Yeah...
If you saw my post about cold paws, you know that my gliders went to the vet on the 14th, at 3pm to see what the bubbly sound was. Everything was on the up and up then.

Well, this just shows you what a matter of HOURS can do.. and how one minute a glider might look a-ok, and the next, not so much...

Got 'em home, put 'em in their cage, they curled up in the pouch for a nap. My male was acting off, but I figured okay, he's stressed. So around..11..11:30-ish.. I went to check the gliders. Girls hopping all over, boys curled up, and appeared to be having trouble walking. I watched him a little more closely, and...uh oh, he's dragging his left hind leg. I mean, he'll sort of limp on it occasionally, but it's obvious that there is a problem.

So, I call up the vet. She tells me try to get some food in him, separate him into a smaller cage, away from his buddy. Her concern was that his buddy (who is smaller than him) might be stopping him from eating. She mentioned that it was likely that he got caught on something, and advised me to try hand feeding him and get him in first thing in the AM. She was too far away at the moment to come in.

Well, me being me...I was a wreck. I called the local e-vet in tears. So much so that the lady over the phone could hardly understand me. I think that this worked to my benefit though, as the vet there (who mainly worked on cats & dogs) decided that he would help me. He did research while I was on the way, and consulted with one of the vets off of the list on here via telephone (which, slips my mind).

When I got there, he noted that my boy weighed 60 grams, which is 2 grams up from when he was weighed on the 1st. And that he is very active (in the sense that he did a bit of a race around the room trying to get away from the vet -- he's only hand tame when he wants to be) and alert.

On my paper from him he wrote: "mild paresis of left pelvic limb with a moderately flaccid left hind paw. Able to advance the left hind leg but not as readily as the right hind and he is not able to grasp with the left hind paw. No palpable spinal alignment deviation is detected."

He suspects that it might be either
1. a possible spinal injury on one side
2. sprained left hind leg without spinal injury
or
3. the beginning stages of HLP, despite what he agreed was a very balanced diet (BML -- but, it is touch to know which glider is eating what exactly)

He gave him various meds that the vet that he consulted with approved of doing.

Recommended giving small amounts of fruit baby foods, yogurt, chicken baby food and honey over the next few hours until he's eating.. I've given him some honey, which he had a little of. He doesn't seem too interested in eating other things at the moment.

And, of course, to call my exotic vet in the morning. I am planning to just take him in.. My exotic vet has already given me permission to drop him off first thing in the morning -- though I probably won't get him back until 5 or 6pm

I'm keeping close watch on him, but he's not really doing much. He's alert though -- crabs anytime I make a sound.


A few questions..
What else do you think this could be???? Are his guesses appropriate??? And if it IS the beginnings of HLP, can he be saved??? If it's a spinal injury, can he be healed???

And, praying that he makes a full recovery, how long can he be away from his mate but still be put right back in the cage? Like, I say I have to keep him out of the cage with her for a week.. would I be able to put him right back in after or would I need to do the intro period?


ETA: Went to check him.. He is awake. When he crawls on the ceiling of the cage, he is letting his left hind leg just sort of.... hang loose. He only holds on with his other 3 paws. He did take a big long drink of water though, on his own. And, he ate a bit of a plain yogurt drop. I know, plain yogurt drops were not on the vets list of things to feed, but my exotic vet recommended just trying to get him to eat SOMETHING to keep his blood sugar up. I put the plain yogurt drop on a hanging toy, he climbed up and got it, eating most.

I have the BML in there, so hopefully he will start to eat that soon.

Poor baby I will keep him in my prayers. I am glad that the vet you saw did some homework before you got there.

Yes, I was too. They told me to wait a few moments for him to call me back before bringing him in, just so he could try and familiarize himself to see if he could handle the case. He called back within 10 minutes and seemed very knowledgeable, and he's definitely willing to learn. He gave me the option of waiting to see Dr. Lucas tomorrow or getting him in for an e-visit that night.

..I must've sounded like a 2 year old on the phone. I just mumbled, "please help him? Please?" To which, he of course said yes. I was thrilled -- most e-vets around here won't even try.

Glad he did research. I'll keep you and your little guy in my thoughts and prayers.

I would say these possible diagnosis are good.

I have extensive experience with fractures/injuries to the legs, to the spine (resulting in paralysis) and with HLP.

When you go to your vet, make SURE you get x-rays. You will not be able to make an accurate diagnosis without x-rays. If the x-rays are clear, make SURE you get fecals re-tested and a UA. Sudden onset HLP usually affects BOTH legs, so it is most likely that you are looking at an injury. But, if not, sudden onset HLP is usually the result of a bacterial or parasitic infection.

The care you give after the vet visit will be very crucial. I'm happy to lend some advice from my experiences.

I'm sending you a PM with a link to some more information.

Please call me to discuss this further. My number is in my signature. My cell number will be in the PM.

