get a solid black glider? I'll settle for solid chocolate brown.

I just remembered there was a study done on gerbils that tested the color pigment in their brains and then other brain chemicals. They actually found a correlation between coat/skin color and changes in brain activity. It was a very minor difference and we argued on the board whether it actually had any impact on an animal's final personality. Nothing ever came of the debate but it was very interesting. I wish I still had the link to at least the study. Color genes may have more impact than we think.

Last edited by Akane; 09/24/09 01:53 AM.

RIP sora :grey:

RIP Ryuu :grey:
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Srlb] #847878
10/04/09 11:51 AM
10/04/09 11:51 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 118
Skokie, IL
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jeff866 Offline
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Skokie, IL
Monika,

Can you define how you used the term "natural"?

Albinos do occur naturally. They probably will not survive long in the wild, because a predator will be able to see them easier.


Let's Educate Chicago!

Jeff866@gmail.com
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: jeff866] #847899
10/04/09 12:23 PM
10/04/09 12:23 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 22,748
80 acres of paradise in KS
Dancing Offline
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Posts: 22,748
80 acres of paradise in KS
Albinos can happen in all species of animals (though may not have been seen in some). To me, while "natural" they are still freaks of nature. In MY opinion, it is a genetic screw up that should not purposely be bred for. There is just the potential for to many other health issues in albinos.

So I'll never have one (not even a free one, has nothing to do with money to me). But there are those that are facinated by the eye color.


620-704-9109
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But I'd of had to miss the dance


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Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: Dancing] #848082
10/04/09 07:42 PM
10/04/09 07:42 PM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 118
Skokie, IL
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jeff866 Offline
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Posts: 118
Skokie, IL
I never saw an albino ant. grin

Last edited by jeff866; 10/04/09 07:43 PM.

Let's Educate Chicago!

Jeff866@gmail.com
Re: Why is no one interested in albinos? [Re: jeff866] #848088
10/04/09 07:49 PM
10/04/09 07:49 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,402
Michigan
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gliderma Offline
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Michigan
The other ants probably do away with them if they ever do get produced, as it is not a "natural" look.


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