Wow! What cruddy luck!!
It's weird that you were worried about the bubbling in the girl that turned out to be nothing and then immeadiatly get socked with a foot problem in the boy which is obviously SOMEthing.
I don't know much about much but I would agree with Val that it seems more like an injury and not HLP. I am always worried when I watch my girls flinging themselves around the cage that one of them is going to hurt a foot or hand. They jump with such force on those cage bars and their feet are sooo tiny, all they have to do is slip a little....
Does the foot or leg look puffy??
I would get the x-rays done but just hope that it is a bruised foot or small sprain.

The injury is a very, very bad fracture. As in, extremely. And in a bad spot. vet says it's going to be veryyyy hard to treat, and that treating fractures like this rarely work.

Can they amputate? Would that be more successful?

My thoughts exactly.

Wow, you've found a gem of a vet who was willing to learn and consult with other vets to assist in your time of need. It's heartwarming to see that dedication is still out there.

The key is to of course get to the cause of the problem, but it does seem like there may be options to keep your little boy alive and healthy. If it turns out to be the best option, there are gliders who have amputated hands, feet, arms, legs, and it's amazing how they adapt.

In addition to keeping him in a smaller age, you should maybe pad the bottom of it with fleece so that if he should lose his grip, he'll have a softer landing. If you keep the cages close together, I don't think you'll need to worry about going through the introductions again. You can still swap pouches periodically as well, so they get an even stronger whiff of one another's scents. Or, depending on the sizes of your cages, perhaps you can put one cage inside the other. If he has open wounds, you don't want to do this because you don't want his cage mate to groom the area.

The BML does have plenty of calcium in it. You'll be able to see how much he does eat on his own being in his own cage. You can also try hand feeding him the BML as a licky treat.

I don't know anything about spinal injuries, but if he is going to the bathroom fine, perhaps this is not the cause? Or maybe it's not as bad as it could be? It sounds like your glider-knowledgeable vet is good, but don't forget there are other vets who will do phone consults with your vet, and collectively, they may be able to brainstorm something wonderful.

Sending prayers your way.

Oh no. I'm sorry to hear about your little man. I say that if fixing the broken leg will be to risky and/or stressful for your little guy, I would go with amputation. I have a friend you has a glider with an arm removed up to the shoulder blade and he does just fine. And your little guy has his cagemate so no worries about grooming with him missing one of his combed back feet. I hope your glider heals up well! Sending many prayer to you and your glider boy.

When my little girl Spryte broke her leg, I took her to Dr. Teresa Bradley. Xrays were done and we discussed what to do. My first thought was it was going to have to be amputated (back leg) but Dr. Bradley suggested if I was willing to let her try to pin the leg first. She said that if she amputates it first and something goes wrong, there wouldn't be much more she could do but if she pinned it and it didn't work, we still had the option to amputate. We decided on pinning it. And it was successful. Spryte got to keep her let and truthfully, within 24 hours I had a hard time keeping that girl still. 48 hours after she was all over her cage like nothing had happened.

Pinning the leg IS possible though has not been done but a few times.

Dr. Bradley will consult with your vet also.

Just explore all options before making a decision.

Due to the location of the fracture -- strongest part of his body, says the vet, she doesn't think amputating it would do any good. She thinks it would be putting him through more than he can take.

Oh no I'm so sorry to hear this.

PLEASE call me. I have worked with gliders with multiple severe fractures in multiple legs at one time. The leg CAN be spared and regain functional use. PLEASE give me a call.... I just don't have time to write it all out for you.

Val, I'll try to give you a call tonight. I'll PM you my number if I am unable to. I'm going to try and get him settled in as he just got back.

He's in an e-collar, which the vet is suggesting to leave on until he goes for a follow up appointment, unless he manages to wiggle his way out (in which case, I'm supposed to call her). She splinted the leg. He's not a happy little guy by any means.... She did manage to get some foods into him though, and has given him various medications for the pain, and to fight against possible infection. She did say that it went better than she thought, and that he takes his meds well. I will be giving him meds 2 times a day for at least a week.

Unless things get worse, he is into the vet again on the 22nd at 9am.

The vets main concern is that he will self-mutilate, tear the bandage off, or that the bone will go through the skin. She is still really stressing that she has not seen this work often, but today went better than she had expected (we're nowhere near out of the woods yet though).

If all goes well, she is expecting to see at least some signs of healing at the next visit, though I guess it could take at least 2 weeks to see signs of healing.


She is wanting him to be separated from my other glider in a small cat carrier, as this will limit his ability to climb. I have put in a toy ball that he likes to push around (vet approved it -- thank you chattrbabe for sending the ball. He really does love it), a lot of little fleece blankies, and a pouch laying on the floor of the carrier (vet approved). She says that, if it heals, she is expecting 2 to 4 weeks (depending on the healing) before he can be placed back with the other one, which brings up concerns for both she and I about how the gliders will react to each other when placed back together.

I am still quite terrified that nothing will work.. but I guess one step at a time.

What about supervised supervision with another glider. I had to do that for over a year with my guys. I would put them both in my shirt as many hours in the day as I could when they would at least sleep together and I could feel every move they made.
Also, you have to BREATH about this. Animals can sense stress and you do not want to stress him out anymore that he might be already. Just love on the boy, radiate your love and peace towards him
I hope he heals up nicely and you can put this behind you. Believe me I know, things happen with our little ones....

I am so sorry this is happening to you guys!!
I will be wishing and hoping and praying every day for your little guy!!

Even in his own little cage, he can still be right next to the other cage and you can still swap pouches, yes? That will help as they can still smell and hear and see one another.

I presume your cat carrier also has 1/2" bar spacing or openings? If not, you'll need a different arrangement.

Sending prayers your way for his speedy recovery.

Katty, the spacing on the front of it is a little more than an inch, but it has cross bars. I do not think he will be able to get loose with the cross bars, and his e-collar on.

ETA: I have spoken with Val and have received some good advice. I have plans of remaining in contact with her, as well as with my vet.

eat?? And when I can't really hold him, due to his injury??? I am afraid to handle him with his leg being fractured.

I was told to try Hawaiian Delight or yogurt, but he won't eat a thing --- not even his favorite treat -- honey.

I NEED to get meds into him, of course, but how in the world am I supposed to do this? I have seen Suz' page on how to do this, but like I said, holding him is tough.

If you have any tips, please share.

Okay, since 13 minutes ago, I got some of the baby food turkey out and put his pain meds in that. He ate about half of it... will try more in a few moments. I am going to pick up some varieties of baby food today. Any recommendations that gliders usually love??

I am sorry you are having such problems getting the meds into him. any of the fruit baby food should be good. mine will eat almost anything I give them so I cant help there. I sent ya a PM earlier. At this point I would be willing to try almost anything to get the meds into him. Try the natural maple syrup if he wont take honey, or even agave nectar, you might also try those naked juices, they are typically pretty yummy. sometimes something different MAY spark an interest. I know corn is a no no because of the horible ratio but if he REALLY likes corn I would take a piece of corn, use a toothpick and scoop out some of the inside kernal, put the meds into the piece of corn and see if you can get him to take it that way. worth a try and one piece of corn wont hurt him. at this point like I said I would feed them almost anything.

Did I send ya a cookie sample? if I did try soaking the meds into one of those if he likes it, if didnt...PM me and I will send ya one asap to try.

still praying for you...

I will send you a PM, Jill.

Have you (or anyone else) have any ideas on how to clean him up? Would just an unscented babywipe work? He decided to take a roll in his BML and is covered in it. He's an e-collar, and..flexible as it is, he just can't clean himself.

Another question: If I can get him to find a food that he'll eat at any time, is it acceptable to put all three medications in at once?

Val, should you read this, I'll be sending you a PM on this, but I won't be at home today. I will be leaving my healthy glider in my mothers care, and taking little boy with me. I am going to buy some Hawaiin delight as you suggested last night, and see how that goes.

I've been giving Spaz meds for the past week and he won't take it in any food. He smells it in the food and then won't touch it.

I've been doing the technique as listed on Suz's page where really the only real pressure put on him is on the sides of his head. He has an injury on his shoulder as well as the mutilation after the neuter.

My husband and I give him the medicine and we got it down to only having to hold him for about 5 seconds.

I also use the no water needed soap for sensitive skin. I want to say it's Lubriderm but I'm not real sure. This cleans him up fairly well when he takes spills through his food. He can't reach the area, so I'm not too worried about him ingesting any.

Mixing the meds I wouldn't think is a problem if you can give it to him all at the same time allbeit in separate syringes. If it can be mixed in his belly why not out?

Good luck. I understand the frustration with giving meds. We tried so many different things without look.

Take Care,

I would try to hold him when you aren't giving meds to him so you can get used to holding him in that position. If his leg is fractured I imagine he isn't using that leg to struggle, so you don't need to touch it at all it's just a matter of figuring out how to keep a large human hand around a little glider for a few moments. I know that sounds so easy to say but is different in practice!

For washing him up I'd use a warm damp cloth - not soaked, but just damp enough to get the icky off him. Then keep him in a dry pouch to warm up and make sure he doesn't get chilled.

Keep your head up you are doing a fantastic job in a difficult situation!

I get meds in my little Dexter by mixing it with a little bite of banana flavored pudding. He hasn't turned it down yet.

Tried the Hawaiin Delight baby food -- no luck. I picked up a bunch of other baby foods so I will try those later. Hopefully one will work. He just won't eat a thing.


My worry is that he'll continue to not eat, and to spit out everything he's forcefed. Obviously without eating, his leg can't heal (among many other things.)

How about scrambled eggs??